| A summer of change? 17:36 - Feb 16 with 8979 views | ChaffRAFC |
Depending on which division we're in obviously, I suspect we could see major changes in the summer. Here's a list of the players who are out of contract:
Matt Done
Brad Inman
Jim McNulty
Aaron Morley (May have an extension clause)
Kgosi Ntlhe
Oliver Rathbone (May have an extension clause)
Aaron Wilbraham
Jordan Williams
Jimmy Keohane
Brad Wade (May have an extension clause)
Which only leaves the following contracted:
Calvin Andrew
Daniel Adshead
Callum Camps
Ryan Delaney
Stephen Dooley
Matty Gillam
Ian Henderson
Josh Lillis
MJ Williams
Ryan McLaughlin
If I'm being honest, regardless of division, I'd be releasing most of the players out of contract with the exception of Rathbone. Done could possibly do a job in League Two but hasn't been the same player since we re-signed him and has done nothing to justify being offered a deal.
Obviously, we have no idea about Jimmy Keohane but I wouldn't lose sleep over any of the others leaving.
If my list is incorrect, by all means pull me up on that.
Any one else have any thoughts?
This post has been edited by an administrator |  |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| A summer of change? on 12:40 - Feb 17 with 2223 views | JimmyRustler |
Aside from a few "stand out" teams, everyone else in this league is much of a muchness for me. Standard wise, I don't think its a particularly strong league this year and with that in mind, I'm not sure that this squad would do all that much better in League 2 |  | | |
| A summer of change? on 12:46 - Feb 17 with 2202 views | dingdangblue |
| A summer of change? on 12:38 - Feb 17 by kel |
Not as obsessed as you are about trying to come across as the board smart arse.
I don’t know, I even tried being nice by adding a smiley and you still get all sensitive. [Post edited 17 Feb 2019 12:40]
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Im sorry if you think I come across as the board smart arse, I did think he was referring to relegation from league 1 as we are in league 1 and currently not in the relegation zone and have hardly been in the bottom 4 all season - and we have an amazing chance to sort out a big bit of this mess by beating Wimbledon on Tuesday. To predict relegation out of the football league (something that hasn't happened in our history) is a tad pessimistic. |  |
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| A summer of change? on 12:52 - Feb 17 with 2190 views | kel |
| A summer of change? on 12:46 - Feb 17 by dingdangblue |
Im sorry if you think I come across as the board smart arse, I did think he was referring to relegation from league 1 as we are in league 1 and currently not in the relegation zone and have hardly been in the bottom 4 all season - and we have an amazing chance to sort out a big bit of this mess by beating Wimbledon on Tuesday. To predict relegation out of the football league (something that hasn't happened in our history) is a tad pessimistic. |
No need to apologise, I was just offering my opinion which is what this forum is for. SteT clearly meant relegation from league two which I think you eventually realised after your edits, and I was merely pointing that out with the bonus of a smiley to show it was a light hearted response to your post. It appeared you were trying to pull him up on it to make him look daft hence the ‘smart arse’ comment which is something you’ve done before to others that I’ve noticed.
Don’t worry though, I remember comments from various people (I just have a memory like that) so I’m not singling you out in anyway, despite what you may think. |  | | |
| A summer of change? on 13:30 - Feb 17 with 2141 views | dingdangblue |
| A summer of change? on 12:52 - Feb 17 by kel |
No need to apologise, I was just offering my opinion which is what this forum is for. SteT clearly meant relegation from league two which I think you eventually realised after your edits, and I was merely pointing that out with the bonus of a smiley to show it was a light hearted response to your post. It appeared you were trying to pull him up on it to make him look daft hence the ‘smart arse’ comment which is something you’ve done before to others that I’ve noticed.
Don’t worry though, I remember comments from various people (I just have a memory like that) so I’m not singling you out in anyway, despite what you may think. |
Fair do's - I'll not do it again.Tvos can do it instead  | |
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| A summer of change? on 15:20 - Feb 17 with 1988 views | RAFCBLUE |
A lot depends on money here and the appetite of the new board.
The expiry of those large earners coincides with the appetite of a new board to make League 1 financial commitments and keep cheap season tickets.
Reduced money in and escalating wages in League 1 mean it will be harder than ever to compete.
If they have money and desire to invest over a three year cycle; great.
If they do not then there is a problem already given that the financial commitments we currently make place us in the bottom 8.
Adshead and possibly Camps will get moved on. That money in then can be invested and apportioned across a number of two year deals for some suitable players - a small group to be then supplemented using the loan system.
But countenance that with us seeing Ipswich, Bolton + one come down and Lincoln + bury + two come up; it will be a more financially stretched League and I think that we will end up with a bottom 6 budget next year.
The biggest change of all could be the manager; having endured the best run in the clubs history (assuming we stay up).
Never a guarantee that in the light of a reduced or less competitive budget and how the club have planned (or not) for him eventually moving on will be a big impact when it eventually does arrive. |  |
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| A summer of change? on 15:41 - Feb 17 with 1969 views | Shun |
| A summer of change? on 04:35 - Feb 17 by SteTsGoldenBoot |
One thing that the list dispels, is the propaganda that Hill peddles about us being a bright young side full of academy players. Certainly a fair old sprinkling of journeymen.
With Hills recent lazy recruitment, I would expect Big Jim, Done to be retained as more than likely we will be in League Two, Joe Bunney will return then which ever of his ex players haven't yet retired, perhaps Buckley and Dagnall.
Hill will then preach how lucky we are to be in League Two and how we are punching above our weight, then rhyme off the budgets that some Conference clubs have.
I guess all we can hope for is for two worse teams than us in the next three years than us, while Hill runs down his contract and the board allow him too.
Drama Queen? Maybe? More than likely a bit closer to the truth than we'd care to admit! |
Why will we more than likely be in League Two next year? We’re coming towards the end of the season and we’ve spent a grand total of 4 days in the bottom 4 all season. |  | | |
| A summer of change? on 15:52 - Feb 17 with 1950 views | 442Dale |
| A summer of change? on 15:20 - Feb 17 by RAFCBLUE |
A lot depends on money here and the appetite of the new board.
The expiry of those large earners coincides with the appetite of a new board to make League 1 financial commitments and keep cheap season tickets.
Reduced money in and escalating wages in League 1 mean it will be harder than ever to compete.
If they have money and desire to invest over a three year cycle; great.
If they do not then there is a problem already given that the financial commitments we currently make place us in the bottom 8.
Adshead and possibly Camps will get moved on. That money in then can be invested and apportioned across a number of two year deals for some suitable players - a small group to be then supplemented using the loan system.
But countenance that with us seeing Ipswich, Bolton + one come down and Lincoln + bury + two come up; it will be a more financially stretched League and I think that we will end up with a bottom 6 budget next year.
The biggest change of all could be the manager; having endured the best run in the clubs history (assuming we stay up).
Never a guarantee that in the light of a reduced or less competitive budget and how the club have planned (or not) for him eventually moving on will be a big impact when it eventually does arrive. |
That we've always had a budget that's been one of the lowest and competed well makes it not as important as how any budget is spent - as shown this season when we have so many players not adding anything to the squad (and therefore money not being used effectively). |  |
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| A summer of change? on 16:03 - Feb 17 with 1928 views | RAFCBLUE |
| A summer of change? on 15:52 - Feb 17 by 442Dale |
That we've always had a budget that's been one of the lowest and competed well makes it not as important as how any budget is spent - as shown this season when we have so many players not adding anything to the squad (and therefore money not being used effectively). |
I'd disagree slightly 442 in the context of next season.
It's easier to compete when you have a settled team but a lower budget. Accy this year are the team doing that and we have been in that position before.
You come up, you plug away with what you have and then you see how you get on; better teams and players get cherry picked.
The problem then becomes replacing what you have. It's a challenge wherever you are but harder lower down.
Since our promotion into this League in 2014 I think I am right in saying we have divested Scott Hogan, Matt Done (although resigned), Ashley Eastham, Olly Lancashire, Jamie Allen, Peter Vincenti, Andy Cannon and Joe Rafferty in one way or another of that promotion winning squad.
Replacing those types of players immediately on permanent contracts costs good wages to bring in and we don't have the backing to do that.
This summer is a watershed when you look at how much of a League 1 squad is up for renewal vs the resources at the disposal of the Board/manager.
We've spent two years plugging holes with "known" characters which can only run so long. | |
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| A summer of change? on 16:25 - Feb 17 with 1878 views | boromat |
Another point is the struggle to integrate the new youth players. I don't think anyone doubts their quality but it's proving difficult to give them chances in a team that struggles. We seem to be in a cycle where the first half of the season they get some chances but then when it comes to the business end they have to sit in the stands. When we were in League 2 the young players came in were given a chance in a good team at that level and could gain the experience in a positive environment. I think that's one of our biggest challenges. |  |
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| A summer of change? on 16:25 - Feb 17 with 1878 views | 442Dale |
| A summer of change? on 16:03 - Feb 17 by RAFCBLUE |
I'd disagree slightly 442 in the context of next season.
It's easier to compete when you have a settled team but a lower budget. Accy this year are the team doing that and we have been in that position before.
You come up, you plug away with what you have and then you see how you get on; better teams and players get cherry picked.
The problem then becomes replacing what you have. It's a challenge wherever you are but harder lower down.
Since our promotion into this League in 2014 I think I am right in saying we have divested Scott Hogan, Matt Done (although resigned), Ashley Eastham, Olly Lancashire, Jamie Allen, Peter Vincenti, Andy Cannon and Joe Rafferty in one way or another of that promotion winning squad.
Replacing those types of players immediately on permanent contracts costs good wages to bring in and we don't have the backing to do that.
This summer is a watershed when you look at how much of a League 1 squad is up for renewal vs the resources at the disposal of the Board/manager.
We've spent two years plugging holes with "known" characters which can only run so long. |
We managed to compete very successfully for three seasons as those players gradually left and were replaced, always with a smaller budget. Dale fans are fully aware of how that's how it is and those who are realistic don't expect a top six challenge but know that its possible when we get things right. However, almost everyone would be happy turning up to watch a side that offers decent football, playing to a clear plan that represents the club we have come to expect; results would then be good enough to ensure we aren't in much trouble.
It's about making the most of what we have, for various reasons that's not happened in the last two campaigns with the budget being way down the list of reasons why, especially when looking at how we have succeeded historically.
As said, it's easier to compete with a settled team and the recruitment of far too many players who offer little more than their counterparts in the same role has affected that massively. It's all on the manager. And Accrington fans may argue they're not all the way there to competing successfully this year as they're not too far ahead of us in the table now. | |
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| A summer of change? on 16:34 - Feb 17 with 1855 views | 442Dale |
| A summer of change? on 16:25 - Feb 17 by boromat |
Another point is the struggle to integrate the new youth players. I don't think anyone doubts their quality but it's proving difficult to give them chances in a team that struggles. We seem to be in a cycle where the first half of the season they get some chances but then when it comes to the business end they have to sit in the stands. When we were in League 2 the young players came in were given a chance in a good team at that level and could gain the experience in a positive environment. I think that's one of our biggest challenges. |
Camps and Cannon were introduced in League 1, they proved their worth and stayed in the squad. Morley was too two seasons ago but since then he's fallen away for a variety of reasons, including the signing of other midfielders who leapt ahead of him in the pecking order. Clutter, that's our problem.
Look at our best spell last season: a plan everyone knew involving players who, while not maybe the best quality, knew their roles and made the team greater than its parts. eg. a midfield of Camps, Cannon and Kitching was successful. | |
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| A summer of change? on 17:25 - Feb 17 with 1766 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| A summer of change? on 20:07 - Feb 16 by fitzochris |
It’s not my claim, it’s his agent’s. |
Are the club seeking to move Calvin on or is Calvin himself seeking to move? | |
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| A summer of change? on 18:18 - Feb 17 with 1673 views | boromat |
| A summer of change? on 16:34 - Feb 17 by 442Dale |
Camps and Cannon were introduced in League 1, they proved their worth and stayed in the squad. Morley was too two seasons ago but since then he's fallen away for a variety of reasons, including the signing of other midfielders who leapt ahead of him in the pecking order. Clutter, that's our problem.
Look at our best spell last season: a plan everyone knew involving players who, while not maybe the best quality, knew their roles and made the team greater than its parts. eg. a midfield of Camps, Cannon and Kitching was successful. |
You could argue introduced fully in League one but in a team doing well. My point is it's much harder in a team that's struggling and fighting against relegation. | |
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| A summer of change? on 19:37 - Feb 17 with 1587 views | fitzochris |
| A summer of change? on 17:25 - Feb 17 by BigDaveMyCock |
Are the club seeking to move Calvin on or is Calvin himself seeking to move? |
The former, apparently. |  |
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| A summer of change? on 20:07 - Feb 17 with 1529 views | James1980 |
| A summer of change? on 19:37 - Feb 17 by fitzochris |
The former, apparently. |
Be interesting to know (I know I won't) what his weekly wage is and what if any his goal and appearance bonus is.
Perhaps a combination of all 3 is why he appears to be one of the first names on the team sheet | |
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| A summer of change? on 20:14 - Feb 17 with 1513 views | foreverhopefulDale |
| A summer of change? on 20:07 - Feb 17 by James1980 |
Be interesting to know (I know I won't) what his weekly wage is and what if any his goal and appearance bonus is.
Perhaps a combination of all 3 is why he appears to be one of the first names on the team sheet |
Certainly won’t be costing much in goals scored bonuses if on such a bonus, unfortunately for him and us. |  |
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| A summer of change? on 20:22 - Feb 17 with 1492 views | James1980 |
| A summer of change? on 20:14 - Feb 17 by foreverhopefulDale |
Certainly won’t be costing much in goals scored bonuses if on such a bonus, unfortunately for him and us. |
Could it be his goal bonus is low to zero | |
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| A summer of change? on 20:35 - Feb 17 with 1465 views | boromat |
| A summer of change? on 20:07 - Feb 17 by James1980 |
Be interesting to know (I know I won't) what his weekly wage is and what if any his goal and appearance bonus is.
Perhaps a combination of all 3 is why he appears to be one of the first names on the team sheet |
Signed him from York City where I think he hardly got a game. I remember him coming on as a sub against us. Guessing he's not on that much although he will have had increases with his contract extensions. Probably hit his limit with us financially and is why he's possibly looking for a move. | |
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| A summer of change? on 20:36 - Feb 17 with 1461 views | since58 |
| A summer of change? on 20:22 - Feb 17 by James1980 |
Could it be his goal bonus is low to zero |
If that's the case he owes the club. | | | |
| A summer of change? on 20:39 - Feb 17 with 1453 views | fitzochris |
| A summer of change? on 20:35 - Feb 17 by boromat |
Signed him from York City where I think he hardly got a game. I remember him coming on as a sub against us. Guessing he's not on that much although he will have had increases with his contract extensions. Probably hit his limit with us financially and is why he's possibly looking for a move. |
He’s not looking for a move. Not through choice, at least. | |
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| A summer of change? on 21:36 - Feb 17 with 1378 views | dingdangblue |
| A summer of change? on 16:25 - Feb 17 by 442Dale |
We managed to compete very successfully for three seasons as those players gradually left and were replaced, always with a smaller budget. Dale fans are fully aware of how that's how it is and those who are realistic don't expect a top six challenge but know that its possible when we get things right. However, almost everyone would be happy turning up to watch a side that offers decent football, playing to a clear plan that represents the club we have come to expect; results would then be good enough to ensure we aren't in much trouble.
It's about making the most of what we have, for various reasons that's not happened in the last two campaigns with the budget being way down the list of reasons why, especially when looking at how we have succeeded historically.
As said, it's easier to compete with a settled team and the recruitment of far too many players who offer little more than their counterparts in the same role has affected that massively. It's all on the manager. And Accrington fans may argue they're not all the way there to competing successfully this year as they're not too far ahead of us in the table now. |
With only 2 wins in the last 16 league games Accrington have certainly not been great after a superb first few months of the season. A 2-2 draw away at Sunderland was an excellent result mind - even if they were 2 up. Without their early season form they'd be in the bottom 4 now. Our away game in a months time could be critical. | |
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| A summer of change? on 22:30 - Feb 17 with 1299 views | scarrow |
| A summer of change? on 20:36 - Feb 17 by since58 |
If that's the case he owes the club. |
Remarkably Andrew has 24 goals in 150 league appearances - around 1 in 6. That's actually a better strike rate than other forwards we've had. |  |
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| A summer of change? on 22:40 - Feb 17 with 1286 views | since58 |
| A summer of change? on 22:30 - Feb 17 by scarrow |
Remarkably Andrew has 24 goals in 150 league appearances - around 1 in 6. That's actually a better strike rate than other forwards we've had. |
Remarkably not as good as others. that's why he;s still here. | | | |
| A summer of change? on 23:41 - Feb 17 with 1224 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| A summer of change? on 19:37 - Feb 17 by fitzochris |
The former, apparently. |
Strange on both fronts. If the rumours are correct and he’s not a top earner then you wouldn’t expect the decision to move him on to come from the board. Surely the board would try to move on the likes of Done first if they were under pressure financially. Also, Hill seems to really like Calvin as both a player and personality so I would be surprised if it was Hill who was trying to move him on. He keeps on extending his contract.
The only thing I can think of is that Hill had/has his eye on another forward and the board have said it’s a case of ‘one in one out’. Out of Willbrahm and Calvin, you’ve got more chance of finding a suitor for the latter. | |
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| A summer of change? on 07:41 - Feb 18 with 1074 views | EllDale |
If, and it's a big if of course, we were to go down with the resultant loss of revenue, would that hasten the departure of youngsters like Adshead?
I would suspect that Done, Inman and Wilbraham are on bigger wages than Andrew so I couldn't quite understand how they weren't hawked around as publically during the last transfer window? | | | |
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