| Please can we have some passion? 08:55 - Mar 7 with 10196 views | TalkingSutty |
Time to play the broken record, put it on continual play for two weeks. Local derbies used to be the ones you really anticipated but under Keith Hill they often turn into miserable, often passionless affairs. Listening to his interviews prior to the games and then watching the majority of our displays forms the base of my opinion, he just doesn't do local derbies.
Last seasons game at Boundary Park is still raw in the memory, Andy Ritchie's views, both before and after the game on commentary showed his dismay at how we didn't seem up for the game (listening to Hills pre- match interview) despite it being a local derby, I agreed with him. As a supporters that game was pretty embarrassing, a terrible performance in a game that had us on the edge of the Play Offs.
Oldham are probably the worst team I have seen this season at Spotland and apart from Alessanders open goal miss we didn't really lay a glove on them. Showing them too much respect when they were there for the taking. God knows why?
Wigan and Bury at home this season,again the manager took the passion out of the fixtures and seemed hesitant to see the importance of the fixture to the supporters,he treated the games as just another fixture and we ended up with two insipid displays lacking in any attacking intent. Very easy games for both Wigan and Bury. In fact that's how Hilly approaches local derbies which results in the opposition seemingly being more up for the game and we play on the back foot as the opposition take the game by the scruff of the neck.
I would hope that now we are more or less safe Hilly could approach the Bury and Oldham games with a degree of enthusiasm and not ones where he is playing against two of his mates. Let's face it the table doesn't lie, bury are no better than us and are in fact pretty crap away from home, attack them and they collapse. We are currently in good form aren't we?
Oldham are fighting for their lives so let's learn from our recent game against Shrewsbury and start the game in the right fashion. No playing these two fixtures down, we are well capable of six points and let's hope we don't have to listen to any drivel about the fans looking at bury with envious eyes etc. If we lose, we lose,but it would nice to know we gave both games a bloody good go.
I don't know if Hilly plays the games down because he feels a bit of pressure competing against Flicker/local bragging rights,whatever the reason it's very rare we produce a good performance so he needs to change his approach. Being up for a local derby and knowing the team will be hell bent on securing the bragging rights should be a given, not even up for discussion... but it isn't. There's no need to play with caution now, let's get stuck into them. [Post edited 7 Mar 2016 16:30]
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| Please can we have some passion? on 08:59 - Mar 8 with 2607 views | nordenblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 23:56 - Mar 7 by Yorkshire_Dale |
That comment could have been penned exactly the same by a bury fan. |
I'd reckon the pressure on a manager who's club is millions in debt and expected to gain promotion is greater than Hilly who's only remit is to remain in this league which is all but now guaranteed. |  | | |
| Please can we have some passion? on 09:22 - Mar 8 with 2572 views | dingdangblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 08:59 - Mar 8 by nordenblue |
I'd reckon the pressure on a manager who's club is millions in debt and expected to gain promotion is greater than Hilly who's only remit is to remain in this league which is all but now guaranteed. |
Not his only remit - he's also got to develop players to sell for profit. |  |
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| Please can we have some passion? on 09:28 - Mar 8 with 2566 views | nordenblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 09:22 - Mar 8 by dingdangblue |
Not his only remit - he's also got to develop players to sell for profit. |
Not entirely true,that's in his own interests too!
Who is he selling this year for a profit if so? | | | |
| Please can we have some passion? on 09:35 - Mar 8 with 2555 views | 100notout |
| Please can we have some passion? on 09:28 - Mar 8 by nordenblue |
Not entirely true,that's in his own interests too!
Who is he selling this year for a profit if so? |
Do you know that for definite NB or is it speculation? | |
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| Please can we have some passion? on 10:21 - Mar 8 with 2491 views | lurker |
| Please can we have some passion? on 09:35 - Mar 8 by 100notout |
Do you know that for definite NB or is it speculation? |
Nobody knows that for definite
Cheers in advance for the markdown Parkinsgimp  |  | | |
| Please can we have some passion? on 10:25 - Mar 8 with 2481 views | TalkingSutty |
| Please can we have some passion? on 09:28 - Mar 8 by nordenblue |
Not entirely true,that's in his own interests too!
Who is he selling this year for a profit if so? |
To be fair NB,if that's the best way of meeting Hills wage demands then i don't have a problem with it. There are no real losers in that scenario because the crowds alone won't support a league one budget.
The way he portrays himself in the media doesn't make me warm to him, but as a manager (which is what he should be judged on) i don't think there's many better at this level. Whatever we pay him he deserves, he's juggling a squad full of unfulfilled talent on a low budget and still managed to achieve this seasons goal (nearly),most managers wouldn't be able to do that.
The quality of the squad and size of budget probably dictates the style of play that Hilly as to adopt in order to give us the best chance of succeeding, which in a way contradicts my original post. It's not pretty to watch at times but it's worked. Hill was good the first time around, i think his second stint is even better and I wouldn't be surprised if his budgets not much different than it was in league two. [Post edited 8 Mar 2016 10:26]
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| Please can we have some passion? on 10:32 - Mar 8 with 2460 views | dingdangblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 09:28 - Mar 8 by nordenblue |
Not entirely true,that's in his own interests too!
Who is he selling this year for a profit if so? |
He doesn't have to sell every year, I imagine the Hogan and Done money has given him some leeway. Allen and Camps won't be here too much longer. | |
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| Please can we have some passion? on 11:06 - Mar 8 with 2392 views | D_Alien |
"The quality of the squad and size of budget probably dictates the style of play that Hilly as to adopt in order to give us the best chance of succeeding, which in a way contradicts my original post."
I know where you're coming from with that, but it is contradictory given the results achieved in derby games (piss poor recently). His own mantra is that every game is an opportunity to take three points (except his "free hit" cup ties of course) in which case he should be seeking a methodology that's more likely to succeed. Starting on the front foot is something he knows about and my impression (like yours?) is that he tries to dampen the natural enthusiasm players might feel for this type of game, with a decent crowd etc.
Overall, none of us except parkinsgimp can complain about his achievements, but if getting into L1 and playing key games against close rivals is the very lifeblood of football then he shouldn't be trying to strangle that out of the team, especially when it's been demonstrated to be unsuccessful.
Being up for these types of games is what gets spectators interested and coming back for more. I strongly suspect our diminishing crowds over the past few months are in no small measure due to our abject surrender in the Bury cup tie. |  |
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| Please can we have some passion? on 11:56 - Mar 8 with 2330 views | dingdangblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 11:06 - Mar 8 by D_Alien |
"The quality of the squad and size of budget probably dictates the style of play that Hilly as to adopt in order to give us the best chance of succeeding, which in a way contradicts my original post."
I know where you're coming from with that, but it is contradictory given the results achieved in derby games (piss poor recently). His own mantra is that every game is an opportunity to take three points (except his "free hit" cup ties of course) in which case he should be seeking a methodology that's more likely to succeed. Starting on the front foot is something he knows about and my impression (like yours?) is that he tries to dampen the natural enthusiasm players might feel for this type of game, with a decent crowd etc.
Overall, none of us except parkinsgimp can complain about his achievements, but if getting into L1 and playing key games against close rivals is the very lifeblood of football then he shouldn't be trying to strangle that out of the team, especially when it's been demonstrated to be unsuccessful.
Being up for these types of games is what gets spectators interested and coming back for more. I strongly suspect our diminishing crowds over the past few months are in no small measure due to our abject surrender in the Bury cup tie. |
And the Wigan game a few weeks before - also on telly. Both an awful advert for Dale. At least the tv cameras haven't decided to go anywhere near Saturdays game which gives us a better chance already! | |
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| Please can we have some passion? on 12:14 - Mar 8 with 2300 views | TalkingSutty |
| Please can we have some passion? on 11:06 - Mar 8 by D_Alien |
"The quality of the squad and size of budget probably dictates the style of play that Hilly as to adopt in order to give us the best chance of succeeding, which in a way contradicts my original post."
I know where you're coming from with that, but it is contradictory given the results achieved in derby games (piss poor recently). His own mantra is that every game is an opportunity to take three points (except his "free hit" cup ties of course) in which case he should be seeking a methodology that's more likely to succeed. Starting on the front foot is something he knows about and my impression (like yours?) is that he tries to dampen the natural enthusiasm players might feel for this type of game, with a decent crowd etc.
Overall, none of us except parkinsgimp can complain about his achievements, but if getting into L1 and playing key games against close rivals is the very lifeblood of football then he shouldn't be trying to strangle that out of the team, especially when it's been demonstrated to be unsuccessful.
Being up for these types of games is what gets spectators interested and coming back for more. I strongly suspect our diminishing crowds over the past few months are in no small measure due to our abject surrender in the Bury cup tie. |
Good post.Hilly dampened the natural enthusiasm of the supporters with his constant harping on about supporters expectations, he did it to such good effect that the floating supporters no longer bother turning up for games. The die hards like ourselves don't have expectation, we are just grateful to have a football league club,but the younger fans have, they like to dream.
The manager,chairman,directors etc should be selling the dream at every opportunity, you don't belt somebody over the back of the head because they fantasise about the Club playing at a higher level.....or even being capable of beating Wigan or bury. That dream keeps them coming through the turnstile, only a fool would pop their balloon!!
Funnily enough I was in Morrisons,Todmorden this morning and was speaking to a Dale fan who I haven't seen for ages. He hasn't been since the game against Wigan because he said his son no longer wants to go, he's bored with the lack of action ( his words).
Results are very important but fans want to be entertained and some of the home displays this season have been devoid of interest, young supporters in particular won't put up with it, they find something else to do. In fact we have a substantial number of supporters who have drifted away,now that we are more or less safe I hope our style of play might change a bit and we can entice people back. It's a balancing act for Hill,results are important but so is the need to entertain the paying public. [Post edited 8 Mar 2016 12:42]
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| Please can we have some passion? on 12:44 - Mar 8 with 2234 views | rochedale |
Agree, derbies have been poor recently. If we can get 2 points a game for next 11 games there is a chance of that final play-off spot. Need to finish the season on a high. |  |
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| Please can we have some passion? on 13:00 - Mar 8 with 2186 views | TalkingSutty |
| Please can we have some passion? on 12:44 - Mar 8 by rochedale |
Agree, derbies have been poor recently. If we can get 2 points a game for next 11 games there is a chance of that final play-off spot. Need to finish the season on a high. |
I like your style. I just hope Hilly doesn't let the season meander to a conclusion because it's looking like the majority of games will be dead rubbers. Give Hooper some game time,I've given up on Lewis and let's see which players are hungry for a new contract. Great point about finishing the season on a high though. | | | |
| Please can we have some passion? on 13:07 - Mar 8 with 2173 views | roccydaleian |
| Please can we have some passion? on 13:00 - Mar 8 by TalkingSutty |
I like your style. I just hope Hilly doesn't let the season meander to a conclusion because it's looking like the majority of games will be dead rubbers. Give Hooper some game time,I've given up on Lewis and let's see which players are hungry for a new contract. Great point about finishing the season on a high though. |
Alessandra gone on loan to York.
Edit. Hulldale just started new thread. [Post edited 8 Mar 2016 13:12]
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| Please can we have some passion? on 14:00 - Mar 8 with 2083 views | rochedale |
| Please can we have some passion? on 13:00 - Mar 8 by TalkingSutty |
I like your style. I just hope Hilly doesn't let the season meander to a conclusion because it's looking like the majority of games will be dead rubbers. Give Hooper some game time,I've given up on Lewis and let's see which players are hungry for a new contract. Great point about finishing the season on a high though. |
If we win on Saturday and Barnsley lose we will be 4 points away from a play-off spot. If that isn't encouragement to attack this derby with some good-old derby passion then I don't know what is!
Barnsley are home to Southend on Saturday, no walk in the park there. | |
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| Please can we have some passion? on 14:01 - Mar 8 with 2083 views | nordenblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 10:21 - Mar 8 by lurker |
Nobody knows that for definite
Cheers in advance for the markdown Parkinsgimp |
There's a few people that will do | | | |
| Please can we have some passion? on 14:05 - Mar 8 with 1935 views | dingdangblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 14:00 - Mar 8 by rochedale |
If we win on Saturday and Barnsley lose we will be 4 points away from a play-off spot. If that isn't encouragement to attack this derby with some good-old derby passion then I don't know what is!
Barnsley are home to Southend on Saturday, no walk in the park there. |
Coventry can regain that final play off spot tonight with a win at Shrewsbury. | |
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| Please can we have some passion? on 14:05 - Mar 8 with 1933 views | nordenblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 10:32 - Mar 8 by dingdangblue |
He doesn't have to sell every year, I imagine the Hogan and Done money has given him some leeway. Allen and Camps won't be here too much longer. |
So his remit for this season is purely to remain in league 1?
The selling of players is a byproduct of having a successful team on the pitch,it's a perk for him and definitely not a remit for every season | | | |
| Please can we have some passion? on 14:08 - Mar 8 with 1922 views | nordenblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 10:25 - Mar 8 by TalkingSutty |
To be fair NB,if that's the best way of meeting Hills wage demands then i don't have a problem with it. There are no real losers in that scenario because the crowds alone won't support a league one budget.
The way he portrays himself in the media doesn't make me warm to him, but as a manager (which is what he should be judged on) i don't think there's many better at this level. Whatever we pay him he deserves, he's juggling a squad full of unfulfilled talent on a low budget and still managed to achieve this seasons goal (nearly),most managers wouldn't be able to do that.
The quality of the squad and size of budget probably dictates the style of play that Hilly as to adopt in order to give us the best chance of succeeding, which in a way contradicts my original post. It's not pretty to watch at times but it's worked. Hill was good the first time around, i think his second stint is even better and I wouldn't be surprised if his budgets not much different than it was in league two. [Post edited 8 Mar 2016 10:26]
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I couldn't agree more with you DA,I was just pointing out that the selling of players is a perk to Hilly and not a thing he has to do purely to please the directors every year. | | | |
| Please can we have some passion? on 14:12 - Mar 8 with 1904 views | BarryStrange |
| Please can we have some passion? on 21:05 - Mar 7 by 442Dale |
Or in Flitcroft's case, smash it to Pope.
Oh no, sorry, he's playing Ryan Lowe every week because that was the plan all along. #totalfootball |
Doesn't matter, bringing Lowe into the side is why we have no relegation worries.
For what it's worth, we have been uncommonly good in local derbies this season - only lost one out of the 8 we have played against Wigan, Oldham or Dale including winning away to all of you.
I don't think we will lose 3-0 again, as by the law of averages we have to stop doing that at some point, but I would happily take a draw on Saturday. Since I can't go I am not that bothered if it is another tedious 0-0 like the thriller at Gigg back in October. | | | |
| Please can we have some passion? on 14:32 - Mar 8 with 1855 views | dingdangblue |
| Please can we have some passion? on 14:05 - Mar 8 by nordenblue |
So his remit for this season is purely to remain in league 1?
The selling of players is a byproduct of having a successful team on the pitch,it's a perk for him and definitely not a remit for every season |
I didn't say it was his remit every season. You said his only remit was staying in this division. I said it was also his remit to develop players for selling (at some point). I'm sure Hooper is being developed this season? Along with Camps and Allen? [Post edited 8 Mar 2016 14:35]
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| Please can we have some passion? on 15:19 - Mar 8 with 1795 views | 100notout |
| Please can we have some passion? on 14:05 - Mar 8 by nordenblue |
So his remit for this season is purely to remain in league 1?
The selling of players is a byproduct of having a successful team on the pitch,it's a perk for him and definitely not a remit for every season |
So it is a fact then and not just speculation? You didn't respond to my earlier question yet you give the impression that you know these things.
(For the record I'm not bothered either way - as I think TS said earlier if that's what we need to do to afford our most successful manager ever then sounds a fair do to me.) | |
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| Please can we have some passion? on 15:47 - Mar 8 with 1737 views | D_Alien |
| Please can we have some passion? on 15:43 - Mar 8 by nordenblue |
As long as one of you is insulted my job here's done!! 
Sorry DA I did mean TS originally |
Turns out neither of us were insulted!
Job done poorly  | |
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