| Len McClusky and Tom Watson 21:45 - Jul 13 with 4006 views | waynekerr55 |
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| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 14:39 - Jul 14 with 864 views | bluey_the_blue |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 14:26 - Jul 14 by londonlisa2001 |
Companies don’t want a no deal. They also don’t want Corbyn.
No one believe no deal will happen. It’s not priced in. |
Companies want certainty. May not want no deal but if that's what happens, they then know what they are dealing with.
Companies certainly don't want Corbyn but don't get to vote.Given everything that has gone on, can't rule out anything happening... |  | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 14:48 - Jul 14 with 845 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 14:39 - Jul 14 by bluey_the_blue |
Companies want certainty. May not want no deal but if that's what happens, they then know what they are dealing with.
Companies certainly don't want Corbyn but don't get to vote.Given everything that has gone on, can't rule out anything happening... |
The certainty issue is a factor, but having certainty that we are in the crap doesn’t help companies Bluey.
Repeat and keep repeating - no deal just means we end up with May’s deal with a few months of carnage before it as we have to have a trade agreement with the EU. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 14:48 - Jul 14 with 843 views | sherpajacob |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 14:39 - Jul 14 by bluey_the_blue |
Companies want certainty. May not want no deal but if that's what happens, they then know what they are dealing with.
Companies certainly don't want Corbyn but don't get to vote.Given everything that has gone on, can't rule out anything happening... |
This "no deal on 31/10 otherwise you get Corbyn" argument makes no sense to me.
If Corbyn is the disaster they predict, he'll be gone after 5 years max. The consequences of a no deal exit will last considerably longer. |  |
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| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 15:21 - Jul 14 with 817 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 14:48 - Jul 14 by sherpajacob |
This "no deal on 31/10 otherwise you get Corbyn" argument makes no sense to me.
If Corbyn is the disaster they predict, he'll be gone after 5 years max. The consequences of a no deal exit will last considerably longer. |
The people most adversely affected will change though.
Boris (let’s assume it’s him) will bring in measures to protect the wealthier from the economic hit. He’ll borrow to subside increased thresholds for higher rate of tax, reduce stamp duty on expensive homes, pump less money into public services.
Corbyn will hike income and corporation taxes, introduce more property taxes, borrow to pump money into welfare provision.
A no deal Brexit will hugely damage the economy, and the ones supporting it will be the people who most suffer. Corbyn will damage the economy but the ones voting for him will see less personal damage. Where Corbyn will suffer, however, is the people he will put taxes on will just not pay them. They never do. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 20:31 - Jul 14 with 755 views | waynekerr55 |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 12:13 - Jul 14 by Neath_Jack |
Any type of Labour government is better than a Tory one.
Is there a difference between the antisemitism in Labour and the Islamophobia in the toffs party? |
This is not a dig at you Neathy, but isn't this classic whataboutery which is usually reserved for our swivel eyed loons in the Conservatives?
But yes, there is merit in what you say about the Tories in that their policies are disgusting. [Post edited 14 Jul 2019 20:36]
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| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 20:44 - Jul 14 with 732 views | Neath_Jack |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 20:31 - Jul 14 by waynekerr55 |
This is not a dig at you Neathy, but isn't this classic whataboutery which is usually reserved for our swivel eyed loons in the Conservatives?
But yes, there is merit in what you say about the Tories in that their policies are disgusting. [Post edited 14 Jul 2019 20:36]
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It would be if i had directed it at the resident swivel eyed vermin chap. Plus it is a question, as LBC had it as a topic on one of their shows last week.
Two cheeks of the same arsehole if you ask me. |  |
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| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 07:18 - Jul 15 with 668 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 20:31 - Jul 14 by waynekerr55 |
This is not a dig at you Neathy, but isn't this classic whataboutery which is usually reserved for our swivel eyed loons in the Conservatives?
But yes, there is merit in what you say about the Tories in that their policies are disgusting. [Post edited 14 Jul 2019 20:36]
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If people don't like both they don't have to vote for either. I feel that what is happening in both main parties is unacceptable so my vote will go elsewhere. |  |
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| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 08:49 - Jul 15 with 643 views | waynekerr55 |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 07:18 - Jul 15 by JACKMANANDBOY |
If people don't like both they don't have to vote for either. I feel that what is happening in both main parties is unacceptable so my vote will go elsewhere. |
It will be interesting to see what happens with the Lib Dem vote at the next GE | |
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| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 09:49 - Jul 15 with 630 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 08:49 - Jul 15 by waynekerr55 |
It will be interesting to see what happens with the Lib Dem vote at the next GE |
I'm leaning that way, they need to select their leader and let's see what happens. | |
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| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 09:53 - Jul 15 with 627 views | bluey_the_blue |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 09:49 - Jul 15 by JACKMANANDBOY |
I'm leaning that way, they need to select their leader and let's see what happens. |
If Labour do U turn as Thornberry has said and back Remain, then it'll split Lib Dem vote. Those who left Labour purely on not backing Remain will return. Those Labour who backed leave could then well not vote for Labour.
So theoretically, Labour could remain ( pun not intended ) constant, Lib Dems decline.
It's where Leavers exiting Labour go that's important. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 11:57 - Jul 15 with 585 views | WarwickHunt |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 09:53 - Jul 15 by bluey_the_blue |
If Labour do U turn as Thornberry has said and back Remain, then it'll split Lib Dem vote. Those who left Labour purely on not backing Remain will return. Those Labour who backed leave could then well not vote for Labour.
So theoretically, Labour could remain ( pun not intended ) constant, Lib Dems decline.
It's where Leavers exiting Labour go that's important. |
Labour’s position on Remain is only part of their problem.
People, including lifelong Labour supporters, have twigged that Corbyn is a dim puppet with the strings being pulled by Marxists stuck in a 70s time warp.
If Watson is forced out, there’s up to a hundred who will join him. Bring it on. |  | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 12:10 - Jul 15 with 583 views | PawelAbbott |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 12:20 - Jul 14 by exiledclaseboy |
I’ll be voting for them. It’s either Labour or the Tories here so there’s no real decision to be made there. |
This is why we end up with a 2 party system.
After what the Tories have done to screw up this country for the last 10 years they should be obliterated out of sight. I'm surprised there is still a person left in the country willing to vote for them.
10 years of austerity to achieve next to nothing. Universal Credit dumping millions below the poverty line. The total shambles of Brexit, anything that moves being taxed to death apart from multinational conglomerates that pay next to nothing.
Yet still people will vote for them because they're not Corbyn.
There are other options. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 12:15 - Jul 15 with 581 views | DafyddHuw |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 13:57 - Jul 14 by londonlisa2001 |
I agree to a extent. But if everyone who dislikes both Tories and Labour equally (like me) votes for a third party (Lib Dems here, probably Plaid in Wales) , the duopoly would break, or certainly fracture.
I can quite easily see an outcome next GE where the LibDems hold the balance of power. One just has to hope Jo Swinson has more balls than Nick Clegg. |
We badly need a system as in almost all of Europe - PR.
Voting to prop up either of 2 parties is so backward.
I almost always vote Green ( who tend to be a bit more left than Labour, but sensible with it), but my vote is wasted. It needn't be.
We need to be far less backward about our electoral system in this country. |  | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 15:05 - Jul 15 with 531 views | huwrichards57 |
To be honest I do think the Corbynistic, transformative vision is one that the country could do with. But Corbyn has become too toxic now I think; the Brexit and anti Semitic-related Labour problems aren't going to go away until Corbyn and those around him go. So Corbynistas should perhaps realise that their vision could be achieved with someone else leading the party; for example, Keir Starmer would be ideal IMO. He's been Remain enough to actually convince Remainers that their is conviction behind Labour's calls for a second ref and to advocate remain and reform in that. And he will have a better chance of being robust with the anti-Semitism stuff. And, crucially, he's been closely enough aligned to the Corbyn project that he could credibly harness the popular ideas Corbyn has espoused; scrap tuition fees, tax and spend, nationalisation and a more ethical foreign policy. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 15:23 - Jul 15 with 524 views | monmouth |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 15:05 - Jul 15 by huwrichards57 |
To be honest I do think the Corbynistic, transformative vision is one that the country could do with. But Corbyn has become too toxic now I think; the Brexit and anti Semitic-related Labour problems aren't going to go away until Corbyn and those around him go. So Corbynistas should perhaps realise that their vision could be achieved with someone else leading the party; for example, Keir Starmer would be ideal IMO. He's been Remain enough to actually convince Remainers that their is conviction behind Labour's calls for a second ref and to advocate remain and reform in that. And he will have a better chance of being robust with the anti-Semitism stuff. And, crucially, he's been closely enough aligned to the Corbyn project that he could credibly harness the popular ideas Corbyn has espoused; scrap tuition fees, tax and spend, nationalisation and a more ethical foreign policy. |
If Starmer or Cooper became leader, the Johnson led Tories would shit their pants and Labour would get a majority easily. Corbyn and his w*nk squad are the real problem. |  |
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| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 15:46 - Jul 15 with 511 views | bluey_the_blue |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 15:23 - Jul 15 by monmouth |
If Starmer or Cooper became leader, the Johnson led Tories would shit their pants and Labour would get a majority easily. Corbyn and his w*nk squad are the real problem. |
Agree on Corbyn and his w*nk squad, but Starmer or Cooper?
Remain might appeal to the London set, Labour will lose too many leave voters. Starmer has a nasty side - see Robin Hood airport trial. Cooper opportunistically ran with the Remain camp despite her constituency voting Leave, I seem to recall - equally, she'll never be Labour leader given no woman has ever finished anything other than last in their elections.
Equally, you've got Labour staff possibly going on strike. EHRC investigation which could rumble on for a few years. Labour lords jumping in on antisemitism row. Labour staff taking legal action against party. They are in complete and utter disarray - removing Corbyn, sure, removes the root problem but Starmer can unite the party and take them forward? Those who back Corbyn are going to want vengeance on any who remove him / replace him. With the entryism thanks to Millibland, Corbyn simply stands and wins again... until he pegs it or resigns, he's going nowhere.
I don't see BoJo, if he wins, staying past a year. Deliver Brexit of whatever sort then jettison him. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 16:28 - Jul 15 with 493 views | WarwickHunt |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 15:05 - Jul 15 by huwrichards57 |
To be honest I do think the Corbynistic, transformative vision is one that the country could do with. But Corbyn has become too toxic now I think; the Brexit and anti Semitic-related Labour problems aren't going to go away until Corbyn and those around him go. So Corbynistas should perhaps realise that their vision could be achieved with someone else leading the party; for example, Keir Starmer would be ideal IMO. He's been Remain enough to actually convince Remainers that their is conviction behind Labour's calls for a second ref and to advocate remain and reform in that. And he will have a better chance of being robust with the anti-Semitism stuff. And, crucially, he's been closely enough aligned to the Corbyn project that he could credibly harness the popular ideas Corbyn has espoused; scrap tuition fees, tax and spend, nationalisation and a more ethical foreign policy. |
He’s also a very bright bloke with the added bonus of being able to dress himself...
He won’t become leader while the student Marxists are in charge though. Even if was, he’d distance himself from the outer reaches of Corbyn’s fantasy Utopia pretty fûcking sharpish. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 16:37 - Jul 15 with 492 views | bluey_the_blue |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 16:28 - Jul 15 by WarwickHunt |
He’s also a very bright bloke with the added bonus of being able to dress himself...
He won’t become leader while the student Marxists are in charge though. Even if was, he’d distance himself from the outer reaches of Corbyn’s fantasy Utopia pretty fûcking sharpish. |
That's the issue isn't it?
Momentum takeover complete. Corbyn survived PLP voting 172-40 no confidence in him because he knows union and member polls will always enable him to win.
Those capable of taking over? Neutered by that; their only hope is that the rumour large decline in membership is true. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 17:22 - Jul 15 with 476 views | WarwickHunt |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 16:37 - Jul 15 by bluey_the_blue |
That's the issue isn't it?
Momentum takeover complete. Corbyn survived PLP voting 172-40 no confidence in him because he knows union and member polls will always enable him to win.
Those capable of taking over? Neutered by that; their only hope is that the rumour large decline in membership is true. |
It is. 100,000+ “lapsed” memberships.
Large proportion of first-timers haven’t renewed. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 17:24 - Jul 15 with 476 views | bluey_the_blue |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 17:22 - Jul 15 by WarwickHunt |
It is. 100,000+ “lapsed” memberships.
Large proportion of first-timers haven’t renewed. |
Well, Labour are refusing to release the figures...
I sense first timers who wanted Remain have left, prior to the 127th U turn. The problem is, there are very many members who pre-dated the entryism; those go, then it balances out with the first timers meaning Corbyn remains until he wants to step down. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 17:40 - Jul 15 with 463 views | huwrichards57 |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 16:28 - Jul 15 by WarwickHunt |
He’s also a very bright bloke with the added bonus of being able to dress himself...
He won’t become leader while the student Marxists are in charge though. Even if was, he’d distance himself from the outer reaches of Corbyn’s fantasy Utopia pretty fûcking sharpish. |
Think his grip over the members is gradually eroding though. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 17:48 - Jul 15 with 457 views | bluey_the_blue |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 17:40 - Jul 15 by huwrichards57 |
Think his grip over the members is gradually eroding though. |
Long time Labour members are leaving though. Balances out. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 18:00 - Jul 15 with 443 views | WarwickHunt |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 17:24 - Jul 15 by bluey_the_blue |
Well, Labour are refusing to release the figures...
I sense first timers who wanted Remain have left, prior to the 127th U turn. The problem is, there are very many members who pre-dated the entryism; those go, then it balances out with the first timers meaning Corbyn remains until he wants to step down. |
They won’t release the figures officially for obvious reasons.
Not everyone in the Labour Party wants Corbyn as leader though...
When the 6 month allowance for lapses in renewal subscriptions expires the real figure is closer to 150k. | | | |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 19:55 - Jul 15 with 417 views | waynekerr55 |
| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 16:28 - Jul 15 by WarwickHunt |
He’s also a very bright bloke with the added bonus of being able to dress himself...
He won’t become leader while the student Marxists are in charge though. Even if was, he’d distance himself from the outer reaches of Corbyn’s fantasy Utopia pretty fûcking sharpish. |
"Added bonus of being able to dress himself"
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| Len McClusky and Tom Watson on 20:18 - Jul 15 with 402 views | bluey_the_blue |
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