| “We need to rotate” 19:32 - Mar 20 with 13072 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Can we stop with that nonsense now please, and realise the fact that we have an incredibly front loaded and lop sided squad.
Bidwell looked like a player that had been rotated, no sharpness and no fluidity and about 3 yards off the pace. Whittaker for all his effort has nowhere near the physical attributes to be playing at this level yet, he showed what he could be at times and is going to be a very good player I have no doubt, but he was knocked off the ball every time he was challenged and we gave up possession far too easily. Naughton is not a centre back and what benefits he may give us when we have the ball sadly we lose without it, we were dominated in the air in both boxes.
We need to play our best team and accept we will be tired at times, that’s the nature of football when you don’t have a big squad full of quality. Which is something we don’t have despite many pretending otherwise.
I am full of praise for the management team and their achievements thus far but one area where I feel disappointed in is I don’t think they have blocked out the noise efficiently enough. To me, it looks like they have allowed desperate opinion to be picked up by journalists and has allowed that to permeate their decision making. This latest game seems to be the epitome of that. It was a disjointed game with what looked like a cobbled together team.
Cabango, Lowe and Smith have to start. |  |
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| “We need to rotate” on 20:10 - Apr 8 with 946 views | jack247 |
| “We need to rotate” on 19:58 - Apr 8 by onehunglow |
Don't agree.
Cricket too far more technical and full of nuances.
Tennis too,golf and squash too. |
I’m sure they are.
This isn’t a particularly complex link, but it explains the system we normally use. You can probably see for yourself the logic behind Naughton suiting that role more than Cabango, even if you don’t agree.
https://themastermindsite.com/
Plenty of nuances in there and all it’s covering is the formation. |  | | |
| “We need to rotate” on 20:13 - Apr 8 with 939 views | Fireboy2 |
| “We need to rotate” on 18:06 - Apr 8 by jack247 |
I know. I need to just give up on this thread. It’s patently not going anywhere. He’s decided his opinion is fact and I’m not going to convince him otherwise. |
He thinks he is right in almost every topic he debates.
Thats why no one can be bothered with him.
Hes obviously a erudite person but let's himself down with his attitude towards others opinions.
Sad really. |  | | |
| “We need to rotate” on 00:42 - Apr 9 with 898 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| “We need to rotate” on 18:04 - Apr 8 by jack247 |
Of course you would. I doubt you’d find many that agree |
I do. | |
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| “We need to rotate” on 00:47 - Apr 9 with 895 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| “We need to rotate” on 20:13 - Apr 8 by Fireboy2 |
He thinks he is right in almost every topic he debates.
Thats why no one can be bothered with him.
Hes obviously a erudite person but let's himself down with his attitude towards others opinions.
Sad really. |
It’s not about thinking I’m right. It’s about knowing I’m right. I’m not discussing an opinion of mine here, I’m discussing a statement of fact.
I’m more than happy for people to disagree than Cabango is the better player. I’m more than happy for people to disagree that we will play better with him in the side.
What you can’t disagree with however is that as a team we have excelled in every single key metric when he has played in that position over Naughton.
While that frustrates the likes of you because you see me easily dismantling the other side and you see it as arrogance. I’m sure the more astute among the forum will recognise that in situations where debates are so long and I am invoked, it is simply because what I am stating is quite clearly a fact and very easily demonstrated.
More than happy for you to help him out and demonstrate yourself which matches we played better with Naughton there over Cabango and of course demonstrate how, we can use that criteria to compare and contract the two. The offer (unsurprisingly) has yet to be taken up.
Until that time, facts always beat hunches. Sorry if that offends. [Post edited 9 Apr 2021 1:03]
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| “We need to rotate” on 00:51 - Apr 9 with 893 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| “We need to rotate” on 20:10 - Apr 8 by jack247 |
I’m sure they are.
This isn’t a particularly complex link, but it explains the system we normally use. You can probably see for yourself the logic behind Naughton suiting that role more than Cabango, even if you don’t agree.
https://themastermindsite.com/
Plenty of nuances in there and all it’s covering is the formation. |
When demonstrating a point you can’t just say “nuances” though. You do realise that don’t you? Again that’s the religious type nothing answer.
You have to demonstrate those nuances.
You took a stab in the dark earlier and said we aren’t a better side with Cabango there, despite clearly performing better in all key areas of performance. The reason you gave was that there were variables in some matches such as injuries etc.
I asked you which ones... and you didn’t know. In order to use the “nuance” argument, then you will have to specifically demonstrate it. Otherwise it’s just noise.
Happy to take your factors you want to add or take away if unfairly present and compare again. I have offered this many times. You haven’t taken me up on it as of yet and I’m sure everyone can see that you won’t either. | |
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| “We need to rotate” on 00:55 - Apr 9 with 892 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| “We need to rotate” on 20:10 - Apr 8 by jack247 |
I’m sure they are.
This isn’t a particularly complex link, but it explains the system we normally use. You can probably see for yourself the logic behind Naughton suiting that role more than Cabango, even if you don’t agree.
https://themastermindsite.com/
Plenty of nuances in there and all it’s covering is the formation. |
Also, suiting the role in some aspects doesn’t mean it transitions to overall team performance. Nathan Dyer suits the role too in some aspects with the ball, but he would let himself down massively when as a team we don’t have the ball and he has to act as a CB again.
As a team we have performed better when Cabango is there, it’s unquestionable. The reason for that is Cabango can do most things Naughton can (Naughton makes less than 2 passes per game more - it’s minimal), yet Naughton can’t do a lot of things Cabango can.
While you are focussing on those things that Naughton does slightly better, you are missing the glaring elephant in the room of the massive chasm in the things Cabango can do but Naughton can’t.
The proof is in the effect that has on team performance, there is a more than fair sample size to look at. Want me to go through the effect on the team again and the areas of difference between the two?
I will happily do so. [Post edited 9 Apr 2021 1:00]
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| “We need to rotate” on 08:36 - Apr 9 with 854 views | Fireboy2 |
| “We need to rotate” on 00:47 - Apr 9 by Dr_Parnassus |
It’s not about thinking I’m right. It’s about knowing I’m right. I’m not discussing an opinion of mine here, I’m discussing a statement of fact.
I’m more than happy for people to disagree than Cabango is the better player. I’m more than happy for people to disagree that we will play better with him in the side.
What you can’t disagree with however is that as a team we have excelled in every single key metric when he has played in that position over Naughton.
While that frustrates the likes of you because you see me easily dismantling the other side and you see it as arrogance. I’m sure the more astute among the forum will recognise that in situations where debates are so long and I am invoked, it is simply because what I am stating is quite clearly a fact and very easily demonstrated.
More than happy for you to help him out and demonstrate yourself which matches we played better with Naughton there over Cabango and of course demonstrate how, we can use that criteria to compare and contract the two. The offer (unsurprisingly) has yet to be taken up.
Until that time, facts always beat hunches. Sorry if that offends. [Post edited 9 Apr 2021 1:03]
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I stopped reading after your second sentence, enough said. | | | |
| “We need to rotate” on 08:48 - Apr 9 with 849 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| “We need to rotate” on 08:36 - Apr 9 by Fireboy2 |
I stopped reading after your second sentence, enough said. |
You missed out. | |
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| “We need to rotate” on 12:22 - Apr 9 with 825 views | 9MilesHigh |
He's in full on Dimi mode now. Unstoppable bore  |  | | |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:34 - Apr 9 with 793 views | onehunglow |
| “We need to rotate” on 08:36 - Apr 9 by Fireboy2 |
I stopped reading after your second sentence, enough said. |
How can it be demonstrated a team plays "better" with one individual rather than another. | |
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| “We need to rotate” (n/t) on 17:34 - Apr 9 with 778 views | jack247 |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:34 - Apr 9 by onehunglow |
How can it be demonstrated a team plays "better" with one individual rather than another. |
[Post edited 9 Apr 2021 18:13]
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| “We need to rotate” on 23:26 - Apr 9 with 741 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:34 - Apr 9 by onehunglow |
How can it be demonstrated a team plays "better" with one individual rather than another. |
By hitting all key metrics of performance. Ball retention, chances created, chances allowed, goals scored, goals conceded, points gained.
Over a large sample size it’s clear that if one player playing in a key position is consistently contributing to better team performances then another, then the team plays better with them playing than with them not. | |
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| “We need to rotate” on 15:40 - Apr 10 with 692 views | AndyCole |
The management team blocked out the noise with distinction yet again.
They clearly know best.
What a performance, what a result. Testimony to a collective inner belief in the methods, strategy and matchday tactics. | |
| Pro free speech and alternative opinions -
Anti gang-bullying and poor modding thereof -
Will always make a stand against those who consistently choose to turn a blind eye |
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| “We need to rotate” on 10:50 - Apr 12 with 637 views | 9MilesHigh |
| “We need to rotate” on 15:40 - Apr 10 by AndyCole |
The management team blocked out the noise with distinction yet again.
They clearly know best.
What a performance, what a result. Testimony to a collective inner belief in the methods, strategy and matchday tactics. |
Hee hee
"The noise" literally smashed Cooper's door down FFS and without the noise we'd be playing 5 at the back with no shots on target, no possession, no passing, no movement, no goals and no bloody hope.
This was always a completely hideous thread and your take on it sums it up. | | | |
| “We need to rotate” on 11:40 - Apr 12 with 623 views | Chief |
| “We need to rotate” on 10:50 - Apr 12 by 9MilesHigh |
Hee hee
"The noise" literally smashed Cooper's door down FFS and without the noise we'd be playing 5 at the back with no shots on target, no possession, no passing, no movement, no goals and no bloody hope.
This was always a completely hideous thread and your take on it sums it up. |
He may be slightly enthusiastic, but his point stands
The manager deserves credit for changing things and getting the result does he not? |  |
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| “We need to rotate” on 12:09 - Apr 12 with 602 views | Dr_Parnassus |
I'm glad we have more contributors to my wonderful thread, it was getting awfully quiet once I introduced the stats.
Thankfully on Saturday, the management team blocked out the noise and didn't drop Ayew and Lowe as the idiots have been calling for on a weekly basis.
We remain in a fantastic position as we have done most of the season. Well done Cooper and the players. | |
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| “We need to rotate” on 12:26 - Apr 12 with 594 views | 34dfgdf54 |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:09 - Apr 12 by Dr_Parnassus |
I'm glad we have more contributors to my wonderful thread, it was getting awfully quiet once I introduced the stats.
Thankfully on Saturday, the management team blocked out the noise and didn't drop Ayew and Lowe as the idiots have been calling for on a weekly basis.
We remain in a fantastic position as we have done most of the season. Well done Cooper and the players. |
By doing what the fans have been screaming out for, well, most..... |  | | |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:32 - Apr 12 with 588 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:26 - Apr 12 by 34dfgdf54 |
By doing what the fans have been screaming out for, well, most..... |
That seems to be what the notion has been hijacked as today yes. It's bizarre.
Last game is where you had that accolade, you said it was the exact team you would have chosen. It was without Lowe and started Whittaker and had half a team of changes.... It was the worst performance of the season.
This week he started Hourihane and Lowe and apart from the inclusion of Routledge went with much the same team that he gets abused for ''running into the ground''.
But if it makes your lot happy then yes, of course you have been calling for him to start these players.... | |
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| “We need to rotate” on 12:33 - Apr 12 with 587 views | 9MilesHigh |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:26 - Apr 12 by 34dfgdf54 |
By doing what the fans have been screaming out for, well, most..... |
The noise got so bad literally more than a thousand fans voted for Cooper Out on social media.
After the most insipid period of football since our cowardly end to the Premier League Cooper had nowhere else to turn. | | | |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:35 - Apr 12 with 581 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:33 - Apr 12 by 9MilesHigh |
The noise got so bad literally more than a thousand fans voted for Cooper Out on social media.
After the most insipid period of football since our cowardly end to the Premier League Cooper had nowhere else to turn. |
The noise telling him to drop Ayew and Lowe? The noise telling him to start Whittaker? The noise telling him to never play Hourihane?
It seems your version of noise has become suddenly very selective.... [Post edited 12 Apr 2021 12:38]
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| “We need to rotate” on 12:41 - Apr 12 with 575 views | Chief |
Yes bit of a myth developing here again....
The only player who's played a lot recently who didn't start was Roberts, and the only player who's barely played who started was Routledge. One real change, which is what Cooper's done throughout the season, in fact he's often changed more....
So it's a bit strange to state on thread about rotation that Cooper's finally started listening (to the 'noise'! Lol) | |
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| “We need to rotate” on 12:45 - Apr 12 with 564 views | jack247 |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:32 - Apr 12 by Dr_Parnassus |
That seems to be what the notion has been hijacked as today yes. It's bizarre.
Last game is where you had that accolade, you said it was the exact team you would have chosen. It was without Lowe and started Whittaker and had half a team of changes.... It was the worst performance of the season.
This week he started Hourihane and Lowe and apart from the inclusion of Routledge went with much the same team that he gets abused for ''running into the ground''.
But if it makes your lot happy then yes, of course you have been calling for him to start these players.... |
Without two of the three players that ‘have to start’. Without Connor Roberts who, according to the commentary team, Cooper had pulled aside and they’d mutually decided was due a break.
The last game before that, Lowe started.
Other than that, I agree. | | | |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:50 - Apr 12 with 562 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:45 - Apr 12 by jack247 |
Without two of the three players that ‘have to start’. Without Connor Roberts who, according to the commentary team, Cooper had pulled aside and they’d mutually decided was due a break.
The last game before that, Lowe started.
Other than that, I agree. |
In the 3-5-2 that we used to play when the thread was created, yes (this thread is a month old). That obviously changes if we decide to change formation. Cabango still should play in a 4 man defence though (as you have also stated) but can see an argument for not playing Smith.
However in terms of personnel, Routledge/Roberts aside - this is largely the same lot that have been vilified for weeks on end and the manager has been called out for playing. Woodman, Lowe, Ayew and Hourihane - they all started.
But yes, I am sure people will be happy to forget that and pretend they didn't say anything of the sort. Bizarre. [Post edited 12 Apr 2021 12:52]
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| “We need to rotate” on 12:55 - Apr 12 with 550 views | 9MilesHigh |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:32 - Apr 12 by Dr_Parnassus |
That seems to be what the notion has been hijacked as today yes. It's bizarre.
Last game is where you had that accolade, you said it was the exact team you would have chosen. It was without Lowe and started Whittaker and had half a team of changes.... It was the worst performance of the season.
This week he started Hourihane and Lowe and apart from the inclusion of Routledge went with much the same team that he gets abused for ''running into the ground''.
But if it makes your lot happy then yes, of course you have been calling for him to start these players.... |
You can pick any formation you like but if you take to a game with the mentality of Cooper-ball you'll only have one outcome. Spoil, nick, sit back in position, allow the opposition to come at you and dominate possession, look to hold on.... that's what we've had for the vast majority of the season.
No wonder the players had a spring in their step v Millwall, they were enjoying attacking in a football game again. Enjoying seeing the ball more.
Our back 4 and 3 midfielders (a platform/unit of 7) had 42% of the possession compared to Millwall's equivalent platform of 8 with just 31%
That's where this game was won. Ayew and Lowe more than did their jobs but having that force behind you and the will to play further up the pitch gave us something we've been missing for most of the season, bar the odd decent game here and there.
The only games we can honestly look back on this season and talk favourably about performance, especially, over the result have been....
Brentford away
Cardiff away
Watford home
Reading home
Norwich home
Bristol City home (first half mostly)
So it's literally a handful of games where we can say that.
And you can try and mock certain tactical or player replacement ideas all you like but that will never change the fact we needed to change things. It got so bad in the end Cooper was looking over his shoulder.
And categorically, in the last 3 months Lowe and Ayew should both have had spells on the sideline. To laugh now because they scored goals in this last game means nothing.
Football is cyclical, form is cyclical. Players have no God given right to be playing when they aren't performing. But Cooper has watched over our slide and has conceded the Automatic slots - or at least it looks like that.
Had Cooper found the balls and courage to change things up in Feb/March, given Ayew and Lowe the kick up their arse they both needed then things may have been a lot different.
Had Cooper freshened up the tired looking 352 and worked on a different approach, things may have been a lot different.
These changes were crying out to be made.
The NOISE MADE IT HAPPEN. | | | |
| “We need to rotate” on 13:00 - Apr 12 with 536 views | jack247 |
| “We need to rotate” on 12:50 - Apr 12 by Dr_Parnassus |
In the 3-5-2 that we used to play when the thread was created, yes (this thread is a month old). That obviously changes if we decide to change formation. Cabango still should play in a 4 man defence though (as you have also stated) but can see an argument for not playing Smith.
However in terms of personnel, Routledge/Roberts aside - this is largely the same lot that have been vilified for weeks on end and the manager has been called out for playing. Woodman, Lowe, Ayew and Hourihane - they all started.
But yes, I am sure people will be happy to forget that and pretend they didn't say anything of the sort. Bizarre. [Post edited 12 Apr 2021 12:52]
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Yeah, I would personally play Cabango in a 433
Cooper, who knows more than me, didn’t even start him in the formation he’s most suited to. If he doesn’t want to play him there, it would be mental to play him on the right of the three, for the reasons you learnt the other day, when I provided a link explaining the role.
Thank you for having the humility to state you can see the logic in not starting Smith every game. | | | |
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