| Welsh tourism tax on 09:50 - Apr 28 with 961 views | johnlangy |
| Welsh tourism tax on 19:24 - Apr 27 by Boundy |
Two questions if you don't mind , would you be happy to be an independent nation with Labour in charge and why? |
No problem Boundy.
I'd be hysterically happy for Wales to be an Independent Nation and i'd be, lets say content with Labour in charge simply because that would have been decided by Welsh people. Democracy and all that.
I don't vote Labour so i'm not about to start arguing pro their policies.
This is the why. If they were in charge of an Indy Wales they would be held accountable for everything that happens. There'd be no blaming Westminster any more for the areas where they are still in charge. Those complaints are often valid now but would not then be possible.
If it wasn't for the Covid bounce effect on MD's popularity I believe they would have been a minority Government now and would have had no choice but to work with others in a far more meaningful way (spreading investment across the whole of Wales eg ?). |  | |  |
| Welsh tourism tax on 10:50 - Apr 28 with 932 views | Lorax |
| Welsh tourism tax on 09:33 - Apr 28 by johnlangy |
Who are 'these people' Dr ? From memory I don't believe i've included EU membership after Independence in any of my posts. And I don't understand why you do.
If there was a Welsh Indy referendum it wouldn't be for ten years or more (just for the sake of putting a number of years on it). If there was then an appetite for a referendum on Wales joining the Eu that would also be probably another ten years after.
So that 'possibility' would not come about till mid century. Meanwhile the EU may very well have broken up, or at least changed drastically so what's the point in linking the two ? |
Who are these people.....Kilkenny for one, there are probably others, Itchy maybe?
Kilkenny usually insists we can go indy and walk straight into the Eu as full members. No matter how many times the "Copenhagen criteria" are pointed out to him, he ignores reality and pragmatism and steams full ahead with ignorance.
What we see happening in Europe now, it may have a profound effect on the future of the EU, it may strengthen it or it could even destroy it. Who knows what the future will bring.
Heck, Putin may go full cockwomble and press the nuclear button so none of it will matter! | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 16:35 - Apr 28 with 903 views | onehunglow |
| Welsh tourism tax on 10:50 - Apr 28 by Lorax |
Who are these people.....Kilkenny for one, there are probably others, Itchy maybe?
Kilkenny usually insists we can go indy and walk straight into the Eu as full members. No matter how many times the "Copenhagen criteria" are pointed out to him, he ignores reality and pragmatism and steams full ahead with ignorance.
What we see happening in Europe now, it may have a profound effect on the future of the EU, it may strengthen it or it could even destroy it. Who knows what the future will bring.
Heck, Putin may go full cockwomble and press the nuclear button so none of it will matter! |
Wales would be ok though cos Plaid are pacifist ,wouldn't have any military and would simply roll over for Russia.
Independence now for Wales is more inane than ever. | |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 18:14 - Apr 28 with 880 views | johnlangy |
| Welsh tourism tax on 08:22 - Apr 28 by felixstowe_jack |
1) not answered.
2) can't be sterling if Wales is an independent country
3) no hard borders mean a single market the larger England would set rules and taxation policies if Wales set their taxes too high to fund themselves people will pop across border to shop
4) just Google it to find where these 300,000 jobs are a few hints for you
DVLA, passport office Newport, land registry car, HMRC. These offices serve the whole of the UK wales will new much smaller offices. |
1 - by 'not answered' I presume you mean I haven't given a specific number for the deficit. It would take a huge amount of work to extract the info from all the companies involved and they would in all probability say no to my request for info anyway. I believe that my statement that the deficit is far smaller than £13 billion is in fact an answer. And i've stated many times why the number would be far less.
2 - Wales and Scotland have a perfectly legal right to use Sterling as currency if they choose.
3 - How rules and taxes would pan out I can't predict. But there would be no hard border.
4 - There was a particular reason for asking you where those jobs are felix. There was no need for me to use google because i'm well aware of the four departments you mention. Those four departments would cover about 15,000 Civil Servants. My question was basically to ask where the other 285,000 jobs are. The UK Civil Service employs around 500,000 people to cover the whole UK population of 65 million. You're saying that 300,000 of them are based in Wales. So could you please explain where they are. | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 23:18 - Apr 28 with 840 views | Lorax |
| Welsh tourism tax on 18:14 - Apr 28 by johnlangy |
1 - by 'not answered' I presume you mean I haven't given a specific number for the deficit. It would take a huge amount of work to extract the info from all the companies involved and they would in all probability say no to my request for info anyway. I believe that my statement that the deficit is far smaller than £13 billion is in fact an answer. And i've stated many times why the number would be far less.
2 - Wales and Scotland have a perfectly legal right to use Sterling as currency if they choose.
3 - How rules and taxes would pan out I can't predict. But there would be no hard border.
4 - There was a particular reason for asking you where those jobs are felix. There was no need for me to use google because i'm well aware of the four departments you mention. Those four departments would cover about 15,000 Civil Servants. My question was basically to ask where the other 285,000 jobs are. The UK Civil Service employs around 500,000 people to cover the whole UK population of 65 million. You're saying that 300,000 of them are based in Wales. So could you please explain where they are. |
Oh John, as I have already said, nobody knows the true numbers. You can demand that it is much less than we are told but you don't know and until it can be proven it remains purely your best guess.
Now Sterling, we have it as part of the UK, if we left the Uk why would we have a legal right to use it? Scotland has already been told they have no guaranteed right to keep Sterling if they go indy and to and if Westminster allowed them to carry on using it then they are not fully independent, Drakeford has said as much about Wales.
How can you be sure there wouldn't be a hard border? We cannot know what would happen.
The jobs thing, there are apparently a tad over 5000 civil servants in Wales but it's not just civil servants. There's those employed by the military, the police and NHS, when the Westminster tap is turned off who pays for them all and who is responsible for the pensions? The financial situation is a lot more complicated than simply saying we can afford it and the deficit is a lot smaller. | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 23:31 - Apr 28 with 836 views | majorraglan |
| Welsh tourism tax on 23:18 - Apr 28 by Lorax |
Oh John, as I have already said, nobody knows the true numbers. You can demand that it is much less than we are told but you don't know and until it can be proven it remains purely your best guess.
Now Sterling, we have it as part of the UK, if we left the Uk why would we have a legal right to use it? Scotland has already been told they have no guaranteed right to keep Sterling if they go indy and to and if Westminster allowed them to carry on using it then they are not fully independent, Drakeford has said as much about Wales.
How can you be sure there wouldn't be a hard border? We cannot know what would happen.
The jobs thing, there are apparently a tad over 5000 civil servants in Wales but it's not just civil servants. There's those employed by the military, the police and NHS, when the Westminster tap is turned off who pays for them all and who is responsible for the pensions? The financial situation is a lot more complicated than simply saying we can afford it and the deficit is a lot smaller. |
If we were independent and set on joining the EU, I’d say we’d have to have a hard border. The oven ready deal Boris has negotiated has a border down the Irish Sea to prevent one being erected on the island of Ireland - as we dont have a sea between us and England we’d have to have a hard border, fences etc etc. It’s the only way the single market, border security etc can be maintained. | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 23:37 - Apr 28 with 833 views | Lorax |
| Welsh tourism tax on 23:31 - Apr 28 by majorraglan |
If we were independent and set on joining the EU, I’d say we’d have to have a hard border. The oven ready deal Boris has negotiated has a border down the Irish Sea to prevent one being erected on the island of Ireland - as we dont have a sea between us and England we’d have to have a hard border, fences etc etc. It’s the only way the single market, border security etc can be maintained. |
Exactly, but even then we may have to wait a long time before EU membership would be granted.
I wouldn't vote for it for sure, if there was even a vote and the Senedd didn't just go ahead and do it, I don't have faith that they wouldn't just ignore us and apply.
Some people just don't want to accept that there could be a negative outcome. They are as bad as those people who moan about brexit things that were obvious to anybody paying attention, like queueing at EU airports because we are not in the EU anymore.. | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 06:19 - Apr 29 with 824 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Welsh tourism tax on 23:37 - Apr 28 by Lorax |
Exactly, but even then we may have to wait a long time before EU membership would be granted.
I wouldn't vote for it for sure, if there was even a vote and the Senedd didn't just go ahead and do it, I don't have faith that they wouldn't just ignore us and apply.
Some people just don't want to accept that there could be a negative outcome. They are as bad as those people who moan about brexit things that were obvious to anybody paying attention, like queueing at EU airports because we are not in the EU anymore.. |
Wales voted to LEAVE the EU don't you recognise the result of a democratic vote. Wales will not make the fiscal requirements to join the at present. All new countries joining have to use the EU.
Why would Wales want a different currency with its biggest trading partner it would also be a disaster for Wales' biggest industry, tourism. | |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 10:36 - Apr 29 with 795 views | Lorax |
| Welsh tourism tax on 06:19 - Apr 29 by felixstowe_jack |
Wales voted to LEAVE the EU don't you recognise the result of a democratic vote. Wales will not make the fiscal requirements to join the at present. All new countries joining have to use the EU.
Why would Wales want a different currency with its biggest trading partner it would also be a disaster for Wales' biggest industry, tourism. |
You either haven't been paying attention, have forgotten my previous posts or have failed to comprehend the post.
1, don't recognise the result of a democratic vote...I voted leave.
2, where did I say or support any of that?
3, I actually stated I would not vote for it (EU membership)
4, I have pointed out the Copenhagen criteria many times to those who think EU membership is a shoe in.
OR, maybe I have failed to comprehend your post, possibly? Either way I am far from a fan of the EU and am very Pro UK. | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 18:14 - May 1 with 753 views | johnlangy |
| Welsh tourism tax on 23:18 - Apr 28 by Lorax |
Oh John, as I have already said, nobody knows the true numbers. You can demand that it is much less than we are told but you don't know and until it can be proven it remains purely your best guess.
Now Sterling, we have it as part of the UK, if we left the Uk why would we have a legal right to use it? Scotland has already been told they have no guaranteed right to keep Sterling if they go indy and to and if Westminster allowed them to carry on using it then they are not fully independent, Drakeford has said as much about Wales.
How can you be sure there wouldn't be a hard border? We cannot know what would happen.
The jobs thing, there are apparently a tad over 5000 civil servants in Wales but it's not just civil servants. There's those employed by the military, the police and NHS, when the Westminster tap is turned off who pays for them all and who is responsible for the pensions? The financial situation is a lot more complicated than simply saying we can afford it and the deficit is a lot smaller. |
I agree with the first para. It is certainly less. The only question is how much less. I'd love it if someone with the resources to do it established the actual amount then we could get on with discussing other stuff.
Sterling. To be honest i'm just quoting things i've read. I'm certainly no legal expert. During the Scottish Indy ref many people said Scotland wouldn't be able to use it and many others said the complete opposite. If Scotland can use it then Wales can. Equally they may not.
A hard border would make no sense for either England or Wales so i'm just applying logic. And if an EU ref to rejoin ever happened and a hard border was a proviso to rejoin i'd almost certainly vote no.
You say 5000 civil servants. I imagine you probably meant 5000 at the DVLA. There are a lot more than that.
Re the NHS non medical staff. They are currently paid by the Senedd because health is devolved and the Senedd has the funding to do that. The military and the police (and justice) are not devolved. So they are currently being paid by Westminster. And the Welsh share of the cost of those staff is covered by the £15 billion or so of Welsh taxes held back by Westminster for non devolved areas.
Felix said 300,000 Government jobs are based in Wales. As I questioned previously with no answer coming back, there are 500,000 to cover the whole of the UK's 65 million people. And Felix said 300,000 are in Wales. If he believes that i'd like an explanation of where they all are. His last answer covered about 15,000 of those jobs. I'd like to know where the other 285,000 are.
You refer to the Westminster tap as if suggesting it's their money. As if they're giving us something that is theirs. They're not. Any money not covered by our taxes (deficit) is covered by money borrowed by them on our behalf because the Senedd is not allowed to borrow it.
By pensions, if you mean the state pension then that's the responsibilty of Westminster.
Have I ever said it's simple ? | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 19:02 - May 1 with 728 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Welsh tourism tax on 18:14 - May 1 by johnlangy |
I agree with the first para. It is certainly less. The only question is how much less. I'd love it if someone with the resources to do it established the actual amount then we could get on with discussing other stuff.
Sterling. To be honest i'm just quoting things i've read. I'm certainly no legal expert. During the Scottish Indy ref many people said Scotland wouldn't be able to use it and many others said the complete opposite. If Scotland can use it then Wales can. Equally they may not.
A hard border would make no sense for either England or Wales so i'm just applying logic. And if an EU ref to rejoin ever happened and a hard border was a proviso to rejoin i'd almost certainly vote no.
You say 5000 civil servants. I imagine you probably meant 5000 at the DVLA. There are a lot more than that.
Re the NHS non medical staff. They are currently paid by the Senedd because health is devolved and the Senedd has the funding to do that. The military and the police (and justice) are not devolved. So they are currently being paid by Westminster. And the Welsh share of the cost of those staff is covered by the £15 billion or so of Welsh taxes held back by Westminster for non devolved areas.
Felix said 300,000 Government jobs are based in Wales. As I questioned previously with no answer coming back, there are 500,000 to cover the whole of the UK's 65 million people. And Felix said 300,000 are in Wales. If he believes that i'd like an explanation of where they all are. His last answer covered about 15,000 of those jobs. I'd like to know where the other 285,000 are.
You refer to the Westminster tap as if suggesting it's their money. As if they're giving us something that is theirs. They're not. Any money not covered by our taxes (deficit) is covered by money borrowed by them on our behalf because the Senedd is not allowed to borrow it.
By pensions, if you mean the state pension then that's the responsibilty of Westminster.
Have I ever said it's simple ? |
Just Google how many government employees in Wales.
The answer is 20% out of a work force of 1,500,000, that is 300,000.
Clearly not all these jobs will be lost but some will DVLA, TAX OFFICE, LAND REGISTRY.
But even assuming 10% that is 30,000.
As far as the currency goes they could contine using sterling but only the bank of England can print issue valid bank notes. They could still use them in Wales but could not issue any themselves and the BOE would set interest rates. Several countries use the $ unofficially but again they usually have an unofficial exchange rate between the $ and the local currency.
Not sure where the Weslh NHS would sent patients for specialist treatment and facilities. They currently send patients to Liverpool, Manchester, Chester , Birmingham, Bristol, Cambridge and London. | |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 19:39 - May 1 with 706 views | Wingstandwood |
| Welsh tourism tax on 19:02 - May 1 by felixstowe_jack |
Just Google how many government employees in Wales.
The answer is 20% out of a work force of 1,500,000, that is 300,000.
Clearly not all these jobs will be lost but some will DVLA, TAX OFFICE, LAND REGISTRY.
But even assuming 10% that is 30,000.
As far as the currency goes they could contine using sterling but only the bank of England can print issue valid bank notes. They could still use them in Wales but could not issue any themselves and the BOE would set interest rates. Several countries use the $ unofficially but again they usually have an unofficial exchange rate between the $ and the local currency.
Not sure where the Weslh NHS would sent patients for specialist treatment and facilities. They currently send patients to Liverpool, Manchester, Chester , Birmingham, Bristol, Cambridge and London. |
You are absolutely bang on about Wales's reliance on English NHS!
May I also add to that the Royal Air force that provides Sea King helicopters that land within the grounds of Morriston Hospital and other Welsh hospitals. They are of vital importance required to take patients to the likes of Queen Elizabeth Hospital Birmingham for liver transplantation. Many other examples of Royal Air Force assistance whether that be natural disasters, search and rescue, and other NHS involvement.
When I previously asked another Welsh Nat on here what would happen with full independence regarding loss of English NHS specialty and RAF hardware/expertise? I got the answer that Welsh patients would then be sent to Europe hospitals using European medivac airlift(s). This is the mentality of some people that we're dealing with here i.e. do not want a modern transport network and neither want a functional NHS operating on Welsh soil.
Staggering! |  |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 12:09 - May 2 with 636 views | Lorax |
| Welsh tourism tax on 18:14 - May 1 by johnlangy |
I agree with the first para. It is certainly less. The only question is how much less. I'd love it if someone with the resources to do it established the actual amount then we could get on with discussing other stuff.
Sterling. To be honest i'm just quoting things i've read. I'm certainly no legal expert. During the Scottish Indy ref many people said Scotland wouldn't be able to use it and many others said the complete opposite. If Scotland can use it then Wales can. Equally they may not.
A hard border would make no sense for either England or Wales so i'm just applying logic. And if an EU ref to rejoin ever happened and a hard border was a proviso to rejoin i'd almost certainly vote no.
You say 5000 civil servants. I imagine you probably meant 5000 at the DVLA. There are a lot more than that.
Re the NHS non medical staff. They are currently paid by the Senedd because health is devolved and the Senedd has the funding to do that. The military and the police (and justice) are not devolved. So they are currently being paid by Westminster. And the Welsh share of the cost of those staff is covered by the £15 billion or so of Welsh taxes held back by Westminster for non devolved areas.
Felix said 300,000 Government jobs are based in Wales. As I questioned previously with no answer coming back, there are 500,000 to cover the whole of the UK's 65 million people. And Felix said 300,000 are in Wales. If he believes that i'd like an explanation of where they all are. His last answer covered about 15,000 of those jobs. I'd like to know where the other 285,000 are.
You refer to the Westminster tap as if suggesting it's their money. As if they're giving us something that is theirs. They're not. Any money not covered by our taxes (deficit) is covered by money borrowed by them on our behalf because the Senedd is not allowed to borrow it.
By pensions, if you mean the state pension then that's the responsibilty of Westminster.
Have I ever said it's simple ? |
First para, we agree, good.
Sterling, Scottish sources insisted they could carry on using it but Westminster repeatedly said no and even if Westminster allowed them to, they have to accept Westminster control of fiscal policy which isn't true independence.
A hard border makes no sense economically/financially but since when has politics shown any great common sense? A vote to re-join the EU would almost certainly mean a hard border with all the checks and paperwork that go with it.
Civil servants, I think that's harder to judge these days because there is a difference between civil servants and government employees. There are certainly many more than 5000 government employees.
The next bit, you again assume a very large Welsh tax take, official figures show a nowhere near 15 billion return, in fact with a Welsh budget of 17 billion you have reversed the figures, the true amount is somewhere in the middle but who knows? I thought we'd agreed we didn't?
The Westminster tap, as long as there actually is a deficit, whatever it's true size then it is not Welsh money, it is supplied by Westminster and would actually be English money.
Westminster is responsible for pensions up to the date of independence. At that point anybody entitled to the full pension should get that but what after that? Would partial pensions be paid or money returned? The Senedd would have to take responsibilities from that date.
Last I saw there are 5,500 full time Welsh government jobs. The Senedd running costs are around 70 million per year. They want to increase their numbers by 30% and claim it will only cost another 10 million, it doesn't quite stack up, does it? Are they being conservative with the truth to persuade us it should happen, then they admit the true costs increase are much higher, closer to double?
I'm still completely in favour of trying to cut the number of politicians. The more of them we have, the worse things get. | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 17:56 - May 2 with 606 views | johnlangy |
| Welsh tourism tax on 12:09 - May 2 by Lorax |
First para, we agree, good.
Sterling, Scottish sources insisted they could carry on using it but Westminster repeatedly said no and even if Westminster allowed them to, they have to accept Westminster control of fiscal policy which isn't true independence.
A hard border makes no sense economically/financially but since when has politics shown any great common sense? A vote to re-join the EU would almost certainly mean a hard border with all the checks and paperwork that go with it.
Civil servants, I think that's harder to judge these days because there is a difference between civil servants and government employees. There are certainly many more than 5000 government employees.
The next bit, you again assume a very large Welsh tax take, official figures show a nowhere near 15 billion return, in fact with a Welsh budget of 17 billion you have reversed the figures, the true amount is somewhere in the middle but who knows? I thought we'd agreed we didn't?
The Westminster tap, as long as there actually is a deficit, whatever it's true size then it is not Welsh money, it is supplied by Westminster and would actually be English money.
Westminster is responsible for pensions up to the date of independence. At that point anybody entitled to the full pension should get that but what after that? Would partial pensions be paid or money returned? The Senedd would have to take responsibilities from that date.
Last I saw there are 5,500 full time Welsh government jobs. The Senedd running costs are around 70 million per year. They want to increase their numbers by 30% and claim it will only cost another 10 million, it doesn't quite stack up, does it? Are they being conservative with the truth to persuade us it should happen, then they admit the true costs increase are much higher, closer to double?
I'm still completely in favour of trying to cut the number of politicians. The more of them we have, the worse things get. |
I'll go straight for para five because the first ones are essentially okay.
I'm always arguing that the real Welsh tax total exceeds the stated amount in the UK National Press but even their figure is £30 billion. So I don't know where you get your figures from. The last figures I remember quoted in the press were £43 billion expenditure and £30 billion revenue, hence the so called £13 billion deficit.
Almost every country in the world run a fiscal deficit. In the UK it's only London and the South East that run a surplus. In England the West country, East Midlands, West midlands, East Anglia, the North East, the North West all run deficits. Westminster borrows the money to cover the deficit of the whole of the UK. So it's not English money, it's borrowed money that adds to the National debt.
Pensions. There will be a gradual change over from day 1 of Independence. From that day Welsh NI contributions would start to be paid into a Welsh treasury (WRC ?) and eventually full Welsh State pensions would be covered by the WRC. | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 17:00 - May 4 with 552 views | trampie |
| Welsh tourism tax on 19:39 - May 1 by Wingstandwood |
You are absolutely bang on about Wales's reliance on English NHS!
May I also add to that the Royal Air force that provides Sea King helicopters that land within the grounds of Morriston Hospital and other Welsh hospitals. They are of vital importance required to take patients to the likes of Queen Elizabeth Hospital Birmingham for liver transplantation. Many other examples of Royal Air Force assistance whether that be natural disasters, search and rescue, and other NHS involvement.
When I previously asked another Welsh Nat on here what would happen with full independence regarding loss of English NHS specialty and RAF hardware/expertise? I got the answer that Welsh patients would then be sent to Europe hospitals using European medivac airlift(s). This is the mentality of some people that we're dealing with here i.e. do not want a modern transport network and neither want a functional NHS operating on Welsh soil.
Staggering! |
Welsh NHS pays for Welsh patients if they are treated in England, it's not free.
The RAF is a UK wide organisation it is not English. |  |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 17:08 - May 4 with 551 views | trampie |
| Welsh tourism tax on 23:18 - Apr 28 by Lorax |
Oh John, as I have already said, nobody knows the true numbers. You can demand that it is much less than we are told but you don't know and until it can be proven it remains purely your best guess.
Now Sterling, we have it as part of the UK, if we left the Uk why would we have a legal right to use it? Scotland has already been told they have no guaranteed right to keep Sterling if they go indy and to and if Westminster allowed them to carry on using it then they are not fully independent, Drakeford has said as much about Wales.
How can you be sure there wouldn't be a hard border? We cannot know what would happen.
The jobs thing, there are apparently a tad over 5000 civil servants in Wales but it's not just civil servants. There's those employed by the military, the police and NHS, when the Westminster tap is turned off who pays for them all and who is responsible for the pensions? The financial situation is a lot more complicated than simply saying we can afford it and the deficit is a lot smaller. |
Sterling is Wales currency, an independent Wales or Scotland has as much right to use it as England, I researched it during the Scottish independence referendum as unionists were scaremongering that Scotland could not use the pound which was and is rubbish.
An independent Scotland or Wales can keep sterling and can keep the Queen as head of state if they like. | |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 18:28 - May 4 with 520 views | Wingstandwood |
| Welsh tourism tax on 17:00 - May 4 by trampie |
Welsh NHS pays for Welsh patients if they are treated in England, it's not free.
The RAF is a UK wide organisation it is not English. |
And under full independence the Welsh NHS will no longer be under the same U.K umbrella meaning English NHS will never ever again be obligated/required to treat Welsh NHS patients coming from a total separate and disconnected entity! U.K NHS family no more!
And I think (that is the Welsh Nats plan ain't it?) that with full independence where Wales would be be charging England for its water? There would be absolute outrage if Welsh patients were to take up English hospital beds, places on English waiting lists whilst using up valuable English NHS time and resources!
Add to that Westminster provided RAF which will be no more either. Oh hang on? Maybe offer to pay ENGLAND because Wales will be in dire straights without England anyhow i.e. hence reliance on English NHS and RAF in the first place.
You see it will take many years to replace, train, construct and reequip lost NHS assistance. After all it has taken decades NOT to build vital Welsh infrastructure! That is how realty will work outside of the looney-tune mind of Welsh Nats with (NOT!) lots of Welsh water to sell to desalinated-plant England ! | |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 18:39 - May 4 with 510 views | trampie |
| Welsh tourism tax on 18:28 - May 4 by Wingstandwood |
And under full independence the Welsh NHS will no longer be under the same U.K umbrella meaning English NHS will never ever again be obligated/required to treat Welsh NHS patients coming from a total separate and disconnected entity! U.K NHS family no more!
And I think (that is the Welsh Nats plan ain't it?) that with full independence where Wales would be be charging England for its water? There would be absolute outrage if Welsh patients were to take up English hospital beds, places on English waiting lists whilst using up valuable English NHS time and resources!
Add to that Westminster provided RAF which will be no more either. Oh hang on? Maybe offer to pay ENGLAND because Wales will be in dire straights without England anyhow i.e. hence reliance on English NHS and RAF in the first place.
You see it will take many years to replace, train, construct and reequip lost NHS assistance. After all it has taken decades NOT to build vital Welsh infrastructure! That is how realty will work outside of the looney-tune mind of Welsh Nats with (NOT!) lots of Welsh water to sell to desalinated-plant England ! |
The English NHS is not obligated/required to treat Welsh NHS patients as it is now, it's purely a business arrangement, we pay them.
The RAF does not belong to England, Welsh taxpayers pay towards it, there are base's in Wales and Welsh people work for the RAF, you are falling into the trap of thinking everything belongs to England, the currency, the Queen, the military, the civil service etc etc, it doesn't. [Post edited 4 May 2022 18:41]
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| Welsh tourism tax on 18:43 - May 4 with 498 views | Wingstandwood |
| Welsh tourism tax on 18:39 - May 4 by trampie |
The English NHS is not obligated/required to treat Welsh NHS patients as it is now, it's purely a business arrangement, we pay them.
The RAF does not belong to England, Welsh taxpayers pay towards it, there are base's in Wales and Welsh people work for the RAF, you are falling into the trap of thinking everything belongs to England, the currency, the Queen, the military, the civil service etc etc, it doesn't. [Post edited 4 May 2022 18:41]
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Oh its a business arrangement?  | |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 18:48 - May 4 with 489 views | johnlangy |
For some reason that link wouldn't open at first. But it did just now.
'17p out of every £1 we spend in Wales comes from Welsh taxes.
The other taxes are raised by the UK Government and apply to the whole of the UK,
including Wales'.
I imagine that 17p quote is where you get your £17 billion from. She's worded that so badly. The second part presumably refers to VAT and other taxes which is raised at a UK level and registered in England when it includes Welsh VAT.
I can only repeat myself here. Every time the UK press quotes the Revenue/Expenditure figures they give a figure much larger than £17 billion. As I said, the last time I saw it they quoted £30 billion. | | | |
| Welsh tourism tax on 18:50 - May 4 with 487 views | trampie |
| Welsh tourism tax on 18:43 - May 4 by Wingstandwood |
Oh its a business arrangement? |
Yes it's a business arrangement, the Welsh NHS pays the English NHS to treat Welsh patients.
There is rational for that mind you, it might not be worth the investment to buy certain machines etc due to population size, but more cost efficient for us to let the English buy the machines and pay them when we need the use of them.
If we get independence no doubt we would have a similar arrangement, they are unlikely to turn our cash down, the English are a very capitalist group. | |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 19:36 - May 4 with 470 views | 73__73 |
| Welsh tourism tax on 18:39 - May 4 by trampie |
The English NHS is not obligated/required to treat Welsh NHS patients as it is now, it's purely a business arrangement, we pay them.
The RAF does not belong to England, Welsh taxpayers pay towards it, there are base's in Wales and Welsh people work for the RAF, you are falling into the trap of thinking everything belongs to England, the currency, the Queen, the military, the civil service etc etc, it doesn't. [Post edited 4 May 2022 18:41]
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Who owns the £2.2 trillion of U.K. national debt ?
£100 billion belongs to Wales. Independence is something wales could never afford. | |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 19:47 - May 4 with 451 views | Wingstandwood |
| Welsh tourism tax on 19:36 - May 4 by 73__73 |
Who owns the £2.2 trillion of U.K. national debt ?
£100 billion belongs to Wales. Independence is something wales could never afford. |
Capitalist England as described by Trampie will undoubtedly demand immediate pay back because that is how capitalist England works I guess? | |
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| Welsh tourism tax on 19:47 - May 4 with 450 views | trampie |
| Welsh tourism tax on 19:36 - May 4 by 73__73 |
Who owns the £2.2 trillion of U.K. national debt ?
£100 billion belongs to Wales. Independence is something wales could never afford. |
75% of the debt is owed to ourselves, pension funds being the main case in point. | |
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