| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility 08:27 - Nov 5 with 967 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
Last March I talked to a man in Singleton Park who had a son working on the Covid ward in Merthyr. His son was convinced there was a genetic element to Covid, he saw similar people with similar health affected very differently. Research is now backing this up.
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01773-7 |  |
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| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 09:35 - Nov 5 with 938 views | Professor |
We had some discussion over this last year-it's an area I've worked in on Livestock for 20 years and we have huge advantages to identify resistance loci using inbred animals. It's a tremendous achievement to get such a GWAS study (Genome Wide Association Study) with the sample numbers and coverage in a short time -but lots of hands, brains and computing power.
There are some very interesting genes in there including for chemokines (signalling proteins) involved in inflammatory responses and interestingly a link to a gene called FOXP3. This is a key marker of regulatory T cells-the cell type that controls inflammation. A defect here may lead to failure to control damage during infection. Very much ties with the pathology of severe Covid.
It's an impressive piece of work |  | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 09:38 - Nov 5 with 934 views | controversial_jack |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 09:35 - Nov 5 by Professor |
We had some discussion over this last year-it's an area I've worked in on Livestock for 20 years and we have huge advantages to identify resistance loci using inbred animals. It's a tremendous achievement to get such a GWAS study (Genome Wide Association Study) with the sample numbers and coverage in a short time -but lots of hands, brains and computing power.
There are some very interesting genes in there including for chemokines (signalling proteins) involved in inflammatory responses and interestingly a link to a gene called FOXP3. This is a key marker of regulatory T cells-the cell type that controls inflammation. A defect here may lead to failure to control damage during infection. Very much ties with the pathology of severe Covid.
It's an impressive piece of work |
There was at one time, speculation that different blood groups were more susceptible to severe infection than others. Not heard anything about this since then. | | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 10:20 - Nov 5 with 913 views | Professor |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 09:38 - Nov 5 by controversial_jack |
There was at one time, speculation that different blood groups were more susceptible to severe infection than others. Not heard anything about this since then. |
It was suggested-but seems to be a bit of a red herring. There are links to some diseases-usually those involving infection of red blood cells where the blood groups antigens are receptors for infection. | | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 16:00 - Nov 5 with 855 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 09:38 - Nov 5 by controversial_jack |
There was at one time, speculation that different blood groups were more susceptible to severe infection than others. Not heard anything about this since then. |
On the Oxford vaccines thread you said
"There is no such thing as negative (adaptive) immunity. Whilst uncontrolled innate immunity is a common cause of pathology, adaptive responses increasing transmission is fanciful and frankly made up. There can be rare incidences of antibody or T cells enhancing disease (which is what AFD was suckered into believing by 'Dodgy' Dolores.
The vaccines don't simply stop working either-there is a decline in immunity, but to be frank this is still above a level we would have been happy with when starting out. It's complete idiocy. "
and
"1. What is your hypothesis of any mechanism that could be causing immunosupression here, 'cos there's not one in the literature.
2. Why you think you know more than trained experts, or why you are plain stupid to think it's all lies and a conspiracy?"
and
"I only know of one vaccine (a live attenuated one) that causes any loss of immune function, but since the virulent virus does this to an extreme, then its use is justifiable.
So what do you think of this quote from a recent study.
"the BNT162b2 vaccine also modulated the production of inflammatory cytokines by innate immune cells upon stimulation with both specific (SARS-CoV-2) and non-specific (viral, fungal and bacterial) stimuli. The response of innate immune cells to TLR4 and TLR7/8 ligands was lower after BNT162b2 vaccination, while fungi-induced cytokine responses were stronger. In conclusion, the mRNA BNT162b2 vaccine induces complex functional reprogramming of innate immune responses" | | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 16:43 - Nov 5 with 837 views | Professor |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 16:00 - Nov 5 by A_Fans_Dad |
On the Oxford vaccines thread you said
"There is no such thing as negative (adaptive) immunity. Whilst uncontrolled innate immunity is a common cause of pathology, adaptive responses increasing transmission is fanciful and frankly made up. There can be rare incidences of antibody or T cells enhancing disease (which is what AFD was suckered into believing by 'Dodgy' Dolores.
The vaccines don't simply stop working either-there is a decline in immunity, but to be frank this is still above a level we would have been happy with when starting out. It's complete idiocy. "
and
"1. What is your hypothesis of any mechanism that could be causing immunosupression here, 'cos there's not one in the literature.
2. Why you think you know more than trained experts, or why you are plain stupid to think it's all lies and a conspiracy?"
and
"I only know of one vaccine (a live attenuated one) that causes any loss of immune function, but since the virulent virus does this to an extreme, then its use is justifiable.
So what do you think of this quote from a recent study.
"the BNT162b2 vaccine also modulated the production of inflammatory cytokines by innate immune cells upon stimulation with both specific (SARS-CoV-2) and non-specific (viral, fungal and bacterial) stimuli. The response of innate immune cells to TLR4 and TLR7/8 ligands was lower after BNT162b2 vaccination, while fungi-induced cytokine responses were stronger. In conclusion, the mRNA BNT162b2 vaccine induces complex functional reprogramming of innate immune responses" |
Oh my giddy aunt. That’s not reducing immunity-it’s enhanced . A fairly recent phenomenon where certain pathogens or vaccines (usually live attenuated) stimulate multiple pattern recognition receptors in cells leading to short term ‘memory’ in cells that we did not consider had any. It’s not an amenestic response like lymphocytes . It’s non specific, but generally considered a benefit of flu vaccines as enhances general immune function
All vaccines have to cause a little inflammation/innate activation as a ‘danger’ stimulus is needed to start the adaptive pathways. In many vaccines this is achieved using adjuvants and The reason sub unit vaccines rarely work well.
Very few people understand immunology well, so don’t feel too bad! | | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 17:00 - Nov 5 with 824 views | felixstowe_jack |
Just get vaccinated it save people catching it, spreading it, being hospitalised, being in ICU and dying.
You know it makes sense. | |
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| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 17:08 - Nov 5 with 820 views | Catullus |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 16:43 - Nov 5 by Professor |
Oh my giddy aunt. That’s not reducing immunity-it’s enhanced . A fairly recent phenomenon where certain pathogens or vaccines (usually live attenuated) stimulate multiple pattern recognition receptors in cells leading to short term ‘memory’ in cells that we did not consider had any. It’s not an amenestic response like lymphocytes . It’s non specific, but generally considered a benefit of flu vaccines as enhances general immune function
All vaccines have to cause a little inflammation/innate activation as a ‘danger’ stimulus is needed to start the adaptive pathways. In many vaccines this is achieved using adjuvants and The reason sub unit vaccines rarely work well.
Very few people understand immunology well, so don’t feel too bad! |
The first paragraph went way over my head. the second I can get my noggin around, mostly. Even so I googled it (Subunit vaccine) to make sure I understood. as much as I can.
A subunit vaccine is a vaccine that contains purified parts of the pathogen that are antigenic, or necessary to elicit a protective immune response. A "subunit" vaccine doesn't contain the whole pathogen, unlike live attenuated or inactivated vaccine, but contains only the antigenic parts such as proteins, polysaccharides or peptides. Because the vaccine doesn't contain "live" components of the pathogen, there is no risk of introducing the disease, and is safer and more stable than vaccine containing whole pathogens. Other advantages include being well-established technology and being suitable for immunocompromised individuals. Disadvantages include being relatively complex to manufacture compared to some vaccines, possibly requiring adjuvants and booster shots, and requiring time to examine which antigenic combinations may work best | |
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| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 17:22 - Nov 5 with 816 views | Flynnidine_Zidownes |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 09:35 - Nov 5 by Professor |
We had some discussion over this last year-it's an area I've worked in on Livestock for 20 years and we have huge advantages to identify resistance loci using inbred animals. It's a tremendous achievement to get such a GWAS study (Genome Wide Association Study) with the sample numbers and coverage in a short time -but lots of hands, brains and computing power.
There are some very interesting genes in there including for chemokines (signalling proteins) involved in inflammatory responses and interestingly a link to a gene called FOXP3. This is a key marker of regulatory T cells-the cell type that controls inflammation. A defect here may lead to failure to control damage during infection. Very much ties with the pathology of severe Covid.
It's an impressive piece of work |
Professor this may not be on topic to this thread but since you’re here I’ll ask it anyway. With the recent news about them finding a definitive link between the HPV virus and cervical cancer is there a chance that other forms of cancers may be linked with or triggered by viral infections? And if so with the progress and development of antiviral medicine improving all the time will we ever have vaccines that reduce the risks of other cancers? That would be a massive achievement.
Also re: your comment about using inbred animals, do you ever face criticism for deliberately inbreeding animals? Surprised you don’t have the PETA lot trying to bomb your house 💣 | | | |
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| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 17:24 - Nov 5 with 815 views | Catullus |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 17:22 - Nov 5 by Flynnidine_Zidownes |
Professor this may not be on topic to this thread but since you’re here I’ll ask it anyway. With the recent news about them finding a definitive link between the HPV virus and cervical cancer is there a chance that other forms of cancers may be linked with or triggered by viral infections? And if so with the progress and development of antiviral medicine improving all the time will we ever have vaccines that reduce the risks of other cancers? That would be a massive achievement.
Also re: your comment about using inbred animals, do you ever face criticism for deliberately inbreeding animals? Surprised you don’t have the PETA lot trying to bomb your house 💣 |
Don't tell them where he lives for pete's sake  | |
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| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 18:53 - Nov 5 with 770 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 16:43 - Nov 5 by Professor |
Oh my giddy aunt. That’s not reducing immunity-it’s enhanced . A fairly recent phenomenon where certain pathogens or vaccines (usually live attenuated) stimulate multiple pattern recognition receptors in cells leading to short term ‘memory’ in cells that we did not consider had any. It’s not an amenestic response like lymphocytes . It’s non specific, but generally considered a benefit of flu vaccines as enhances general immune function
All vaccines have to cause a little inflammation/innate activation as a ‘danger’ stimulus is needed to start the adaptive pathways. In many vaccines this is achieved using adjuvants and The reason sub unit vaccines rarely work well.
Very few people understand immunology well, so don’t feel too bad! |
I don't feel bad at all.
How about you?
Did you miss this or ignore it?
"The response of innate immune cells to TLR4 and TLR7/8 ligands was lower after BNT162b2 vaccination," | | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 23:15 - Nov 5 with 736 views | Professor |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 17:22 - Nov 5 by Flynnidine_Zidownes |
Professor this may not be on topic to this thread but since you’re here I’ll ask it anyway. With the recent news about them finding a definitive link between the HPV virus and cervical cancer is there a chance that other forms of cancers may be linked with or triggered by viral infections? And if so with the progress and development of antiviral medicine improving all the time will we ever have vaccines that reduce the risks of other cancers? That would be a massive achievement.
Also re: your comment about using inbred animals, do you ever face criticism for deliberately inbreeding animals? Surprised you don’t have the PETA lot trying to bomb your house 💣 |
Yes. Absolutely the case. Some cancers and lymphomas are due to viruses.
Working on chickens there are two examples - Rous Sarcoma and Mareks which cause muscle cancer and lymphoma respectively
As for the second part. Yes, it is an issue. I am very open about what I do and my work is given as a case study of using animals in research on the university (Liverpool) website. That said having been targeted as part of a Facebook campaign against using animals in research last year was not a good experience and worrying for the younger scientists who work with me , some with very young kids. | | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 23:49 - Nov 5 with 719 views | Professor |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 23:15 - Nov 5 by Professor |
Yes. Absolutely the case. Some cancers and lymphomas are due to viruses.
Working on chickens there are two examples - Rous Sarcoma and Mareks which cause muscle cancer and lymphoma respectively
As for the second part. Yes, it is an issue. I am very open about what I do and my work is given as a case study of using animals in research on the university (Liverpool) website. That said having been targeted as part of a Facebook campaign against using animals in research last year was not a good experience and worrying for the younger scientists who work with me , some with very young kids. |
Sorry-
I don’t know so much about anti-virals. I really work on bacteria to be honest
As viruses use the host cell to replicate finding a therapeutic target can be hard without huge potential side effects. Bacteria have clear targets in their cell structure which many antibiotics use. The exception in viruses are retroviruses like HIV which have a clear target- an enzyme called reverse transcriptase.
That said we are getting better at identifying targets in viruses so what you suggest may well happen | | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 09:00 - Nov 6 with 660 views | Professor |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 17:22 - Nov 5 by Flynnidine_Zidownes |
Professor this may not be on topic to this thread but since you’re here I’ll ask it anyway. With the recent news about them finding a definitive link between the HPV virus and cervical cancer is there a chance that other forms of cancers may be linked with or triggered by viral infections? And if so with the progress and development of antiviral medicine improving all the time will we ever have vaccines that reduce the risks of other cancers? That would be a massive achievement.
Also re: your comment about using inbred animals, do you ever face criticism for deliberately inbreeding animals? Surprised you don’t have the PETA lot trying to bomb your house 💣 |
And yes, there are moves to develop vaccines against a specific tumour types too. Again not something I know much about, but a big research area. Much more money in cancer than infection | | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 11:17 - Nov 7 with 591 views | CountyJim |
There's one bloke on ICU where I work he's been working the whole pandemic never caught it
No Matter how hard you try with all the PPE etc everyone else on the ward has caught it
Would be interesting if they did tests on him because he could be immune who knows
Well done him by the way |  | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 11:45 - Nov 7 with 579 views | Flynnidine_Zidownes |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 09:00 - Nov 6 by Professor |
And yes, there are moves to develop vaccines against a specific tumour types too. Again not something I know much about, but a big research area. Much more money in cancer than infection |
I suppose if any scientist or institution finally comes up with a serious way of severely lowering the effect of cancer in this world they’ll be held up in history in the same light as other world famous medical pioneers such as Jenner, Curie and Crippen.
Perhaps not the last one but a vaccine against the most prolific types of cancer would save billions. | | | |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 13:31 - Nov 7 with 556 views | Catullus |
| Covid - Genetic Susceptibility on 11:17 - Nov 7 by CountyJim |
There's one bloke on ICU where I work he's been working the whole pandemic never caught it
No Matter how hard you try with all the PPE etc everyone else on the ward has caught it
Would be interesting if they did tests on him because he could be immune who knows
Well done him by the way |
My supposition was that some people would have a natural immunity. I couldn't be sure but I once read an article about cancer and how some people carry a protective gene so their family rarely get cancers of certain types whereas other people have a weakness in that area and can get various cancers. Well, I have a vague memory of that anyway, hopefully it's not complete BS!
I've always believed that some people/families will be more susceptible to various illnesses whilst others will be generally more healthy.
Take my wife's family, on her mothers side there is a lot of epilepsy. In my family, on my fathers side heart problems and I have high blood pressure and am already on statins. As my GP put it, might as well get ahead of the curve! My mothers side got bad arthritis (me too, fantastic!) but tended to live to decent ages, late 80's and 90's.
So a genetic strength or weakness seems a realistic thing to me, maybe one day the scientists can isolate the strengths and reproduce them for mass consumption! | |
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