| De-industrialisation of the UK 12:39 - Sep 5 with 1887 views | johnlangy |
Andy Burnham has talked about the reasons he believes the UK has gone wrong in the last five decades and one of those reasons is the UK’s de-industrialisation. That thought links in to a few radio phone in chats I’ve heard recently.
A few months ago a lady rang in to bemoan the demise of the clothing industry up North. She asked the question why can’t we make these clothes any more. A while later a man rang in with the same message and question about the pottery industry. In a nutshell all companies in the eighties and nineties were looking to get their products made more cheaply and they realised they could achieve that by outsourcing production to the far east, mainly China. And we were all ecstatically happy to be able to buy a tee shirt or a cup and saucer for a pound as compared with the cost of a UK made item.
Then a month ago I read an article about the Chinese car industry. The article talked about how cheap Chinese made cars are compared with equivalent UK built ones. Which is the reason why so many are being sold. The article explained that the Chinese government took the decision a while ago to subsidise their car manufacturers so they can produce the cars at a very low price. And the reason for this is that they (the Chinese government) have decided that they want, in the next ten years, to completely take over the mass market car industry in the West.
So the same thing is happening in the car industry as happened years ago in textiles and pottery (plus numerous other areas of UK manufacturing).
A quick google of the numbers of people working in the car industry says that 183,000 jobs are directly supported while 794,000 exist across the wider supply chain.
So the result, if this carries on and China succeeds, is that in ten years time it’s certain that an enormous number of these jobs will go. The sales people will still have jobs but selling chinese cars instead.
There was then another radio discussion about the situation just yesterday. Some person was explaining how we’ve come to this point. In a similar vein, over the years western car manufacturers looking to cut the cost of manufacture sourced components from the far east. The problem is that over the years China has come to the point where they now know very well how to produce the whole car themselves rather than just the components. And that’s exactly what they’re doing. And the UK sales of those cars has gone through the roof simply down to price.
Imagine a scenario where there is no car industry in the West. Is China going to continue subsidising their car industry ? Will they still be such a bargain for us ? Obviously no because the Chinese car manufacturers would have no need of a subsidy. Because they’d be able to charge whatever the market would take. And we’d still need cars so we’d buy them. No cheap cars for us then.
So will we have another person calling in to a radio station in ten/twenty years time bemoaning the demise of the UK car industry ? Yes is the answer as things are going.
What can be done about it is the question that Andy Burnham has to answer as he’s talking about re-industrialisation. Competing with China is well nigh impossible in regard to wages.
Tariffs maybe ?
By subsidising their manufacturers the Chinese government is effectively in a Trade war with us so our government should do everything it can to protect our manufacturers. Yes ?
And it’s not simply jobs that are lost when these industries close down. The jobs I’m talking about are ones where you’d have a pride in saying I’m a – fill in any number of professions. And that’s what they were – professions. People would be doing those jobs for ten/twenty/thirty years – probably a lot of them their whole working life.
Would they now say I’m proud to be working in a call centre ? Or stacking shelves in a supermarket ? Or doing a zero hour job not knowing from one day to the next whether they had any work at all ?
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:40 - Sep 5 with 1780 views | Gwyn737 |
Whatever we do it unfortunately makes prices more expensive.
There’s over a billion people in both china and India. We can’t compete, especially when the economy is struggling.
It’s a bit like Scotia posts about immigration. We can moan about car washes, barbers and vape show but many are used very regularly.
Where there’s a need and it’s cheap, these places will thrive.
I’ve got no moral high ground. My barber is Kurdish and the car wash I use is Albanian. They both accept card payments and I use them because they’re reliable and cheap. Hopefully they’re paying they’re way.
I can’t use and British car wash or barber because the don’t exist near me. | | | |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 17:16 - Sep 5 with 1756 views | Luther27 |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:40 - Sep 5 by Gwyn737 |
Whatever we do it unfortunately makes prices more expensive.
There’s over a billion people in both china and India. We can’t compete, especially when the economy is struggling.
It’s a bit like Scotia posts about immigration. We can moan about car washes, barbers and vape show but many are used very regularly.
Where there’s a need and it’s cheap, these places will thrive.
I’ve got no moral high ground. My barber is Kurdish and the car wash I use is Albanian. They both accept card payments and I use them because they’re reliable and cheap. Hopefully they’re paying they’re way.
I can’t use and British car wash or barber because the don’t exist near me. |
It shouldnt have come to this. Goverments in this country are to blame. Brexit is an excuse for cowardly Government. We gave heard every mealy mouth excuse you could wish to hear but at the end of the day we have spent billions on overseas aid and allowed and are complacent in causing a population explosion which has helped maintain wars and caused famine.
The truth is this planet cannot support 8 Billion people. Its about time this truth hits home with us. | | | |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 17:31 - Sep 5 with 1748 views | Gwyn737 |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 17:16 - Sep 5 by Luther27 |
It shouldnt have come to this. Goverments in this country are to blame. Brexit is an excuse for cowardly Government. We gave heard every mealy mouth excuse you could wish to hear but at the end of the day we have spent billions on overseas aid and allowed and are complacent in causing a population explosion which has helped maintain wars and caused famine.
The truth is this planet cannot support 8 Billion people. Its about time this truth hits home with us. |
There’s an argument that if we don’t spend the money on overseas aid we’d have more arriving over here.
Stopping that is not easy, it’s complex and doesn’t involve nationalism and being stroppy to our neighbours.
Look at Reform. They say it’s easy and have something signed a non binding contract with France to sort it out. Absolute fantasists. | | | |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 17:37 - Sep 5 with 1745 views | AnotherJohn |
Regarding industrial decline in recent years, high energy prices must be a big factor. | | | |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 17:45 - Sep 5 with 1735 views | Luther27 |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 17:31 - Sep 5 by Gwyn737 |
There’s an argument that if we don’t spend the money on overseas aid we’d have more arriving over here.
Stopping that is not easy, it’s complex and doesn’t involve nationalism and being stroppy to our neighbours.
Look at Reform. They say it’s easy and have something signed a non binding contract with France to sort it out. Absolute fantasists. |
If you stopped overseas aid tomorrow it wouldn’t increase the influx here. It would be better used helping our European neighbours formalise and control immigration.
It would pay to also educate our own regarding climate change, population overload and food shortages. If our so called experts are correct then we should prepare for empty shelves this coming winter. Not my opinion…it’s already out there this week in the news. | | | |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 11:52 - Sep 6 with 1461 views | trampie |
Thatcher ruined the UK |  |
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 10:26 - Sep 7 with 1318 views | Wingstandwood |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 17:37 - Sep 5 by AnotherJohn |
Regarding industrial decline in recent years, high energy prices must be a big factor. |
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 12:39 - Sep 7 with 1279 views | majorraglan |
It’s not just this government, there’s been a lack of foresight, investment etc for 20 odd years. It doesn’t help that the price for all our electric is based on the most expensive source used that particular day which invariably is gas.
I dare say the system is being rigged and gamed and wind turbines are being turned off at various points so that gas generated electricity has to be drawn on and then the owners of the wind turbines get gas rates for the leccy they’ve produced.
If we had cheap electric along with incentives to invest it would make industrialisation and wealth creation much easier. | | | |
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 14:55 - Sep 7 with 1233 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 12:39 - Sep 7 by majorraglan |
It’s not just this government, there’s been a lack of foresight, investment etc for 20 odd years. It doesn’t help that the price for all our electric is based on the most expensive source used that particular day which invariably is gas.
I dare say the system is being rigged and gamed and wind turbines are being turned off at various points so that gas generated electricity has to be drawn on and then the owners of the wind turbines get gas rates for the leccy they’ve produced.
If we had cheap electric along with incentives to invest it would make industrialisation and wealth creation much easier. |
I would say 40 not 20 years.
Miliband has been selling generation contracts at prices HIGHER than today's rates.
Wind power prices up in new offshore contracts as UK moves away from gas | Money News | Sky News https://share.google/6tZO0YJ20 |  |
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 15:22 - Sep 7 with 1219 views | SullutaCreturned |
I also have no moral high ground, I mean, I cut my own hair with clippers andd I wash my own car but that car is an MGHS, Chinese and yes I bought it because it was good value at around 5-6000 cheaper than a same spec Audi.
I also knew it was cheap because the Chinese wanted to take over the car market.What can you do, everything in this country has gone to pot and all of us are just trying to get by. If we'd had decent governments the last 40 years maybe things would be different. | | | |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 15:59 - Sep 7 with 1204 views | Gwyn737 |
China are leading the world in renewables. | | | |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:21 - Sep 7 with 1183 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 15:59 - Sep 7 by Gwyn737 |
China are leading the world in renewables. |
Unless there is a change of policy in China emissions are to increase in the coming years principally through coal and chemical industries. China remains well above it's emissions targets.
Too many people are ignoring the facts and saying how good China is, when it is on course as the biggest emitter of CO2 to actually increase its emissions.
https://www.carbonbrief.org/an | |
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:33 - Sep 7 with 1162 views | Wingstandwood |
Here's another classic of 'the left' in action!
"Welsh Conservative Leader Darren Millar MS has warned that the Plaid Cymru Welsh Government risks jobs and investment in Wales after an announcement that decisions on investment in the defence sector should be put on hold. "
Let em go to England then hey!
https://www.aberdareonline.co. | |
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:45 - Sep 7 with 1155 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:33 - Sep 7 by Wingstandwood |
Here's another classic of 'the left' in action!
"Welsh Conservative Leader Darren Millar MS has warned that the Plaid Cymru Welsh Government risks jobs and investment in Wales after an announcement that decisions on investment in the defence sector should be put on hold. "
Let em go to England then hey!
https://www.aberdareonline.co. |
Try driving out of Wales at 5 am, it's nose to tail on the M4 with vans and lorries leaving Wales.
I work for a small specialist engineering company, less and less of our business is in Wales, the owner has offered a relocation package for any engineer wanting to move to the East or North of England.
It's becoming dysfunctional, many of my calls are now in the Midlands, engineers living in the Midlands are driving North to fulfill calls. It's not economic to run the Welsh part of the business. | |
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:50 - Sep 7 with 1151 views | max936 |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:33 - Sep 7 by Wingstandwood |
Here's another classic of 'the left' in action!
"Welsh Conservative Leader Darren Millar MS has warned that the Plaid Cymru Welsh Government risks jobs and investment in Wales after an announcement that decisions on investment in the defence sector should be put on hold. "
Let em go to England then hey!
https://www.aberdareonline.co. |
Spending money on things instead of what's needed which is agenda driven 100%
Where's the money promised for ALN [additional learning needs] that was give to Wales by Westminster, where's the policy and funds for Childcare ??
We got clueless Government in Westminster and our very own in the Senedd both massively out of their depth, especially so in the Senedd after27yrs of being under the disastrous Labour party, Plaid have learnt nothing, neither have the former Welsh Labour voters who voted for them, all they are getting is continuity of Labours policies.
All Ron Jones the first minister is concerned with is devolution the deputy first minister's concerns are Gender surgery and their Nation of sanctuary, when she was asked about Child care she just lost her temper, neither of them are not fit for purpose.
They've got no intention of putting Wales or its people first. |  | | |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:52 - Sep 7 with 1151 views | Wingstandwood |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:45 - Sep 7 by JACKMANANDBOY |
Try driving out of Wales at 5 am, it's nose to tail on the M4 with vans and lorries leaving Wales.
I work for a small specialist engineering company, less and less of our business is in Wales, the owner has offered a relocation package for any engineer wanting to move to the East or North of England.
It's becoming dysfunctional, many of my calls are now in the Midlands, engineers living in the Midlands are driving North to fulfill calls. It's not economic to run the Welsh part of the business. |
The left whether that be Welsh Nationalist/Yes Cymru or Labour are an absolute joke!
It's bleeding bloody obvious that the majority of them (if not all) do not have any clue whatsoever how things work in business or the real world.
Richard Selby i.e. Director, Pro Steel Engineering a few year ago...
QUOTE: "The current M4 infrastructure is on its last legs. Pro Steel strengthened one bridge and it was in a terrible state; this section of motorway was built during a time when little attention was paid to quality control.
The level of congestion will also continue to infuriate business owners and commuters for years to come and will only be detrimental to the economy of South Wales. This is a major blow for improving economic prosperity that would benefit the whole of Wales.” END OF QUOTE.
It was also asked what happens when this stretch of vital transport infrastructure is "shut for major repairs".
Then there is Wales CBI describing the scrapping of a relief road as "a 'dark day' for the Welsh economy".
Enter a new bunch of isolationist backward yokels and the obvious project to turn Wales into an impoverished economic backwater continues! And to think some want to give these incapable clowns even more power! | |
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 17:04 - Sep 7 with 1140 views | AnotherJohn |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 15:59 - Sep 7 by Gwyn737 |
China are leading the world in renewables. |
As I wrote in a post last year, personal experience suggests that it is rare to see a clear blue sky in a large Chinese city, and a sore throat usually comes along after a couple of weeks. Yes, there are a lot of electric vehicles and solar panels but also mega industries that have a huge carbon footprint. | | | |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 23:19 - Sep 7 with 1022 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 16:52 - Sep 7 by Wingstandwood |
The left whether that be Welsh Nationalist/Yes Cymru or Labour are an absolute joke!
It's bleeding bloody obvious that the majority of them (if not all) do not have any clue whatsoever how things work in business or the real world.
Richard Selby i.e. Director, Pro Steel Engineering a few year ago...
QUOTE: "The current M4 infrastructure is on its last legs. Pro Steel strengthened one bridge and it was in a terrible state; this section of motorway was built during a time when little attention was paid to quality control.
The level of congestion will also continue to infuriate business owners and commuters for years to come and will only be detrimental to the economy of South Wales. This is a major blow for improving economic prosperity that would benefit the whole of Wales.” END OF QUOTE.
It was also asked what happens when this stretch of vital transport infrastructure is "shut for major repairs".
Then there is Wales CBI describing the scrapping of a relief road as "a 'dark day' for the Welsh economy".
Enter a new bunch of isolationist backward yokels and the obvious project to turn Wales into an impoverished economic backwater continues! And to think some want to give these incapable clowns even more power! |
Well their decisions are slowly killing jobs with my employer in Wales. I'll be staying with my cousin in Birmingham soon during the week because there is less and less call for specialist engineering in Wales. | |
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| De-industrialisation of the UK on 00:38 - Sep 8 with 1008 views | JJBomber |
| De-industrialisation of the UK on 17:37 - Sep 5 by AnotherJohn |
Regarding industrial decline in recent years, high energy prices must be a big factor. |
And increasing employer NI. | | | |
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