| At the end of the day 21:45 - Mar 8 with 6581 views | swan65split |
When it's all said and done,...............a little bit of investment,..............then again we have a hedge fund. |  | | |  |
| At the end of the day on 10:11 - Mar 9 with 622 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 10:08 - Mar 9 by mahoss |
Also West Brom and Stoke were relegated,both about the same size as us,why haven't they lost all their best players ?
The bottom line is,we can speculate about figures all day long but you have to ask why 27 anonymous people from the US would invest in a Welsh football club,for the love of Swansea ?,I don't think so..........
It doesn't look very good does it ?,it's very hard to defend. |
Stoke are bankrolled by the Coates family and have significant debt... and are below us.
WBA are set up as a club to bounce between the leagues and traditionally do it continuously, it means it is very unlikely they will match our success when there, but will get there more frequently. I prefer the former.
They (the 27), like nearly every owner in Britain and like almost every owner we will ever have are in it to make money. They certainly haven’t made any though, so it’s irrelevant. [Post edited 9 Mar 2019 10:13]
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| At the end of the day on 10:12 - Mar 9 with 621 views | clloy2 |
| At the end of the day on 10:02 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
It’s probably best to compare once they sell it.
You can guarantee Norwich won’t be sold to another group of local wealthy owners who will “back it” through thick and thin. They will be sold to an individual or group that want to profit from it.
The fact fans still can’t grasp this is gobsmacking. |
I'll wager you Delia would never sell to a hedge fund representing a group of hollywood actors/surgeons etc etc |  | | |
| At the end of the day on 10:15 - Mar 9 with 608 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 10:12 - Mar 9 by clloy2 |
I'll wager you Delia would never sell to a hedge fund representing a group of hollywood actors/surgeons etc etc |
Having a net worth of $36m, she may not feel the need to.
If she was not set up for life however and had limited time to cash in, I’d happily wager she would. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 10:20 - Mar 9 with 598 views | clloy2 |
| At the end of the day on 10:15 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
Having a net worth of $36m, she may not feel the need to.
If she was not set up for life however and had limited time to cash in, I’d happily wager she would. |
So does that mean in your book- knowingly selling your club down the Swaneee ( forgive the pun) in order to set yourselves up for life is fair game. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 10:21 - Mar 9 with 595 views | sg1912 |
| At the end of the day on 10:08 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
That’s what tender is. It’s a blind bidding process where the best deal offered to the club gets the job - our shareholders were able to offer the services cheaper than the competitors. It’s a positive not a negative.
I am not picking and choosing anything, I don’t have access to all the figures. But know them roughly and with this years certsin massive loss will hopefully offset. It would probably help the discussion if you stopped accusing me of things.
Now it seems you are informed of the figures, so could you post them (including the loss incurred as a result of initial promotion) and we can go from there. |
I can assure you they did not offer the cheapest tender, Fairwood was a good earner for MM and LD makes a significant amount of money through Bulk Vending and Princess Gate..
All of the accounts are available online, what the owners tell the fans does not reflect in the accounts. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 10:31 - Mar 9 with 571 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 10:20 - Mar 9 by clloy2 |
So does that mean in your book- knowingly selling your club down the Swaneee ( forgive the pun) in order to set yourselves up for life is fair game. |
I don’t know what you mean by knowingly selling the club down the swaneee.
The club was on its way down, we had long outstayed our welcome in the PL and our extraordinary lifespan there was going to end. Contrary to popular belief, oil tycoons weren’t, and aren’t, queuing up to buy a small club in South Wales with a tiny stadium they don’t even own.
Like most clubs, they are sold to someone who simply stumps up the cash for it. You can then only hope that they then improve it. As for our current owners, I’m not entirely sure what they have done wrong exactly (Bob Bradley aside, which was rectified pretty quickly). Care to give me shy clues? [Post edited 9 Mar 2019 10:35]
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| At the end of the day on 10:34 - Mar 9 with 566 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 10:21 - Mar 9 by sg1912 |
I can assure you they did not offer the cheapest tender, Fairwood was a good earner for MM and LD makes a significant amount of money through Bulk Vending and Princess Gate..
All of the accounts are available online, what the owners tell the fans does not reflect in the accounts. |
How can you assure me that? Are you accusing them them of not adhering to the tendering process? Can you give us any evidence of this?
Yes I know they are available, which is why I am able to say that over the last 8 years including this one with the black hole of TV money to service - we have made nothing. I was hoping you would tell me why you look at the profit and loss posted and come to the conclusion we have made vast profits. [Post edited 9 Mar 2019 10:37]
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| At the end of the day (n/t) on 10:38 - Mar 9 with 560 views | Loyal |
| At the end of the day (n/t) on 00:01 - Mar 9 by NeathJack |
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Don't bother with this cnt. Ignore. |  |
| Nolan sympathiser, clout expert, personal friend of Leigh Dineen, advocate and enforcer of porridge swallows.
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| At the end of the day on 10:44 - Mar 9 with 550 views | clloy2 |
| At the end of the day on 10:31 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
I don’t know what you mean by knowingly selling the club down the swaneee.
The club was on its way down, we had long outstayed our welcome in the PL and our extraordinary lifespan there was going to end. Contrary to popular belief, oil tycoons weren’t, and aren’t, queuing up to buy a small club in South Wales with a tiny stadium they don’t even own.
Like most clubs, they are sold to someone who simply stumps up the cash for it. You can then only hope that they then improve it. As for our current owners, I’m not entirely sure what they have done wrong exactly (Bob Bradley aside, which was rectified pretty quickly). Care to give me shy clues? [Post edited 9 Mar 2019 10:35]
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Lets try this for starters- taken from WOL
What they said: Levien commented: "Steve and I are committed to building a sustainable squad, we are trying to learn from our mistakes and add players of value who can grow into their roles."
The plan, he said, was to ‘learn from our mistakes’ and bring in ‘players of value who can grow into their roles'.
He went on: “We also have some key older players like Martin Olsson and Kyle Naughton, we are looking forward to Wilfried Bony returning, Leroy Fer’s return has been a big boost. I don’t think we’ve seen Tom Carroll’s best football yet. Those are players with Premier League experience and knowledge that other Championship clubs do not have.” | | | |
| At the end of the day on 10:51 - Mar 9 with 539 views | mahoss |
| At the end of the day on 10:11 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
Stoke are bankrolled by the Coates family and have significant debt... and are below us.
WBA are set up as a club to bounce between the leagues and traditionally do it continuously, it means it is very unlikely they will match our success when there, but will get there more frequently. I prefer the former.
They (the 27), like nearly every owner in Britain and like almost every owner we will ever have are in it to make money. They certainly haven’t made any though, so it’s irrelevant. [Post edited 9 Mar 2019 10:13]
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Bankrolled by the Coates family ?
I thought you weren't allowed to do that under FFP rules !
Doesn't make sense. | | | |
| At the end of the day (n/t) on 10:52 - Mar 9 with 537 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day (n/t) on 10:38 - Mar 9 by Loyal |
Don't bother with this cnt. Ignore. |
He seems ok to me, just a bit petulant at times. I’ll give anybody a chance. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 10:53 - Mar 9 with 532 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 10:51 - Mar 9 by mahoss |
Bankrolled by the Coates family ?
I thought you weren't allowed to do that under FFP rules !
Doesn't make sense. |
They get around it by sponsoring the stadium and the jersey etc. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 10:54 - Mar 9 with 530 views | sg1912 |
| At the end of the day on 10:34 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
How can you assure me that? Are you accusing them them of not adhering to the tendering process? Can you give us any evidence of this?
Yes I know they are available, which is why I am able to say that over the last 8 years including this one with the black hole of TV money to service - we have made nothing. I was hoping you would tell me why you look at the profit and loss posted and come to the conclusion we have made vast profits. [Post edited 9 Mar 2019 10:37]
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I know people who work for the club and for the sub contractor, I know you will say that’s not evidence, but what they have done was not illegal.. which is why there is no ‘hard evidence.
You’re also not taking into account our profits minus our lack of expenditure this season, you’re making conclusions based on forecasts. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 10:56 - Mar 9 with 524 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 10:44 - Mar 9 by clloy2 |
Lets try this for starters- taken from WOL
What they said: Levien commented: "Steve and I are committed to building a sustainable squad, we are trying to learn from our mistakes and add players of value who can grow into their roles."
The plan, he said, was to ‘learn from our mistakes’ and bring in ‘players of value who can grow into their roles'.
He went on: “We also have some key older players like Martin Olsson and Kyle Naughton, we are looking forward to Wilfried Bony returning, Leroy Fer’s return has been a big boost. I don’t think we’ve seen Tom Carroll’s best football yet. Those are players with Premier League experience and knowledge that other Championship clubs do not have.” |
Ok.
So what part of that piece are we looking at? And what is it that you have taken issue with? | | | |
| At the end of the day on 11:06 - Mar 9 with 507 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 10:54 - Mar 9 by sg1912 |
I know people who work for the club and for the sub contractor, I know you will say that’s not evidence, but what they have done was not illegal.. which is why there is no ‘hard evidence.
You’re also not taking into account our profits minus our lack of expenditure this season, you’re making conclusions based on forecasts. |
Of course I’m going to say it isn’t evidence, because it isn’t. What you are describing is what is called collusive tendering and is absolutely illegal so I would be sure if I were you that you are happy to back that claim if they see this. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 11:13 - Mar 9 with 489 views | sg1912 |
| At the end of the day on 11:06 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
Of course I’m going to say it isn’t evidence, because it isn’t. What you are describing is what is called collusive tendering and is absolutely illegal so I would be sure if I were you that you are happy to back that claim if they see this. |
Yes, it’s just a massive coincidence that our shareholders companies always win the tender.
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| At the end of the day on 11:50 - Mar 9 with 444 views | jack247 |
| At the end of the day on 08:18 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
Hard to swallow or not, it’s just the facts. The £40m is an irrelevance. It would only be hard to swallow if you thought that £40m was surplus, but I trust being the sensible poster you are you would not even claim that for a second. So how much money we had to raise to service a debt we had has no baring on anything with regards to our investment, that money was never ours - it was earmarked to stop the club going under. So to spend €7-8 million is not something I ever expected to see us do at this level, especially with such a financial deficit.
As for your question, if we had to sell Rodon, James and McBurnie to service huge debt then I would regard it as us investing 200k in the playing staff or whatever it is your Declan John character costs. I don’t understand how you would even attempt to say otherwise. To suggest so implies a choice, we had no choice - no realistic choice anyway.
We can always go back and moan about signings that didn’t come off in the PL, it’s facetious tnhough as there was also an awful lot that did. What we are discussing is the here and now and what the owners have invested is more than expected, or that should be reasonably expected given the circumstances. [Post edited 9 Mar 2019 8:24]
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If we raise £20m on players this summer, weaken the squad and spend £2m. I’d see that as an £18m net gain on players, not a £2m investment. Ignoring the fact that some first team players contracts are up and they may go for free.
Unfortunately it’s not facetious to moan about signings that didn’t work under the current owners tenure. It’s what relegated us. There are probably more, but I can only think of Mawson and Llorente that we either sold for a profit or are currently important players for us. Possibly VdH, I think he was here before them though. All the other players who have worked out well for us were signed under the previous regime. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 11:51 - Mar 9 with 443 views | WxmJax |
| At the end of the day on 10:15 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
Having a net worth of $36m, she may not feel the need to.
If she was not set up for life however and had limited time to cash in, I’d happily wager she would. |
$36m ?
Google..How much is Delia worth ?
A quick copy and paste. And I thought we used £ in this country but you're not bright enough to notice that. Thick as shit, aye. What did you think of last night's game ? I forgot, you don't watch us.
Placed you on ignore as your drivel spoils this site. Don't bother replying because I won't be able to see it, but you won't be able to contain yourself, you will HAVE to reply. It's one of the reasons you're so boring and tedious. I'll give it 10 minutes, 20 tops
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| At the end of the day on 11:59 - Mar 9 with 429 views | jasper_T |
| At the end of the day on 10:51 - Mar 9 by mahoss |
Bankrolled by the Coates family ?
I thought you weren't allowed to do that under FFP rules !
Doesn't make sense. |
They're going to have to change tack sharpish. Gambled big time on immediate promotion. Losses this year and last far beyond allowances for the 3 year period, it'll be transfer bans and other sanctions if they don't somehow turn a profit next season. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 12:00 - Mar 9 with 426 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 11:51 - Mar 9 by WxmJax |
$36m ?
Google..How much is Delia worth ?
A quick copy and paste. And I thought we used £ in this country but you're not bright enough to notice that. Thick as shit, aye. What did you think of last night's game ? I forgot, you don't watch us.
Placed you on ignore as your drivel spoils this site. Don't bother replying because I won't be able to see it, but you won't be able to contain yourself, you will HAVE to reply. It's one of the reasons you're so boring and tedious. I'll give it 10 minutes, 20 tops
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You don’t like the fact I googled how much Delia is worth? Did you expect me to know off the top of my head? Or ask her myself?
I have no idea what you are talking about regarding dollars. Net worth is pretty much always listed in USD due to differing and liquid values of currency.
On ignore? Thank God we won’t get your simpleton replies anymore. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 12:08 - Mar 9 with 416 views | mahoss |
| At the end of the day on 10:53 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
They get around it by sponsoring the stadium and the jersey etc. |
Then why aren't we doing it ? | | | |
| At the end of the day on 12:09 - Mar 9 with 413 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 11:50 - Mar 9 by jack247 |
If we raise £20m on players this summer, weaken the squad and spend £2m. I’d see that as an £18m net gain on players, not a £2m investment. Ignoring the fact that some first team players contracts are up and they may go for free.
Unfortunately it’s not facetious to moan about signings that didn’t work under the current owners tenure. It’s what relegated us. There are probably more, but I can only think of Mawson and Llorente that we either sold for a profit or are currently important players for us. Possibly VdH, I think he was here before them though. All the other players who have worked out well for us were signed under the previous regime. |
Then you are talking about squad value and not investment. They aren’t the same thing. Squad value will always decrease when you are relegated, respecting the squad value to increase is ludicrous.
Signings that didn’t work out didn’t relegate us. The squad as a whole relegated us, that includes youth players, existing players and previous successful signings. What you are saying is our newer signings weren’t good enough to pull the club away from relegation, that’s football, every relegated club will also look back and be able to say the same thing.
I’m not entirely sure what you are moaning about now. I thought we were talking about having a go at them for not investing more this season by taking it off the shortfall and thus endangering the club? You seem to be shifting the topic after me pointing out that doing so would be harmful. | | | |
| At the end of the day on 12:11 - Mar 9 with 411 views | The_E20 |
| At the end of the day on 12:08 - Mar 9 by mahoss |
Then why aren't we doing it ? |
Why aren’t we doing what? Calling it the Yank stadium and putting their own personal wealth into it even though they don’t own the club?
Have you asked the Trust why they haven’t ploughed their 800k into the clubs transfer fund? Or do we only expect certain shareholders to do it when we have never ever expected shareholders to in our entire history? | | | |
| At the end of the day on 12:34 - Mar 9 with 403 views | jack247 |
| At the end of the day on 12:09 - Mar 9 by The_E20 |
Then you are talking about squad value and not investment. They aren’t the same thing. Squad value will always decrease when you are relegated, respecting the squad value to increase is ludicrous.
Signings that didn’t work out didn’t relegate us. The squad as a whole relegated us, that includes youth players, existing players and previous successful signings. What you are saying is our newer signings weren’t good enough to pull the club away from relegation, that’s football, every relegated club will also look back and be able to say the same thing.
I’m not entirely sure what you are moaning about now. I thought we were talking about having a go at them for not investing more this season by taking it off the shortfall and thus endangering the club? You seem to be shifting the topic after me pointing out that doing so would be harmful. |
The squad value reduced because we were relegated. The players we signed over the last couple of seasons were, in the main, the reason we got relegated.
We spent the Sigurdsson money on Mesa and Clucas. Replaced Llorente with Bony and Abraham. Then we ended up not playing Mesa, Clucas had maybe 3 good games for us, Bony never played and we ended up playing a poacher who wasn’t physical enough to hold up defenders up front on his own, until we dropped him for a utility winger/striker/attacking midfielder. That relegated us.
The original point, which I’m sticking to, is if you sell £40m of players to put towards debts and running costs, then buy £5m of players, you haven’t invested £5m, you’ve raised £35m by selling assets. | | | |
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