| Republic of Wales 23:01 - Oct 21 with 5024 views | Kilkennyjack |
Sky weather calling it early doors ... fair play ..
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| Beware of the Risen People
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| Republic of Wales on 09:44 - Oct 25 with 836 views | trampie |
| Republic of Wales on 08:58 - Oct 25 by Catullus |
Felix, just post the links mate,
https://fullfact.org/online/eu-budget-contributions-misleading/
The Nats make claims but don't back it up with evidence, they always want us to prove things though, I'm happy to oblige.
Kilk reckons Wales has always been better off without Westminster but can't back it up with anything other than blather and dodgy twitter links. |
Nats, I thought you were the nats Cat ?, British nationalists and all that.
Weve been part of the Westminster system for donkeys years, but when we weren't we lived by the laws of Hywel Dda top that, noted for being centuries ahead of our time. |  |
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| Republic of Wales on 09:46 - Oct 25 with 830 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Republic of Wales on 22:30 - Oct 24 by Glossolalia |
Barely scraped a majority for devolution, let alone independence. Not gonna happen for a long time, if at all. Appetite not really there, is it? Even with the SNP's popularity, Scotland failed. And for an indyref to even be mooted, wouldn't Plaid need much more representation to push it through?
33% backed an independent Wales with the country remaining in the EU (link below).
Interestingly, only 51% of Plaid voters polled, answered 'yes' to the above scenario. Not exactly encouraging for a party currently holding 10 out of 60 assembly seats, and whose raison d'etre is surely independence.
OP, where is this 41% you speak of? Aside from this hypothetical scenario, no poll has concluded a 'yes' vote over 28%, and all three polls conducted this year had 'yes' at only 25-26%.
https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/4lav01m6zl/PlaidC [Post edited 24 Oct 2020 23:09]
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https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/support-wel
41%.
‘When people who said they didn't know how they would vote were excluded, the YouGov poll conducted between September 6 and 10 suggests that 31% of people would be certain to vote for independence in a referendum with 41% backing an independent Wales in the European Union if the rest of the UK leaves’.
ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ 🇪🇺ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ 🇪🇺
And this predates the Johnson right wing regime and their ‘worst in Europe‘ handling of covid. [Post edited 25 Oct 2020 9:52]
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| Republic of Wales on 09:53 - Oct 25 with 810 views | Whiterockin |
| Republic of Wales on 09:46 - Oct 25 by Kilkennyjack |
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/support-wel
41%.
‘When people who said they didn't know how they would vote were excluded, the YouGov poll conducted between September 6 and 10 suggests that 31% of people would be certain to vote for independence in a referendum with 41% backing an independent Wales in the European Union if the rest of the UK leaves’.
ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ 🇪🇺ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ 🇪🇺
And this predates the Johnson right wing regime and their ‘worst in Europe‘ handling of covid. [Post edited 25 Oct 2020 9:52]
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The online poll looks to be 24%. This is over a year after the original pole dated September 13th 2019. Looks like support is dropping since the pandemic. |  | | |
| Republic of Wales on 09:53 - Oct 25 with 809 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Republic of Wales on 09:42 - Oct 25 by Catullus |
That's not net contributions though, is it? France may put more money up front but France also gets a lot more back than the UK.
It also ignores that we have left the EU, we are no longer members.
When we were full members we paid more in net contributions than France. |
Some people don't understand the difference between gross and net contributions .
EU net contributions in 2018 in euros.
UK 7.4 billions
France 6.6 billions |  |
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| Republic of Wales on 09:57 - Oct 25 with 802 views | Catullus |
| Republic of Wales on 09:44 - Oct 25 by trampie |
Nats, I thought you were the nats Cat ?, British nationalists and all that.
Weve been part of the Westminster system for donkeys years, but when we weren't we lived by the laws of Hywel Dda top that, noted for being centuries ahead of our time. |
When I used Hywel Dda to debunk Kilkenny he told me off for using stuff from 600 (and more, I know) years ago! I pointed out to him that King Hywel actually submitted to Athelstan of England, he accepted Athelstans dominanace
Being centuries ahead of your time is only really handy if it's the present day. Wales is well behind the times now.
Part of the reason Wales couldn't stand against the English invasion was because we couldn't unite against a common enemy.
I'm not a nationalist really. It's the world I live in but I see the only way forward as being a world without countries, without nationalities, a world where colour, creed and religion don't matter. All that matters is the person you are.
So in the worldI have to live in I prefer to remain in the Union and would prefer to reverse devolution because I think it's been an expensive cock up. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 09:59 - Oct 25 with 797 views | trampie |
| Republic of Wales on 09:42 - Oct 25 by Catullus |
That's not net contributions though, is it? France may put more money up front but France also gets a lot more back than the UK.
It also ignores that we have left the EU, we are no longer members.
When we were full members we paid more in net contributions than France. |
I told you France was paying more, that is all I said and you are agreeing.  | |
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| Republic of Wales on 10:07 - Oct 25 with 787 views | Catullus |
| Republic of Wales on 09:59 - Oct 25 by trampie |
I told you France was paying more, that is all I said and you are agreeing. |
When everything is taken into account, the UK paid more into the EU than France, it's that simple. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 10:12 - Oct 25 with 783 views | trampie |
| Republic of Wales on 09:57 - Oct 25 by Catullus |
When I used Hywel Dda to debunk Kilkenny he told me off for using stuff from 600 (and more, I know) years ago! I pointed out to him that King Hywel actually submitted to Athelstan of England, he accepted Athelstans dominanace
Being centuries ahead of your time is only really handy if it's the present day. Wales is well behind the times now.
Part of the reason Wales couldn't stand against the English invasion was because we couldn't unite against a common enemy.
I'm not a nationalist really. It's the world I live in but I see the only way forward as being a world without countries, without nationalities, a world where colour, creed and religion don't matter. All that matters is the person you are.
So in the worldI have to live in I prefer to remain in the Union and would prefer to reverse devolution because I think it's been an expensive cock up. |
In this context it was a time before Westminster ruled us so is a salient point to your question.
Wales totally and utterly outnumbered then as now so it made total sense to try and stay the right side of the Germanic hordes.
You say you are not a nationalist but you seem to champion Brit Nat causes and call people that don't support Brit Nat causes nationalists, so I take it you are very pro EU is that right Cat, are you very pro EU ? | |
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| Republic of Wales on 10:19 - Oct 25 with 779 views | Catullus |
| Republic of Wales on 09:46 - Oct 25 by Kilkennyjack |
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/support-wel
41%.
‘When people who said they didn't know how they would vote were excluded, the YouGov poll conducted between September 6 and 10 suggests that 31% of people would be certain to vote for independence in a referendum with 41% backing an independent Wales in the European Union if the rest of the UK leaves’.
ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ 🇪🇺ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ 🇪🇺
And this predates the Johnson right wing regime and their ‘worst in Europe‘ handling of covid. [Post edited 25 Oct 2020 9:52]
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You can't exclude people who don't know or wouldn't vote because it skews the results and you know that but you always like polls that do this because it increases the percetage you want. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 11:11 - Oct 25 with 759 views | Glossolalia |
| Republic of Wales on 09:46 - Oct 25 by Kilkennyjack |
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/support-wel
41%.
‘When people who said they didn't know how they would vote were excluded, the YouGov poll conducted between September 6 and 10 suggests that 31% of people would be certain to vote for independence in a referendum with 41% backing an independent Wales in the European Union if the rest of the UK leaves’.
ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ 🇪🇺ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ 🇪🇺
And this predates the Johnson right wing regime and their ‘worst in Europe‘ handling of covid. [Post edited 25 Oct 2020 9:52]
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32.7%
The 41% only results from excluding people who answered 'don't know'. Laughable. In other words, no actual poll has ever produced a 41% for yes. You can't just ignore 'don't know' voters, especially when they would be just as likely to vote no if pushed for a binary answer.
That is incredibly misleading and you are incorrect.
Worst in Europe? Wales is being ridiculed far and wide by the WAG's handling of the latest lockdown.
Three of this year's polls came after the COVID outbreak, where a yes vote didn't get passed 26%. One poll in June, two in August.
Check your facts boyo. |  | | |
| Republic of Wales on 11:16 - Oct 25 with 754 views | onehunglow |
So less than a third,even during these days.
Not very high is it.
It is like NI then where the majority do not want independence.
Democracy eh.
And who says Wales would be accepted in the EU and why would it want to join seeing the majority wanted to exit the EU.
Ergo,Wales should not join EU as people do not want it,so then it's Wale and it's water against the world -on it's own. Dear God. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 11:23 - Oct 25 with 743 views | trampie |
| Republic of Wales on 11:16 - Oct 25 by onehunglow |
So less than a third,even during these days.
Not very high is it.
It is like NI then where the majority do not want independence.
Democracy eh.
And who says Wales would be accepted in the EU and why would it want to join seeing the majority wanted to exit the EU.
Ergo,Wales should not join EU as people do not want it,so then it's Wale and it's water against the world -on it's own. Dear God. |
The last poll I seen said they did want independence. [Post edited 25 Oct 2020 11:29]
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| Republic of Wales on 11:35 - Oct 25 with 734 views | Catullus |
| Republic of Wales on 10:12 - Oct 25 by trampie |
In this context it was a time before Westminster ruled us so is a salient point to your question.
Wales totally and utterly outnumbered then as now so it made total sense to try and stay the right side of the Germanic hordes.
You say you are not a nationalist but you seem to champion Brit Nat causes and call people that don't support Brit Nat causes nationalists, so I take it you are very pro EU is that right Cat, are you very pro EU ? |
The salient point is Wales was not even a proper country, it was several kingdoms that Hywel Dda had mostly come to be sole ruler of, not all of "Wales" but most of it. Athelstan wasn't even considered King of all of England when Hywel pledged to him and back then being Welsh didn't define a country it defined only the people who lived there, "welsh" literally meant foreigner or slave in old English. At first Welsh was used to describe all the native peoples of Britannia.
When I call people on here Nats I mean Welsh Nats, I am pro union because I have to make a choice for the world I live in.
If you think I am pro EU you really haven't paid attention. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 11:41 - Oct 25 with 729 views | trampie |
| Republic of Wales on 11:35 - Oct 25 by Catullus |
The salient point is Wales was not even a proper country, it was several kingdoms that Hywel Dda had mostly come to be sole ruler of, not all of "Wales" but most of it. Athelstan wasn't even considered King of all of England when Hywel pledged to him and back then being Welsh didn't define a country it defined only the people who lived there, "welsh" literally meant foreigner or slave in old English. At first Welsh was used to describe all the native peoples of Britannia.
When I call people on here Nats I mean Welsh Nats, I am pro union because I have to make a choice for the world I live in.
If you think I am pro EU you really haven't paid attention. |
I know you are anti EU yet you say you want a World Government, lol
I know you mean Welsh nats when you refer to nats but you come across as more of a nationalist in defending the union than what supporters of Welsh independence are. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 11:56 - Oct 25 with 727 views | Catullus |
| Republic of Wales on 11:41 - Oct 25 by trampie |
I know you are anti EU yet you say you want a World Government, lol
I know you mean Welsh nats when you refer to nats but you come across as more of a nationalist in defending the union than what supporters of Welsh independence are. |
As I have told you elsewhere, if the EU was fit for purpose, wasn't corrupt, negligent, wasteful and even less democratic than the Uk, I could vote for it.
If devolution had been a roaroing success i'd be as pro Welsh indy as anybody but the Senedd too is a fail in my eyes.
A one world government may happen one day in the far future but only if human being grow and change.
I have said (to Kilk, not you) that I'm all for having the Indy debate and having the vote, as long as it also includes the choice to do away with devo too. Democracy see, that's what I'm really a fan of. I'd give Scotland and Northern Ireland their vote too but we should all be told that it's binding for the next 50 years.
With democracy in mind I'd do away with the house of Lords and have an elected second chamber, no hereditary rights or priviliges, no cronyism and in that sense I am also an anti Monarchist. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 13:36 - Oct 25 with 707 views | onehunglow |
One reason why ancient history should be left where it is.In story books.
Quite wtf has Hywel to do with life many centuries later | |
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| Republic of Wales on 13:55 - Oct 25 with 696 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Republic of Wales on 10:19 - Oct 25 by Catullus |
You can't exclude people who don't know or wouldn't vote because it skews the results and you know that but you always like polls that do this because it increases the percetage you want. |
I did not write the article, dumbo.
I just quoted it.
Take it up with the polling company. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 13:57 - Oct 25 with 695 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Republic of Wales on 11:56 - Oct 25 by Catullus |
As I have told you elsewhere, if the EU was fit for purpose, wasn't corrupt, negligent, wasteful and even less democratic than the Uk, I could vote for it.
If devolution had been a roaroing success i'd be as pro Welsh indy as anybody but the Senedd too is a fail in my eyes.
A one world government may happen one day in the far future but only if human being grow and change.
I have said (to Kilk, not you) that I'm all for having the Indy debate and having the vote, as long as it also includes the choice to do away with devo too. Democracy see, that's what I'm really a fan of. I'd give Scotland and Northern Ireland their vote too but we should all be told that it's binding for the next 50 years.
With democracy in mind I'd do away with the house of Lords and have an elected second chamber, no hereditary rights or priviliges, no cronyism and in that sense I am also an anti Monarchist. |
They won't accept that if the referendum result does not go their way. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 14:00 - Oct 25 with 688 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Republic of Wales on 11:11 - Oct 25 by Glossolalia |
32.7%
The 41% only results from excluding people who answered 'don't know'. Laughable. In other words, no actual poll has ever produced a 41% for yes. You can't just ignore 'don't know' voters, especially when they would be just as likely to vote no if pushed for a binary answer.
That is incredibly misleading and you are incorrect.
Worst in Europe? Wales is being ridiculed far and wide by the WAG's handling of the latest lockdown.
Three of this year's polls came after the COVID outbreak, where a yes vote didn't get passed 26%. One poll in June, two in August.
Check your facts boyo. |
Its factually correct.
The polling company published their results.
Its 41%.
If you dont think the right wing English nationalist govt of Johnson and the disaster of Covid has not increased the support for Welsh Indy, then you need to open the fecking curtains a bit more.
Johnsons government has more covid deaths than anywhere else in Europe. Try google.
[Post edited 25 Oct 2020 14:05]
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| Republic of Wales on 14:12 - Oct 25 with 680 views | Glossolalia |
| Republic of Wales on 14:00 - Oct 25 by Kilkennyjack |
Its factually correct.
The polling company published their results.
Its 41%.
If you dont think the right wing English nationalist govt of Johnson and the disaster of Covid has not increased the support for Welsh Indy, then you need to open the fecking curtains a bit more.
Johnsons government has more covid deaths than anywhere else in Europe. Try google.
[Post edited 25 Oct 2020 14:05]
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Answer me, please.
Did 41% actually answer 'yes' to independence in this poll? Because they didn't. That's factually correct - that only 32.7% said yes. What you say is only 'correct' after manipulation and the omission of certain people polled.
You say the article wrote it - true. But you then run with it as if 41% actually voted yes. You're peddling misleading info.
The facts show very little groundswell for an indyref according to the polls. Three this year, I'll repeat. Plaid need far more support and seats for this to be likely even debated in the Senedd.
Clear obstacles before it's even on the table. Besides, this poll is over a year old, and figures have dropped for indy, according to the same type of polls that you so inaccurately croon about!
I agree that these uncertain times offer scope for unprecedented things, but it appears indy isn't one of them, going by the same polls you bang on about.
I don't see how having the greatest excess deaths is gonna result in people marching for independence. Your agenda permeates your thinking too much. [Post edited 25 Oct 2020 14:21]
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| Republic of Wales on 15:27 - Oct 25 with 660 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Republic of Wales on 14:12 - Oct 25 by Glossolalia |
Answer me, please.
Did 41% actually answer 'yes' to independence in this poll? Because they didn't. That's factually correct - that only 32.7% said yes. What you say is only 'correct' after manipulation and the omission of certain people polled.
You say the article wrote it - true. But you then run with it as if 41% actually voted yes. You're peddling misleading info.
The facts show very little groundswell for an indyref according to the polls. Three this year, I'll repeat. Plaid need far more support and seats for this to be likely even debated in the Senedd.
Clear obstacles before it's even on the table. Besides, this poll is over a year old, and figures have dropped for indy, according to the same type of polls that you so inaccurately croon about!
I agree that these uncertain times offer scope for unprecedented things, but it appears indy isn't one of them, going by the same polls you bang on about.
I don't see how having the greatest excess deaths is gonna result in people marching for independence. Your agenda permeates your thinking too much. [Post edited 25 Oct 2020 14:21]
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Hey - what if people can join the dots, you know ?
Lets start at the beginning....
The UK is in huge debt
The Tory government are inept at , well, government
Wales is faced with perpetual Tory government even though we vote Labour
Scotland will be Indy
Ireland will be united
England will be Brexidiot island
None of the above is good for Wales
Yes Cymru numbers are surging, especially the young .. 🇪🇺ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ðŸ‡ªðŸ‡ºðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ | |
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| Republic of Wales on 16:22 - Oct 25 with 651 views | Glossolalia |
| Republic of Wales on 15:27 - Oct 25 by Kilkennyjack |
Hey - what if people can join the dots, you know ?
Lets start at the beginning....
The UK is in huge debt
The Tory government are inept at , well, government
Wales is faced with perpetual Tory government even though we vote Labour
Scotland will be Indy
Ireland will be united
England will be Brexidiot island
None of the above is good for Wales
Yes Cymru numbers are surging, especially the young .. 🇪🇺ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ðŸ‡ªðŸ‡ºðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ·ó ¬ó ³ó ¿ |
2+2=5 then. Ah right. You placed wish-thinking in lieu of answering a very simple question.
Actually, 16 and 17 year-olds were included in one of the 2020 polls, with very, very little change to the 'yes' percentage (a paltry 26%). As far as I'm aware, that's the only proof of any youth vote, unless you have other proof. I welcome some real debate and further figures to back your claims but I presume it'll be the same tedious lines you've repeated too many times already.
Is that you in the Star Wars Storm Trooper outfit? Very cute. TTFN mush. ðŸ˜
In fact, I'd be happy to wait 10 years for your reply, after Welsh independence. Ha. [Post edited 25 Oct 2020 16:27]
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| Republic of Wales on 16:27 - Oct 25 with 640 views | onehunglow |
Would Wales have a physical border.
Would escapers have to swim across the Dee to be free. | |
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| Republic of Wales on 16:42 - Oct 25 with 632 views | Brian_Laudrup |
| Republic of Wales on 21:58 - Oct 24 by Jack11 |
When the father of a convicted rapist preaches moralistic shite to me, I take it with a pinch of salt. Call me old fashioned. |
indeed | | | |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 16:48 - Oct 25 with 623 views | pencoedjack |
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