| Time to win ugly and shore up 21:56 - Oct 2 with 3817 views | bosh67 |
Smithies, the posts and our own poor defensive organisation cost us again tonight. As much as I really enjoy the way this side has a real go hopefully Warburton and staff can teach this team to be solid at the back and occasionally, when needed, win ugly. I think fans will put up with a few industrial wins and understand that you can't always play and win pretty. Warnock was very cute about doing that and I am sure Warburton will look at the last few games and hopefully realise that an occasional 1-0 win really is a way to make this team better.
Not letting the curse of lost confidence taking hold is also key. [Post edited 2 Oct 2019 21:56]
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 10:56 - Oct 3 with 1056 views | WestbourneR |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 10:54 - Oct 3 by stevec |
This is true but in the last two games we've come up against possibly the two best centre half pairings in the Division.
Hugill's not been given a single chance and has been bullied off the park by giants, no real fault in that. Wells doesn't look entirely fit either.
That put a huge onus on Eze, Chair and BOS and scoring wise, none of them are prolific. |
This is true Steve.
Have to mention again that Leistner was superb for long periods. He's absolutely on fire with his forward passing.
Shame about some of the defending... |  |
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:03 - Oct 3 with 1038 views | daveB |
always a balance with QPR or any team. We weren't world beaters after winning 4 games and we're not crap after losing 2. In all likelihood we'll finish mid table this season so you can expect these kind of ups and downs all season, key will be making sure the downs don't last too long and we don't do the same as we have under last few managers in not being able to get out of a bad run |  | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:10 - Oct 3 with 1022 views | PinnerPaul |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 22:08 - Oct 2 by ted_hendrix |
Disagree that we need to win ugly, as I've waffled on about it before we must stop conceding goals as we're now up to 23 conceded.
We've got some cracking good and intelligent players easily mid table but tonight we got a good punch in the gob on the pitch, you can hit the post a million times it means nothing.
The result tonight stinks the performance apart from the defending doesn't.
If you offered me a 0-0 Saturday against the dreaded Blackburn I'd take it all day long.
Back on the training pitch tomorrow first thing please. |
They will be on the motorway 1st thing - MW said they wouldn't get back until lunchtime today. |  | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:10 - Oct 3 with 1023 views | WestbourneR |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:03 - Oct 3 by daveB |
always a balance with QPR or any team. We weren't world beaters after winning 4 games and we're not crap after losing 2. In all likelihood we'll finish mid table this season so you can expect these kind of ups and downs all season, key will be making sure the downs don't last too long and we don't do the same as we have under last few managers in not being able to get out of a bad run |
I think we're better than mid-table but too powder puff for top six. I'll say 7th.
We're a couple of 'in their prime' streetwise pros away from being a very good team.
Centre mid still looks like an issue. It'll be interesting to see if Matt Smith or Luke Amos can ultimately do the biz there. That was surely the plan at the start of the season. | |
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:14 - Oct 3 with 1014 views | PinnerPaul |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 08:08 - Oct 3 by nix |
This.
We also have to bear in mind we didn't have two of our centre backs available. And maybe they do more than we realised in terms of closing down space, marking people, cutting out balls etc. It could be that we noticed the Barbet howlers but not the positive work he does, I know we have been letting goals in with him playing too but the first two goals yesterday were absolutely pants.
Also the last two matches were against teams who play a bit ugly themselves, particularly at the back. With ginormous and very physical centre backs. Our forward players need to learn how to get round and through those kind of teams. Our fans need to make more noise when our players are fouled, like other teams do. West Brom fans definitely won a couple of free kicks and bookings that wouldn't have happened otherwise by howling in protest. Bookings make a difference because our defenders then have to think every time before going for a tackle. Not all teams play those tactics.
MW isn't that kind of manager. He wants to play good football. The upside is the first half against Luton. And the fact we're enjoying watching us again. The downside is we may not win certain matches. But even he said we need everyone really firing to beat the better teams. And we won't see them at their best every match.
Personally I think we should try and relax a bit. It's Cardiff away and WBA at home. Not necessarily two matches we'd expect to win. |
Can't agree with the cautions v WBA, in fact both Hugill and Manning could have easily seen yellow on another day. | | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:17 - Oct 3 with 1008 views | PinnerPaul |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 09:47 - Oct 3 by 2Thomas2Bowles |
Neil Warnock after the game.
The Championship is about winning games… |
I hate those sort of quotes
and every other league in the world gives you points for losing? | | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:17 - Oct 3 with 1008 views | TacticalR |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 09:09 - Oct 3 by R_from_afar |
Your post touches on something I was thinking. We simply have to be more clinical. Yes, we have shipped five goals in two games but be that as it may, we have failed to hit the back of the net.
We have to work on being more clinical so we score while we are on top. This is vital because like 99% of teams (exceptions being teams like Bayern, Barca, Liverpool) we are not good enough to dominate for the whole game. We now manage to do it for long spells, which is a refreshing change and a sign that the squad is progressing, but every team we play is going to have spells where they get on top and if we have not made out dominant periods pay, we may suffer for it. We need to improve our chance conversion rate. That can be worked on, though. |
I am more concerned about attack than defence. Perhaps that is because I've got the feeling that even if we tightened up we are probably going to concede at least one goal.
In the last two games we just didn't look like we were going to score. When we're in the oppo box it's actually some finesse and some quick thinking that we need. We've certainly shown we are capable of that this season. [Post edited 3 Oct 2019 11:18]
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:26 - Oct 3 with 985 views | TheChef |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:10 - Oct 3 by WestbourneR |
I think we're better than mid-table but too powder puff for top six. I'll say 7th.
We're a couple of 'in their prime' streetwise pros away from being a very good team.
Centre mid still looks like an issue. It'll be interesting to see if Matt Smith or Luke Amos can ultimately do the biz there. That was surely the plan at the start of the season. |
7th would be amazing. In fact anything in the top 10 would be a hell of an achievement (even considering the overall poor quality of teams this year) given the summer overhaul we've had.
Overall I think we'll have to get used to enjoying lovely attacking football while coughing up soft goals at the back. Just as long as we win more than we lose, here's hoping we're back to winning ways at the weekend. |  |
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:49 - Oct 3 with 935 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:17 - Oct 3 by PinnerPaul |
I hate those sort of quotes
and every other league in the world gives you points for losing? |
Winning is more important than how you play.
Points make prizes and all that.
No point in playing fancy football if you keep losing. |  |
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:50 - Oct 3 with 942 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:17 - Oct 3 by TacticalR |
I am more concerned about attack than defence. Perhaps that is because I've got the feeling that even if we tightened up we are probably going to concede at least one goal.
In the last two games we just didn't look like we were going to score. When we're in the oppo box it's actually some finesse and some quick thinking that we need. We've certainly shown we are capable of that this season. [Post edited 3 Oct 2019 11:18]
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I'd agree we didn't look like scoring on Sat, but last night we constantly looked like scoring to me. We hit the post twice! |  |
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:51 - Oct 3 with 942 views | loftus77 |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:03 - Oct 3 by daveB |
always a balance with QPR or any team. We weren't world beaters after winning 4 games and we're not crap after losing 2. In all likelihood we'll finish mid table this season so you can expect these kind of ups and downs all season, key will be making sure the downs don't last too long and we don't do the same as we have under last few managers in not being able to get out of a bad run |
Yep - the key is to avoid those 'Olly-esque' tail-spins. The season depends on it. | | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 12:11 - Oct 3 with 917 views | TacticalR |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:50 - Oct 3 by Antti_Heinola |
I'd agree we didn't look like scoring on Sat, but last night we constantly looked like scoring to me. We hit the post twice! |
Maybe it was a hangover from Saturday, or maybe I am becoming a doomster and a gloomster. | |
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 12:35 - Oct 3 with 866 views | Dorse |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 10:54 - Oct 3 by stevec |
This is true but in the last two games we've come up against possibly the two best centre half pairings in the Division.
Hugill's not been given a single chance and has been bullied off the park by giants, no real fault in that. Wells doesn't look entirely fit either.
That put a huge onus on Eze, Chair and BOS and scoring wise, none of them are prolific. |
Both the CB pairings for Cardiff and WBA were outstanding. Even someone as relentlessly niggly as Hugill was at a loss as to how to deal with them.
What impressed me, however, was the way QPR set up to play against them: the harsh lesson from Saturday was taken on-board and we went in a completely different direction, attacking on the deck and playing straight / angled through balls to get them turned around. The way in which we got BOS one on one with their left back was outstanding, particularly in the first half. On another day, that might have been a match-winner.
Getting Eze into the pocket with any kind of space was negated in the second half when they detailed Peltier to stand on him but that left gaps for an overlap. Eze was alive to it and dragged Peltier out of position a few times. Great footballing nous.
I couldn't see how we could get in amongst them except through quick play and they managed it more than a few times. For me, the best examples were in the second half when Manning and Kane arrived through the inside channels and both got shots away. It showed the team were alive to opportunities and still creating problems even at 3-0 down.
I really enjoy watching this side play. We are going to lose a few but we lost more than a few last season and looked shit doing it. This is a definite step-up. |  |
| 'What do we want? We don't know! When do we want it? Now!' |
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 13:44 - Oct 3 with 799 views | ridethewave |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:49 - Oct 3 by 2Thomas2Bowles |
Winning is more important than how you play.
Points make prizes and all that.
No point in playing fancy football if you keep losing. |
Sod that, we've been playing sh1t football for years and I'm finally loving watching QPR for the first time since that brief Jim Magilton spell.
And to top it all off, we don't keep losing, we're picking up decent points. This absolutely has to be the base of how we build going forwards; good, attacking football with lots of flair. We'll do more than well in the long run like that. [Post edited 3 Oct 2019 13:49]
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 14:00 - Oct 3 with 770 views | francisbowles |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:10 - Oct 3 by PinnerPaul |
They will be on the motorway 1st thing - MW said they wouldn't get back until lunchtime today. |
MW must have persuaded Lee Hoos that it is better to spend the money on the Cardiff Travelodge, (other budget chains are available) than risking the players driving home in the early hours. | | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 14:56 - Oct 3 with 722 views | Benny_the_Ball |
I'm not convinced a total shift in philosophy is required as the team has so far performed above expectation. However, there is certainly room for improvement and I have confidence that, given time, Warburton will identify those areas. Whether the board then backs him next summer will depend on finances.
All things being equal, I would say the team (eventually) needs a couple of players (defence and centre-mid) who are technically sound but relish the ugly stuff (a la Hill and Derry). For example, Scowen made it pretty clear that he doesn't enjoy ratting and sees himself as a forward thinking midfielder. As a result he's been ineffective in the holding midfield role. You need a player to enjoy that side of the game in order for them to be effective. |  | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 16:32 - Oct 3 with 661 views | davman |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 14:56 - Oct 3 by Benny_the_Ball |
I'm not convinced a total shift in philosophy is required as the team has so far performed above expectation. However, there is certainly room for improvement and I have confidence that, given time, Warburton will identify those areas. Whether the board then backs him next summer will depend on finances.
All things being equal, I would say the team (eventually) needs a couple of players (defence and centre-mid) who are technically sound but relish the ugly stuff (a la Hill and Derry). For example, Scowen made it pretty clear that he doesn't enjoy ratting and sees himself as a forward thinking midfielder. As a result he's been ineffective in the holding midfield role. You need a player to enjoy that side of the game in order for them to be effective. |
I was a huge Scowen fan in his first season, but he kind of looks out of place in this new team; I just don't think that he is good enough with the ball and takes too many risks with it in dangerous areas.
The defensive formation we are trying to employ relies on good central defenders and good defensive midfielders to cover the rampaging full backs. Last night, we looked horrible vulnerable on the rare occasions that they had the ball. The second goal was inevitable (to me at least) when they got the corner and when we stood of Bacuna allowing him to whip the ball across for the third, that was coming too.
We lose the ball high up the pitch and we are really vulnerable - good, direct teams will punish us.
However, do we want to sacrifice the entertainment just to play safe? Not sure, but if we ever get two or three up in a game again, I'd love us to be able to "shut up shop", but don't think we can at the moment with the players Warbs has bought in. Maybe this is what is meant by no plan B; we can play entertainingly, but can't stop other teams playing...
I know that we will win some and lose some this season and I know that two games ago we were on a winning streak, but I can't wait for the next win to shake off the "we're all doomed" feeling that comes with supporting QPR... |  |
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 16:48 - Oct 3 with 647 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 14:56 - Oct 3 by Benny_the_Ball |
I'm not convinced a total shift in philosophy is required as the team has so far performed above expectation. However, there is certainly room for improvement and I have confidence that, given time, Warburton will identify those areas. Whether the board then backs him next summer will depend on finances.
All things being equal, I would say the team (eventually) needs a couple of players (defence and centre-mid) who are technically sound but relish the ugly stuff (a la Hill and Derry). For example, Scowen made it pretty clear that he doesn't enjoy ratting and sees himself as a forward thinking midfielder. As a result he's been ineffective in the holding midfield role. You need a player to enjoy that side of the game in order for them to be effective. |
Scowen was the one who described himself as a 'rat' in the first place wasn't he? When he signed for us and interviewed on the official podcast. His point last summer was that he could play as an '8' so be a bit more box to box and get the odd goal rather thanbeing purely an anchorman. So not totally sure that's the problem, but it could be! [Post edited 3 Oct 2019 16:48]
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| Time to win ugly and shore up on 18:10 - Oct 3 with 580 views | nix |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:14 - Oct 3 by PinnerPaul |
Can't agree with the cautions v WBA, in fact both Hugill and Manning could have easily seen yellow on another day. |
Fair enough Paul but why didn't their players get booked when we had two players pulled back, one of which was just outside the penalty area, arguably in a more dangerous position than the Cameron booking. Why did Pereira not booked for unsportsmanlike conduct when even his manager made him apologise afterwards? And the ref definitely saw it.
My point was more a general one though, that we need to support the players to get more equal treatment. If the other teams' fans are screaming at the ref then they are influenced. And equally if the players whinge they tend to be given the benefit of the doubt too. I personally don't think it's a coincidence that we've had more dodgy penalties awarded against us last season than for us. |  | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 19:06 - Oct 3 with 544 views | PinnerPaul |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 18:10 - Oct 3 by nix |
Fair enough Paul but why didn't their players get booked when we had two players pulled back, one of which was just outside the penalty area, arguably in a more dangerous position than the Cameron booking. Why did Pereira not booked for unsportsmanlike conduct when even his manager made him apologise afterwards? And the ref definitely saw it.
My point was more a general one though, that we need to support the players to get more equal treatment. If the other teams' fans are screaming at the ref then they are influenced. And equally if the players whinge they tend to be given the benefit of the doubt too. I personally don't think it's a coincidence that we've had more dodgy penalties awarded against us last season than for us. |
I honestly don't remember the one just outside the pen area - was there a foul given.
Cynical pulls or those 'breaking up a promising attack' should all get yellows.
Perriera, yes I agree and at a lower level (where the sub can still cause 'mischief) it would likely be a yellow - but at this level it won't be - Can't defend it - but it IS a different game
" examples" - GK taking 22 seconds to release the ball, Wells wearing a taped up wedding ring
Don't get me started on that, always arguing about it on 'RefChat' - some, like me think these things just make it difficult for grassroots refs, others think it doesn't concern us! | | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 20:03 - Oct 3 with 518 views | daveB |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 11:10 - Oct 3 by WestbourneR |
I think we're better than mid-table but too powder puff for top six. I'll say 7th.
We're a couple of 'in their prime' streetwise pros away from being a very good team.
Centre mid still looks like an issue. It'll be interesting to see if Matt Smith or Luke Amos can ultimately do the biz there. That was surely the plan at the start of the season. |
I think we're a mid table side who could easily end up in the playoffs if things click for us, especially if we are in a similar position to last year at xmas and can add a defender in january | | | |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 22:10 - Oct 3 with 483 views | VancouverHoop |
| Time to win ugly and shore up on 20:03 - Oct 3 by daveB |
I think we're a mid table side who could easily end up in the playoffs if things click for us, especially if we are in a similar position to last year at xmas and can add a defender in january |
Maybe. Thing is, this time last year we were building a defence that, by Christmas, had one of the best records in the division. In spite of having several players who many fans considered mediocre, if not actual liabilities. This year, so many believe, we have better players back there but only three teams have a worse defensive record than us and two of them are holding up the division.
What's the problem?
Yes we're easy on the eye – which lord knows hasn't been the case for almost ten years – and when playing two up front we're a genuine threat to score. But unless the schoolboy errors from set-plays in our own area are rectified we're never going reap the benefits from further upfield. | | | |
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