| Chair jailed for a year 13:00 - Feb 23 with 53085 views | DevonWhite |
According to The Sun. |  | | |  |
| Chair jailed for a year on 16:49 - Feb 23 with 3048 views | W7Ranger |
| Chair jailed for a year on 15:08 - Feb 23 by E15Hoop |
Well no-one's been done yet for sexual assault, as far as I remember, though Loic Remy did come close a few years back, of course.. |
And Terrell Forbes |  | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 16:56 - Feb 23 with 2938 views | flynnbo |
| Chair jailed for a year on 16:00 - Feb 23 by Northernr |
You know what I'd usually edit it, but I'll leave it, you deserve it.
Maybe an accusation like that which started the row? |
No, all he said was Jehova. [Post edited 23 Feb 16:58]
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| Chair jailed for a year on 16:58 - Feb 23 with 2884 views | E17hoop |
8 pages in and I had no idea we had SO many Belgian criminal law specialists here. |  |
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| Chair jailed for a year on 16:59 - Feb 23 with 2870 views | numptydumpty |
| Chair jailed for a year on 16:31 - Feb 23 by Padulas_Shampoo |
How do you know the alleged victim was in intensive care? |
I don't.
That was what was first initially reported.
I have no idea what's true and what's not.
It's hard to understand any of it, the lack of reporting for many years, the lack of a trial, the sudden reporting of his sentence, the rumours he is still in this country.
It's a story blesses by the trials of social media. I like everyone this all seems extremely odd.
Yes few reports said the victim was in intensive care for a few days but guess a fractured skull, you would be. |  |
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| Chair jailed for a year on 17:06 - Feb 23 with 2746 views | E15Hoop |
| Chair jailed for a year on 16:18 - Feb 23 by Northernr |
"the club will have to comment on it"
Hmmmmm, new leadership seems pretty determined to test that. |
Well said, Clive.
To be fair to our new CEO, I think he's already shown himself very adept at handling the information flow (well, as much as he can do in a case like this for instance) and not showing the club's official hand until (a.) There is no other option or (b.) He can make a statement that can be shoehorned into some really positive PR (the 4 January signings being a superb example).
Light years ahead of where we were in this regard under Uncle Tony Twitterfingers, and absolutely the most sensible way forwards in this particular context. | | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:07 - Feb 23 with 2721 views | derbyhoop |
| Chair jailed for a year on 16:13 - Feb 23 by Padulas_Shampoo |
So what was his plea? Was he present to offer his plea?
Admittedly I have very little experience with criminal court proceedings but I have never heard of a trial whereby the defence doesn't pitch up to 'hearings', turns up to a verdict months later with a new lawyer, gets 'sentenced to prison' but then doesn't go to prison and nips back home in time for training as he's starting against Rotherham tomorrow.
I'm not arguing his innocence nor his guilt - It just all seems absolutely batsh*t to me.
If there had been a trial - a proper one - I'm pretty sure the British tabloids would have picked that up and reported all the gory details with no concern for the wellbeing of anyone involved. All we've had are these strange translated news articles suggesting something happened in France and now bizarrely there are criminal proceedings occurring in Belgium laced exclusively with broad accounts clearly from a prosecution point of view, almost as if the prosecutors themselves want it leaked to the press... Why could that possibly be I wonder?
Just all seems odd. |
British tabloids would struggle to find their arse with both hands, as Clive has suggested. If Chair wasnt a reasonably high profile footballer, it wouldnt warrant a single line in any paper. [Post edited 23 Feb 17:18]
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| Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one’s lifetime. (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop |
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| Chair jailed for a year on 17:10 - Feb 23 with 2665 views | QPRConor2000 |
I've got more questions than answers at the moment. | | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:10 - Feb 23 with 2655 views | Padulas_Shampoo |
| Chair jailed for a year on 16:59 - Feb 23 by numptydumpty |
I don't.
That was what was first initially reported.
I have no idea what's true and what's not.
It's hard to understand any of it, the lack of reporting for many years, the lack of a trial, the sudden reporting of his sentence, the rumours he is still in this country.
It's a story blesses by the trials of social media. I like everyone this all seems extremely odd.
Yes few reports said the victim was in intensive care for a few days but guess a fractured skull, you would be. |
"This happened years ago apparently, the victim was in intensive care with fractured skull - potentially could have been life threatening"
So this was guesswork / assumption? I haven't seen anything that mentioned intensive care either today nor when the weird news sort of weirdly broke last time. Probably best not to state things like that as a declaration of fact.
Totally agree with you about the 'trial by social media'. An absolutely rotten aspect of modern life. |  | | |
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| Chair jailed for a year on 17:20 - Feb 23 with 2486 views | lassel |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:10 - Feb 23 by Padulas_Shampoo |
"This happened years ago apparently, the victim was in intensive care with fractured skull - potentially could have been life threatening"
So this was guesswork / assumption? I haven't seen anything that mentioned intensive care either today nor when the weird news sort of weirdly broke last time. Probably best not to state things like that as a declaration of fact.
Totally agree with you about the 'trial by social media'. An absolutely rotten aspect of modern life. |
https://www.fansnetwork.co.uk/football/queensparkrangers/forum/305507/ilias-chai
The details on the victim are in the earlier thread above. | | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:22 - Feb 23 with 2447 views | PlanetHonneywood |
A mate just sent me something. A picture of Dozzell and a message to the Belgian authorities: you've arrested the wrong guy, this is Ilias Chair, currentlyin Birmingham!! |  |
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| Chair jailed for a year on 17:25 - Feb 23 with 2415 views | terryb |
| Chair jailed for a year on 16:44 - Feb 23 by Northernr |
But this is the thing, there hasn't been a trial like that, because he didn't show up to them.
That doesn't reflect well on him at all, like he just wasn't taking it seriously, but there hasn't been a trial with a prosecution and defence and testing of evidence like that. |
I thought it had been said when the story broke in January, that there had been a trial held in the absence of the accused (Chair) & that the Prosecutor was asking for a prison sentence & compensation to be paid? Surely, his legal advisers (solicitors, barristers etc) could have conducted his defence without him being present?
Of course, it might easily be that I'm not remembering the story correctly, or that I've misinterpreted! | | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:25 - Feb 23 with 2415 views | B_Wad |
I suppose this throws a twist on the POTY vote. |  | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:27 - Feb 23 with 2361 views | Northernr |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:25 - Feb 23 by terryb |
I thought it had been said when the story broke in January, that there had been a trial held in the absence of the accused (Chair) & that the Prosecutor was asking for a prison sentence & compensation to be paid? Surely, his legal advisers (solicitors, barristers etc) could have conducted his defence without him being present?
Of course, it might easily be that I'm not remembering the story correctly, or that I've misinterpreted! |
This is exactly my original point. We, as in us QPR fans, don't know do we? The question was whether we come out in rabid support of him, banish him from the team, or somewhere in between. And, at the moment, we don't know the details do we? We've had two Belgian newspaper reports to go on - one a month ago, and then the one today which has been copied and pasted everywhere.
This post has been edited by an administrator |  | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:30 - Feb 23 with 2297 views | Padulas_Shampoo |
No mention of intensive care. And the only ‘detail’ is from a subjective quote seemingly attributed to nobody but presumably from ‘the prosecutor’.
All of it seems completely bizarre to me. Very few facts have been reported. | | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:30 - Feb 23 with 2296 views | EastR |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:25 - Feb 23 by B_Wad |
I suppose this throws a twist on the POTY vote. |
Prisoner Of The Year? he's a shoe in | |
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| Chair jailed for a year on 17:35 - Feb 23 with 2224 views | kensalriser |
| Chair jailed for a year on 16:44 - Feb 23 by collegeranger |
the alleged attack took place in France but the prosecution is in Belgium! Mmmm is this a private prosecution? All seems a bit far fetched to me. |
That was my first reaction to the original story. How does a Belgian court claim jurisdiction over an event that no one seems to dispute took place in France? |  |
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| Chair jailed for a year on 17:36 - Feb 23 with 2210 views | lassel |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:30 - Feb 23 by Padulas_Shampoo |
No mention of intensive care. And the only ‘detail’ is from a subjective quote seemingly attributed to nobody but presumably from ‘the prosecutor’.
All of it seems completely bizarre to me. Very few facts have been reported. |
I mean the details certainly suggest as much - admitted in critical condition with a fractured skull and requiring a length stay in hospital.
Whilst youre right that we don’t *know* the victim was in intensive care, it’s pretty damn likely based upon the description of the injuries. | | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:37 - Feb 23 with 2191 views | saxbend |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:06 - Feb 23 by E15Hoop |
Well said, Clive.
To be fair to our new CEO, I think he's already shown himself very adept at handling the information flow (well, as much as he can do in a case like this for instance) and not showing the club's official hand until (a.) There is no other option or (b.) He can make a statement that can be shoehorned into some really positive PR (the 4 January signings being a superb example).
Light years ahead of where we were in this regard under Uncle Tony Twitterfingers, and absolutely the most sensible way forwards in this particular context. |
And as long as the club does have the option to keep quiet, then nothing affecting Chair's continued involvement at QPR can have happened. And even without a comment from the club we can at least wait for some legitimate piece of journalism that includes a quote from the person declaring a verdict and pronouncing a sentence (if there is one).
For now there's very little to talk about. If he plays tomorrow there is nothing at all to talk about. [Post edited 23 Feb 17:39]
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| Chair jailed for a year on 17:38 - Feb 23 with 2188 views | Northernr |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:30 - Feb 23 by Padulas_Shampoo |
No mention of intensive care. And the only ‘detail’ is from a subjective quote seemingly attributed to nobody but presumably from ‘the prosecutor’.
All of it seems completely bizarre to me. Very few facts have been reported. |
It sounds to me like they've been trying to bring it to court for a while, Chair and his people basically ignored it thinking it would go away, and in the end the court got tired of that, tried him in absentia, and convicted him on the basis of the facts laid out by the prosecution - kayaking, bus queue, large stone, cat, rat, hat etc. So that's where the details that have been reported have come from.
You can't make a court case go away simply by not turning up to it otherwise everybody would do it. So you get tried in absentia, you lose the right to put forward your defence, and the judge, who is almost certainly pissd off, says yeh guilty two years.
At that point Chair has engaged new lawyers and gone in all contrite this morning to try and get another hearing which he promises solemnly to turn up to this time and the judge, aforementioned pissd off judge, has gone 'nah bolox mate you had your chance', two years.
Chair then launches an appeal, and while it may seem absolutely perverse to us walks away free to play while that's sorted out.
But I, like everybody else, am guessing based on what scraps we've got, and dim and distant past court reporting experiences. | | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:41 - Feb 23 with 2142 views | terryb |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:27 - Feb 23 by Northernr |
This is exactly my original point. We, as in us QPR fans, don't know do we? The question was whether we come out in rabid support of him, banish him from the team, or somewhere in between. And, at the moment, we don't know the details do we? We've had two Belgian newspaper reports to go on - one a month ago, and then the one today which has been copied and pasted everywhere.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Absolutely true.
I think I was mainly replying to sugestions that a trial hadn't taken place (not by you). It appears to me that it has & that Chair chose not to be present. Whether that was his choice or the legal advice he was given is not known & possibly never will be.
As to whether we should show him support, throw him to the dogs etc is a different matter & I would agree that we don't know enough for anyone to decide on their position.
The original TalkSport report stated that his brother was also sentenced to two years imprisonment, but whether that is being appealed as well I have no idea. Or whether this report is accurate! [Post edited 23 Feb 17:44]
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| Chair jailed for a year on 17:43 - Feb 23 with 2119 views | daveB |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:38 - Feb 23 by Northernr |
It sounds to me like they've been trying to bring it to court for a while, Chair and his people basically ignored it thinking it would go away, and in the end the court got tired of that, tried him in absentia, and convicted him on the basis of the facts laid out by the prosecution - kayaking, bus queue, large stone, cat, rat, hat etc. So that's where the details that have been reported have come from.
You can't make a court case go away simply by not turning up to it otherwise everybody would do it. So you get tried in absentia, you lose the right to put forward your defence, and the judge, who is almost certainly pissd off, says yeh guilty two years.
At that point Chair has engaged new lawyers and gone in all contrite this morning to try and get another hearing which he promises solemnly to turn up to this time and the judge, aforementioned pissd off judge, has gone 'nah bolox mate you had your chance', two years.
Chair then launches an appeal, and while it may seem absolutely perverse to us walks away free to play while that's sorted out.
But I, like everybody else, am guessing based on what scraps we've got, and dim and distant past court reporting experiences. |
This sounds about right but you have to wonder what Chair's legal team were thinking letting this get so far
My gut feeling based on no knowledge whatsoever is that he'll get the sentence reduced on appeal and likely to suspended with a big compensation but it's a hell of a risk for him to have left it so late before taking it seriously
I just hope we won't banking on selling him this summer as he's going nowhere with this hanging over his head |  | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:45 - Feb 23 with 2092 views | Northernr |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:43 - Feb 23 by daveB |
This sounds about right but you have to wonder what Chair's legal team were thinking letting this get so far
My gut feeling based on no knowledge whatsoever is that he'll get the sentence reduced on appeal and likely to suspended with a big compensation but it's a hell of a risk for him to have left it so late before taking it seriously
I just hope we won't banking on selling him this summer as he's going nowhere with this hanging over his head |
The whole thing, as Padula says above, just sounds so weird, and there's clearly so many details we're missing. If he had a chance to bung the guy 16,000 euros to make it go away and didn't then he's a pillock. | | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:48 - Feb 23 with 2024 views | Padulas_Shampoo |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:36 - Feb 23 by lassel |
I mean the details certainly suggest as much - admitted in critical condition with a fractured skull and requiring a length stay in hospital.
Whilst youre right that we don’t *know* the victim was in intensive care, it’s pretty damn likely based upon the description of the injuries. |
There aren’t any details, just unattributed quotes from ‘the prosecutor’.
If I were to draw assumption; I would suggest on the basis that the prosecutor hasn’t claimed at any stage that the alleged victim were in intensive care; it’s almost certain that they never were. | | | |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:49 - Feb 23 with 2014 views | MedwayR |
| Chair jailed for a year on 13:36 - Feb 23 by Northernr |
Club seem to be on a 'tell people as little as possible about everything' mission atm so who knows. That statement would seem to imply it's ongoing etc, but all the press reports say go to jail do not pass go. |
With any luck they'll stop telling when the games are on soon. |  |
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| Chair jailed for a year on 17:50 - Feb 23 with 2004 views | Hunterhoop |
| Chair jailed for a year on 17:38 - Feb 23 by Northernr |
It sounds to me like they've been trying to bring it to court for a while, Chair and his people basically ignored it thinking it would go away, and in the end the court got tired of that, tried him in absentia, and convicted him on the basis of the facts laid out by the prosecution - kayaking, bus queue, large stone, cat, rat, hat etc. So that's where the details that have been reported have come from.
You can't make a court case go away simply by not turning up to it otherwise everybody would do it. So you get tried in absentia, you lose the right to put forward your defence, and the judge, who is almost certainly pissd off, says yeh guilty two years.
At that point Chair has engaged new lawyers and gone in all contrite this morning to try and get another hearing which he promises solemnly to turn up to this time and the judge, aforementioned pissd off judge, has gone 'nah bolox mate you had your chance', two years.
Chair then launches an appeal, and while it may seem absolutely perverse to us walks away free to play while that's sorted out.
But I, like everybody else, am guessing based on what scraps we've got, and dim and distant past court reporting experiences. |
This sounds about right from what can be cobbled together.
I am astounded you can be convicted, given a prison sentence, and be allowed to walk free (for now) simply because you appeal immediately. But then I am no expect on this. Why doesn’t everyone do this on the continent? Would kill the justice system, wouldn’t it?
I bet you Cifuentes isn’t relishing being a position where he has to decide whether to risk playing a key player whose head cannot be right or not for a critical must win match, compounded by the ethical decision of whether it’s right to pick someone on appeal for a prison sentence for something akin to ABH/GBH! Welcome to QPR, Marti. You thought you knew what you were in for… |  | | |
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