| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. 21:37 - Dec 30 with 2916 views | porschejack |
Just saw Sunderland getting 46,000 tonight at home !! with Villa looking dead certs to go down , doesn't look good for the team that joins them in the Championship unless you are Newcastle .
If these 3 went down , this must be the biggest set of followers since the Prem was formed .
Any hopes of the regular Championship hopefuls getting promoted in 2017 look slim , just hope its not us with them.
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 22:06 - Dec 30 with 2006 views | porschejack |
Just to recap on the Sunderland crowd , that's our stadium full , plus another of our stadiums full , plus the Vetch full , all on the same day . | | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:09 - Dec 31 with 1792 views | Whiterockin |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 22:06 - Dec 30 by porschejack |
Just to recap on the Sunderland crowd , that's our stadium full , plus another of our stadiums full , plus the Vetch full , all on the same day . |
Means feck all if you cant pick up points. |  | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:25 - Dec 31 with 1757 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:09 - Dec 31 by Whiterockin |
Means feck all if you cant pick up points. |
True. But that's not the issue. With the parachute money and bigger matchday incomes it would be no contest for the top two places, they would definitely come from those three.
The only hope for the rest of the league below is that the third fecks up in the play offs. |  |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:39 - Dec 31 with 1735 views | Whiterockin |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:25 - Dec 31 by Brynmill_Jack |
True. But that's not the issue. With the parachute money and bigger matchday incomes it would be no contest for the top two places, they would definitely come from those three.
The only hope for the rest of the league below is that the third fecks up in the play offs. |
I don't disagree with you in principle but ground capacity and large crowds doesn't always guarantee you a quick way back up. Some of the so called bigger clubs struggle and don't return (Leeds, Forest ect) but a smaller club like Norwich always seem to bounce back quickly. | | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:42 - Dec 31 with 1728 views | Phil_S |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:25 - Dec 31 by Brynmill_Jack |
True. But that's not the issue. With the parachute money and bigger matchday incomes it would be no contest for the top two places, they would definitely come from those three.
The only hope for the rest of the league below is that the third fecks up in the play offs. |
The parachute money that is designed to keep teams on an even keel is no guarantee of a return to the top flight neither is a larger ground capacity especially when that larger ground is half full every week (Sunderland or Villa would not attract anywhere near 40k in the Championship)
It is interesting to look at the stats now that in terms of % to capacity, Villa (84%) and Sunderland (86%) are already the lowest in the Premier League (us as comparison are 99%) - that would drop hugely if they continue to struggle this season and even more if they are hosting the likes of Brentford and Burton next season
If it was only as simple as you described then Leeds and Forest would have been back years ago and Norwich, Bournemouth, QPR or Swansea would never have got anywhere near
Some sides do bounce back easily because they have the nucleus of a very good side - Sunderland and Villa don't have that now and that's before whatever decent players they do have decide to disappear in the summer
This post has been edited by an administrator |  | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:55 - Dec 31 with 1690 views | SgorioFruit |
On a similar note, this seasons championship play off game must be on of the most biggest prize winning football games in history. £165 million for being in the prem league and £90 million in parachute payments. |  |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 09:12 - Dec 31 with 1651 views | Whiterockin |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:55 - Dec 31 by SgorioFruit |
On a similar note, this seasons championship play off game must be on of the most biggest prize winning football games in history. £165 million for being in the prem league and £90 million in parachute payments. |
Could nearly wipe out Cardiff's debt, but then again......  | | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:19 - Dec 31 with 1631 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:42 - Dec 31 by Phil_S |
The parachute money that is designed to keep teams on an even keel is no guarantee of a return to the top flight neither is a larger ground capacity especially when that larger ground is half full every week (Sunderland or Villa would not attract anywhere near 40k in the Championship)
It is interesting to look at the stats now that in terms of % to capacity, Villa (84%) and Sunderland (86%) are already the lowest in the Premier League (us as comparison are 99%) - that would drop hugely if they continue to struggle this season and even more if they are hosting the likes of Brentford and Burton next season
If it was only as simple as you described then Leeds and Forest would have been back years ago and Norwich, Bournemouth, QPR or Swansea would never have got anywhere near
Some sides do bounce back easily because they have the nucleus of a very good side - Sunderland and Villa don't have that now and that's before whatever decent players they do have decide to disappear in the summer
This post has been edited by an administrator |
With respect I have to disagree. For all of Sunderland, Newcastle and Villa's faults they are nowhere near being a Leeds United!
Forest are a better run club than Leeds but they have not had the benefits of PL money for how many years?
The league and monetary rewards have changed so much since we got promoted, I can't remember any of the relegated 3 doing much (unless Reading were one of them) . As I remember it the season before we were promoted Newcastle went back up straight away with WBA so even then bigger gates counted.
Then there's the other side of the coin, Blackpool and Wigan being the best examples. | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 09:19 - Dec 31 with 1631 views | dgt73 |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:42 - Dec 31 by Phil_S |
The parachute money that is designed to keep teams on an even keel is no guarantee of a return to the top flight neither is a larger ground capacity especially when that larger ground is half full every week (Sunderland or Villa would not attract anywhere near 40k in the Championship)
It is interesting to look at the stats now that in terms of % to capacity, Villa (84%) and Sunderland (86%) are already the lowest in the Premier League (us as comparison are 99%) - that would drop hugely if they continue to struggle this season and even more if they are hosting the likes of Brentford and Burton next season
If it was only as simple as you described then Leeds and Forest would have been back years ago and Norwich, Bournemouth, QPR or Swansea would never have got anywhere near
Some sides do bounce back easily because they have the nucleus of a very good side - Sunderland and Villa don't have that now and that's before whatever decent players they do have decide to disappear in the summer
This post has been edited by an administrator |
A lot of people dislike SKY - but they have been good for Swansea in levelling the playing field - without SKY cash we couldn't possibly survive in this league. |  |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:26 - Dec 31 with 1603 views | Phil_S |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:19 - Dec 31 by Brynmill_Jack |
With respect I have to disagree. For all of Sunderland, Newcastle and Villa's faults they are nowhere near being a Leeds United!
Forest are a better run club than Leeds but they have not had the benefits of PL money for how many years?
The league and monetary rewards have changed so much since we got promoted, I can't remember any of the relegated 3 doing much (unless Reading were one of them) . As I remember it the season before we were promoted Newcastle went back up straight away with WBA so even then bigger gates counted.
Then there's the other side of the coin, Blackpool and Wigan being the best examples. |
Villa and Sunderland I suspect will throw cash at average players this January (Townsend is just the first example) who will be very difficult to get rid of in the summer which just leads to parachute payments and gate receipts (no matter what they hold) being swallowed up to continue to pay them
Sunderland (possibly) and Villa (doubtful in my mind) may come back up but there are examples across the Premier League now that it is nothing to do with the size of stadium capacity
Will they have a bigger budget than others ? Yes. Will it be spent on strengthening the team to get them back up? HArd to say but it is likely they could be paying out for players who aren't even playing for them as well
Strangely, we would be one of the rare teams if we did drop out in that we wouldn't need massive chunks of the parachute money to continue to pay for our time in the Premier League. | | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 09:27 - Dec 31 with 1598 views | Starsky |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 09:19 - Dec 31 by dgt73 |
A lot of people dislike SKY - but they have been good for Swansea in levelling the playing field - without SKY cash we couldn't possibly survive in this league. |
Good point.
For you older ones out there...
Up until the late 70s, league gate monies in all divisions were shared between the home and away team, very similar split to an FA cup tie share out.
Then the First division pushed through a change of rules where the home team kept all the gate money.
This worked against us on our rise to the top when we having occasional gates of 17,000+ in the lower divisions. That was really bad timing for the Swans as they entered the top flight in the early 80s.
Although I agree with home teams keeping all the gate money. |  |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:30 - Dec 31 with 1592 views | dgt73 |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:26 - Dec 31 by Phil_S |
Villa and Sunderland I suspect will throw cash at average players this January (Townsend is just the first example) who will be very difficult to get rid of in the summer which just leads to parachute payments and gate receipts (no matter what they hold) being swallowed up to continue to pay them
Sunderland (possibly) and Villa (doubtful in my mind) may come back up but there are examples across the Premier League now that it is nothing to do with the size of stadium capacity
Will they have a bigger budget than others ? Yes. Will it be spent on strengthening the team to get them back up? HArd to say but it is likely they could be paying out for players who aren't even playing for them as well
Strangely, we would be one of the rare teams if we did drop out in that we wouldn't need massive chunks of the parachute money to continue to pay for our time in the Premier League. |
One big difference is when Newcastle went down not long ago - they kept most of their top players - Swansea couldn't do that. Swansea would probably need a completely new team. | |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:36 - Dec 31 with 1569 views | Phil_S |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:30 - Dec 31 by dgt73 |
One big difference is when Newcastle went down not long ago - they kept most of their top players - Swansea couldn't do that. Swansea would probably need a completely new team. |
And the award for the exaggeration of the year...
We would lose some players without a doubt but we would also keep a fair proportion of them you would be surprised | | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:38 - Dec 31 with 1562 views | dgt73 |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:36 - Dec 31 by Phil_S |
And the award for the exaggeration of the year...
We would lose some players without a doubt but we would also keep a fair proportion of them you would be surprised |
Who do you think out of the starting 11 for Swansea do you think would stay ?
Maybe the likes of Grimes, but can't see many at all. [Post edited 31 Dec 2015 9:39]
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:40 - Dec 31 with 1551 views | Phil_S |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:38 - Dec 31 by dgt73 |
Who do you think out of the starting 11 for Swansea do you think would stay ?
Maybe the likes of Grimes, but can't see many at all. [Post edited 31 Dec 2015 9:39]
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Do we have a starting 11 then?
You'd be better off looking at the squad as a whole and do we have a team left that can compete in the championship
I'm needing to go out now so will do the work when I get back later | | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:42 - Dec 31 with 1542 views | dgt73 |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:40 - Dec 31 by Phil_S |
Do we have a starting 11 then?
You'd be better off looking at the squad as a whole and do we have a team left that can compete in the championship
I'm needing to go out now so will do the work when I get back later |
Ok out of the squad then.
I'll start a thread see what the rest in the asylum think. [Post edited 31 Dec 2015 9:43]
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:50 - Dec 31 with 1520 views | johnlangy |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:30 - Dec 31 by dgt73 |
One big difference is when Newcastle went down not long ago - they kept most of their top players - Swansea couldn't do that. Swansea would probably need a completely new team. |
As far as i'm aware player contracts are still based on a large pay cut if we're relegated so, in theory, we could keep some (not all) of our better players. Whether they would want to stay is another question.
Some would definitely want to go to another PL team. If we lost say four of the biggest names we'd get in at least £20 million and, with no debt and £19 million in parachute payments we'd be in a VERY strong position to try to come back up without breaking the bank. | | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 09:51 - Dec 31 with 1517 views | robbiejames86 |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 08:25 - Dec 31 by Brynmill_Jack |
True. But that's not the issue. With the parachute money and bigger matchday incomes it would be no contest for the top two places, they would definitely come from those three.
The only hope for the rest of the league below is that the third fecks up in the play offs. |
I think you'll find when an established team gets relegated, they are more likely to struggle than the yo yo clubs.
Hence the likes of Leeds, Man City, Forest, Coventry, Saints, Qpr, Norwich, Charlton and probably Bolton all dropping to the third tier not long after relegation from the Premier league. | | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 13:08 - Dec 31 with 1378 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:26 - Dec 31 by Phil_S |
Villa and Sunderland I suspect will throw cash at average players this January (Townsend is just the first example) who will be very difficult to get rid of in the summer which just leads to parachute payments and gate receipts (no matter what they hold) being swallowed up to continue to pay them
Sunderland (possibly) and Villa (doubtful in my mind) may come back up but there are examples across the Premier League now that it is nothing to do with the size of stadium capacity
Will they have a bigger budget than others ? Yes. Will it be spent on strengthening the team to get them back up? HArd to say but it is likely they could be paying out for players who aren't even playing for them as well
Strangely, we would be one of the rare teams if we did drop out in that we wouldn't need massive chunks of the parachute money to continue to pay for our time in the Premier League. |
Looking at the championship table right now both Forest and Leeds are looking nowhere near the play offs, let alone the auto places. And only Hull from recent relegations along with Burnley are in the top 6.
And this is arguably an "open" year. With those three we mentioned earlier coming down it will be almost impossible for the also rans now to compete.
You are right, capacity won't really come into play but being better supported would certainly have helped Blackpool and Wigan cushion the blow. Look at them now. | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 13:18 - Dec 31 with 1358 views | Pacemaker |
Both Blackpool and Wigan were bankrolled and Wigan even after a number of years in the PL. very rarely sold out. I have no doubt of we were relegated we would lose a few thousand fans except for the big games and if we went on a good run.
I watched an interview with HJ and the Stoke chairman on SS a few years back where HJ made it clear our wages bill would be halved on relegation due to clauses in all the contracts.
Middlesbrough and Hull both have a large stadium and is rarely sold out, a good fan base, a decent squad and infrastructure is far more important to future success. |  |
| Life is an adventure or nothing at all. |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 13:55 - Dec 31 with 1300 views | QuakerJack |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:42 - Dec 31 by dgt73 |
Ok out of the squad then.
I'll start a thread see what the rest in the asylum think. [Post edited 31 Dec 2015 9:43]
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Fab - no
Rangel - yes
naughton - yes
taylor - yes
Ash - yes
Fede - no
Amat - maybe
Bartley - hope not
Leon - yes
Cork - yes
Ki - no
Gylfi - no
JJS - no
Routledge - yes
Barrow - yes
Ayew - no
Montero - no
Grimes - yes
Gomis - please god no
Just a start |  |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 14:08 - Dec 31 with 1274 views | Starsky |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates. on 13:18 - Dec 31 by Pacemaker |
Both Blackpool and Wigan were bankrolled and Wigan even after a number of years in the PL. very rarely sold out. I have no doubt of we were relegated we would lose a few thousand fans except for the big games and if we went on a good run.
I watched an interview with HJ and the Stoke chairman on SS a few years back where HJ made it clear our wages bill would be halved on relegation due to clauses in all the contracts.
Middlesbrough and Hull both have a large stadium and is rarely sold out, a good fan base, a decent squad and infrastructure is far more important to future success. |
Middlesboro would sell out every week if they got back to the Premier.
They did before.
I don't remember Blackpool being bankrolled... Fleeced more like. | |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 14:54 - Dec 31 with 1215 views | awayjack |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 13:55 - Dec 31 by QuakerJack |
Fab - no
Rangel - yes
naughton - yes
taylor - yes
Ash - yes
Fede - no
Amat - maybe
Bartley - hope not
Leon - yes
Cork - yes
Ki - no
Gylfi - no
JJS - no
Routledge - yes
Barrow - yes
Ayew - no
Montero - no
Grimes - yes
Gomis - please god no
Just a start |
Tough as it is to think about, agree with most of the list of leavers. If Ash and Taylor don't have their heads turned we'd have a decent defence / defensive midfield as foundation with maybe half of the £40m-£50m from selling that lot to buy a new attacking midfield / forward line up. It won't (please!) happen but at least we'd be able to compete if relegated. |  | | |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 15:23 - Dec 31 with 1165 views | Bloodyhills |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 09:30 - Dec 31 by dgt73 |
One big difference is when Newcastle went down not long ago - they kept most of their top players - Swansea couldn't do that. Swansea would probably need a completely new team. |
We'd probably be able to hang on to quite a few and would have a core to start with rather than starting from scratch. | |
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| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 16:17 - Dec 31 with 1128 views | Millie |
| Crowd capacity at the relegation candidates on 15:23 - Dec 31 by Bloodyhills |
We'd probably be able to hang on to quite a few and would have a core to start with rather than starting from scratch. |
The thing is, it depends if those three clubs are in debt, I know they have wealthy backers but they didn't become wealthy by throwing good money after bad.
The drop in wages will help but it's only 40%, so take Ash for instance although this is guess work I don't think I'm to far out
2011, as a championship player he earned 10k
First year in Prem doubled to 20k
Pay rise each year and now is on let's say 60k
40% of that should we get relegated would still be 36k, massive for a championship player | | | |
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