| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 12:46 - Jan 19 with 767 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 12:28 - Jan 19 by Sirjohnalot |
If someone has gone to the extent of having the operation, surely that makes then that sex ? (Not talking about competing in sport but generally ) |
If you spray paint an orange a nice shade of green - does it become an apple?
It’s about reality not effort. |  |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 13:23 - Jan 19 with 726 views | Sirjohnalot |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 12:46 - Jan 19 by Dr_Parnassus |
If you spray paint an orange a nice shade of green - does it become an apple?
It’s about reality not effort. |
Wow, not sure how to reply to that, my God |  | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 14:10 - Jan 19 with 670 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 13:23 - Jan 19 by Sirjohnalot |
Wow, not sure how to reply to that, my God |
With some semblance of reason would be a start.
I think the point is pretty obvious. Changing the appearance of something does not change what it is. | |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 15:50 - Jan 19 with 614 views | STID2017 |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 13:23 - Jan 19 by Sirjohnalot |
Wow, not sure how to reply to that, my God |
As you say if someone has had an operation to change gender, then that should be respected.
Some sadly do not have the moral compass or human compassion to understand what that person went through before undergoing the change.
Not all are as understanding as you John |  |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 15:52 - Jan 19 with 600 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 15:50 - Jan 19 by STID2017 |
As you say if someone has had an operation to change gender, then that should be respected.
Some sadly do not have the moral compass or human compassion to understand what that person went through before undergoing the change.
Not all are as understanding as you John |
It’s nothing to do with morals or compassion, it’s about reality.
If I went through an operation to have bunny ears on my head, I wouldn’t actually be a rabbit. I would be having surgery to appear as one.
You can disagree with science if you like. | |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 16:03 - Jan 19 with 583 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Prime example:
This bloke had operations to appear like a cat, he felt he was one and trapped in the wrong body.
Do we pretend he’s now a cat?
Or do we say it as it is, say he’s a bloke trying to appear as a cat?
We can be idiotic, or realistic. I always choose the latter. | |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 16:38 - Jan 19 with 566 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 16:03 - Jan 19 by Dr_Parnassus |
Prime example:
This bloke had operations to appear like a cat, he felt he was one and trapped in the wrong body.
Do we pretend he’s now a cat?
Or do we say it as it is, say he’s a bloke trying to appear as a cat?
We can be idiotic, or realistic. I always choose the latter. |
Well obviously you cannot change species, that is idiotic and the NHS wouldn't do that for you, would they? |  | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 16:46 - Jan 19 with 550 views | STID2017 |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 16:38 - Jan 19 by SullutaCreturned |
Well obviously you cannot change species, that is idiotic and the NHS wouldn't do that for you, would they? |
Someone comparing a human being trying to be a better version of themselves for their sanity and happiness to someone who apparently has attempted to change species clearly has no grasp of the situation and of humanity, whoever they are | |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 16:47 - Jan 19 with 540 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 16:38 - Jan 19 by SullutaCreturned |
Well obviously you cannot change species, that is idiotic and the NHS wouldn't do that for you, would they? |
If you can change sex then why can’t you change species?
If we say you can change natural biology simply due to appearance after surgery, then where does the difference come in? | |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 17:34 - Jan 19 with 515 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 16:47 - Jan 19 by Dr_Parnassus |
If you can change sex then why can’t you change species?
If we say you can change natural biology simply due to appearance after surgery, then where does the difference come in? |
You can make someones face look like a cat but you cannot give them the physical ability of a cat.
You can make someone look like a woman, or man, and they can have the ability of that section of humanity.
No human being can put their head behind their knee and lick their own bum. | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 17:38 - Jan 19 with 501 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 17:34 - Jan 19 by SullutaCreturned |
You can make someones face look like a cat but you cannot give them the physical ability of a cat.
You can make someone look like a woman, or man, and they can have the ability of that section of humanity.
No human being can put their head behind their knee and lick their own bum. |
So if someone took out their bottom ribs to be able to do that, would you say they were a cat then?
As I said on another thread, what you biologically are is set when you are created. So much so, scientists can tell what sex you were long after death with zero flesh on your body.
So if we can counter act that scientific identity just based on appearance, then we can do it for anything. Species, age, sex… you name it.
There is literally no difference at all other than modern social acceptance. | |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 19:32 - Jan 19 with 470 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 17:38 - Jan 19 by Dr_Parnassus |
So if someone took out their bottom ribs to be able to do that, would you say they were a cat then?
As I said on another thread, what you biologically are is set when you are created. So much so, scientists can tell what sex you were long after death with zero flesh on your body.
So if we can counter act that scientific identity just based on appearance, then we can do it for anything. Species, age, sex… you name it.
There is literally no difference at all other than modern social acceptance. |
You know, I'm not really 100% with this transgender stuff msyself, I think we need more checks and balances BUT if someone is suffering and the only way for them to be happy is to go trans then why not?
There are some species out there that change gender, admittedly they don't need surgery to do it though. The big thing for me though, and as it goes it's my only real ambition thses days is that people deserve a chance to be happy. Any big decisions in my life are alwys met by that question first, will it make me happier.
If Transgendering makes people happier and spreads love not hate then let them do it I say. just not at 16! | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:04 - Jan 19 with 449 views | Luther27 |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 19:32 - Jan 19 by SullutaCreturned |
You know, I'm not really 100% with this transgender stuff msyself, I think we need more checks and balances BUT if someone is suffering and the only way for them to be happy is to go trans then why not?
There are some species out there that change gender, admittedly they don't need surgery to do it though. The big thing for me though, and as it goes it's my only real ambition thses days is that people deserve a chance to be happy. Any big decisions in my life are alwys met by that question first, will it make me happier.
If Transgendering makes people happier and spreads love not hate then let them do it I say. just not at 16! |
My opinion is let them/it/him/her/whatever do what they like but don’t rely on the NHS to put their requirements over someone who needs medical attention to stay alive. If they want to pay for it fine, but I refuse to bow or agree to a healthy fit person being granted hospital time at the expense of someone suffering a debilitating disease whatever form that takes.
I also do not agree with male/female transgender participation in female sports no matter what sport that is. If they wish to compete against men well that’s fine. | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:16 - Jan 19 with 430 views | Sirjohnalot |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:04 - Jan 19 by Luther27 |
My opinion is let them/it/him/her/whatever do what they like but don’t rely on the NHS to put their requirements over someone who needs medical attention to stay alive. If they want to pay for it fine, but I refuse to bow or agree to a healthy fit person being granted hospital time at the expense of someone suffering a debilitating disease whatever form that takes.
I also do not agree with male/female transgender participation in female sports no matter what sport that is. If they wish to compete against men well that’s fine. |
People who go through the agony of a sex change operation must be so desperate for it that they need to operation. People have killed themselves and certainly tried it due to agony of being born inside the wrong body. I can’t imagine the turmoil that must cause.
Participation in competitive which just doesn’t rely on skill is a different question but don’t think there’s anything wrong in the nhs paying for it. Could be argued that they are more deserving than someone like George Best who drank himself to death. It’s not cosmetic surgery. These people are desperate | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:30 - Jan 19 with 407 views | Dr_Winston |
I have absolutely no problem with someone who is post-op being treated as a woman in general. There remain questions about involvement in sport, but for the most part if you're prepared to go that far then to me you've earned it.
There are however far too many out there who seem to think that putting on a frock and a bit of lippy entitles them to be treated the same way as biological women and frankly this nonsense has gone far enough. If you've got a cock you're not a woman. These people need to be stopped, and so do those who encourage confused young kids to take steps that they can't take back. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:32 - Jan 19 with 405 views | Flashberryjack |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:16 - Jan 19 by Sirjohnalot |
People who go through the agony of a sex change operation must be so desperate for it that they need to operation. People have killed themselves and certainly tried it due to agony of being born inside the wrong body. I can’t imagine the turmoil that must cause.
Participation in competitive which just doesn’t rely on skill is a different question but don’t think there’s anything wrong in the nhs paying for it. Could be argued that they are more deserving than someone like George Best who drank himself to death. It’s not cosmetic surgery. These people are desperate |
Tell that to someone waiting for a hip replacement after years of being crippled in agony, and then being told he has to wait a further 5 years for a hip replacement operation, I'm sure they'll agree with you. |  |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:34 - Jan 19 with 397 views | Sirjohnalot |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:32 - Jan 19 by Flashberryjack |
Tell that to someone waiting for a hip replacement after years of being crippled in agony, and then being told he has to wait a further 5 years for a hip replacement operation, I'm sure they'll agree with you. |
The delays are caused by countless years of Tory cuts plus brexit meaning many European staff leaving not a low number of desperate people wanting a sex change operation. | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:37 - Jan 19 with 391 views | Luther27 |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:16 - Jan 19 by Sirjohnalot |
People who go through the agony of a sex change operation must be so desperate for it that they need to operation. People have killed themselves and certainly tried it due to agony of being born inside the wrong body. I can’t imagine the turmoil that must cause.
Participation in competitive which just doesn’t rely on skill is a different question but don’t think there’s anything wrong in the nhs paying for it. Could be argued that they are more deserving than someone like George Best who drank himself to death. It’s not cosmetic surgery. These people are desperate |
I would refuse point blank to let my daughter play football or rugby against a transgender opponent on the grounds of her safety. She has rights to her safety as well.
Again I make the point SJ how far does the NHS budget stretch? How many ex servicemen for instance have committed suicide because of lack of help. How many male farmers have to die before they receive help? How many pensioners have to die in agony whilst waiting for an ambulance due to lack of NHS funding?
No…the NHS budget has to be prioritised to people who suffer life threatening conditions. As I said if anyone wishes to pay for sex change let them do so. | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:49 - Jan 19 with 374 views | Luther27 |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:34 - Jan 19 by Sirjohnalot |
The delays are caused by countless years of Tory cuts plus brexit meaning many European staff leaving not a low number of desperate people wanting a sex change operation. |
Rubbish. Covid has nothing to do with it? Nurses being burnt out and leaving the profession has nothing to do with it? Are you really advocating cheap European labour to save the NHS SJ because it’s a lot cheaper employing personnel from the East. | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:51 - Jan 19 with 374 views | Sirjohnalot |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:37 - Jan 19 by Luther27 |
I would refuse point blank to let my daughter play football or rugby against a transgender opponent on the grounds of her safety. She has rights to her safety as well.
Again I make the point SJ how far does the NHS budget stretch? How many ex servicemen for instance have committed suicide because of lack of help. How many male farmers have to die before they receive help? How many pensioners have to die in agony whilst waiting for an ambulance due to lack of NHS funding?
No…the NHS budget has to be prioritised to people who suffer life threatening conditions. As I said if anyone wishes to pay for sex change let them do so. |
I agree with you re football, rugby, boxing etc. Stands to reason.
Isn’t it a question of lack of funding ? Lack of social care as many European staff have gone and beds are now blocked ? None of those people should be waiting, but people go to the extent of having a sex change have killed themselves in the past, due to the agony of living in a body that’s not yours. I can’t imagine what that’s like, truly believing you’re living a lie.
It would create a two tier system where rich people could afford it but people who grew up in the same area as me would forever be trapped. Gvnt have killed the nhs, they could afford it. | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 22:00 - Jan 19 with 363 views | Luther27 |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:51 - Jan 19 by Sirjohnalot |
I agree with you re football, rugby, boxing etc. Stands to reason.
Isn’t it a question of lack of funding ? Lack of social care as many European staff have gone and beds are now blocked ? None of those people should be waiting, but people go to the extent of having a sex change have killed themselves in the past, due to the agony of living in a body that’s not yours. I can’t imagine what that’s like, truly believing you’re living a lie.
It would create a two tier system where rich people could afford it but people who grew up in the same area as me would forever be trapped. Gvnt have killed the nhs, they could afford it. |
As FBJ stated try living in physical pain to the point of being unable to move out of your home for up to ten years….years of agony and pain to the point of wanting to end it all…and yet the cure is a relatively simple procedure of joint replacement. Just imagine that.
However you can achieve relief if you go private. So…there already is a two tier system here already, and has been for quite a long time actually. So…where would you advocate the NHS spend our money? Who would you prioritise? Somewhere along the line someone has to make these decisions without being blinkered by the oh so fashionable media lovies. | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 22:11 - Jan 19 with 359 views | BryanSwan |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 12:28 - Jan 19 by Sirjohnalot |
If someone has gone to the extent of having the operation, surely that makes then that sex ? (Not talking about competing in sport but generally ) |
Sex refers to the biological make up of an individual, that is something that cannot be changed. Unless you are having the very cells of your body changed you can never change that.
Gender is something more open to change and based more so on how people identify. In which case if someone wished to be referred to as X Y or Z I would do so as that is up to them really. | |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 22:30 - Jan 19 with 346 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 19:32 - Jan 19 by SullutaCreturned |
You know, I'm not really 100% with this transgender stuff msyself, I think we need more checks and balances BUT if someone is suffering and the only way for them to be happy is to go trans then why not?
There are some species out there that change gender, admittedly they don't need surgery to do it though. The big thing for me though, and as it goes it's my only real ambition thses days is that people deserve a chance to be happy. Any big decisions in my life are alwys met by that question first, will it make me happier.
If Transgendering makes people happier and spreads love not hate then let them do it I say. just not at 16! |
No reason at all.
But that’s not the discussion, the discussion is surrounding the changing of language, largely due to the pressure of political activists, to de-gender it. | |
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| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 22:49 - Jan 19 with 332 views | Sirjohnalot |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 22:00 - Jan 19 by Luther27 |
As FBJ stated try living in physical pain to the point of being unable to move out of your home for up to ten years….years of agony and pain to the point of wanting to end it all…and yet the cure is a relatively simple procedure of joint replacement. Just imagine that.
However you can achieve relief if you go private. So…there already is a two tier system here already, and has been for quite a long time actually. So…where would you advocate the NHS spend our money? Who would you prioritise? Somewhere along the line someone has to make these decisions without being blinkered by the oh so fashionable media lovies. |
If I can try to answer both of you gents.
It’s an impossible question to answer isn’t it really re prioritising patients. Anyone who is desperate physically or mentally needs help. Respectfully, I don’t think a low number of people seeking to have a sex change is the reason why people who desolately require hip replacements are waiting many years.
What would I do ? Reach out to our European cousins, relax the visa requirements and bring back the care and nursing staff that we lost due to Brexit, getting more people into the care sector this freeing up beds. Working and negotiate with the nhs staff on pay. Increase the tax of cigarettes and alcohol to help pay for it. The added tax from the staff coming over and working will also assist. Go after the big business that avoid tax, and the multi millionaires like Sunak and Mogg who move companies to Ireland and know how to milk the system. Very rich people in gvnt have no incentive to tighten up taxes.
Don’t shift the blame to desperate people, with half my family in the nhs and my mum reliant on her wonderful carers who get paid a pittance, I’m well aware of our creaking nhs. | | | |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 22:50 - Jan 19 with 331 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Where’s the hand Cart, let’s go to hell ? on 21:16 - Jan 19 by Sirjohnalot |
People who go through the agony of a sex change operation must be so desperate for it that they need to operation. People have killed themselves and certainly tried it due to agony of being born inside the wrong body. I can’t imagine the turmoil that must cause.
Participation in competitive which just doesn’t rely on skill is a different question but don’t think there’s anything wrong in the nhs paying for it. Could be argued that they are more deserving than someone like George Best who drank himself to death. It’s not cosmetic surgery. These people are desperate |
I believe suicide rates are the same pre and post op. So it’s a fallacy really.
The suicide rates are higher than opposed Jews in world war 2. That shows the extent of the condition. It’s awful.
But it’s a mental issue that needs treating, rather than worldwide pandering and creating a false world where we ignore science just to play into that. People can do as they like of course, if they believe it will make them feel better.
However the evidence suggests it’s not really helping, in fact some research shows suicide rates to be higher post op than pre op by up to 20%. Because again, changing physical appearance doesn’t change biology.
So with that in mind - let’s not de gender the whole language to play into the false narrative that people can change their sex.
They can’t and we shouldn’t be pretending they can.
They CAN appear as the opposite sex though.
That’s not in the least bit controversial. | |
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