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More bad news for the non believers. on 12:00 - Aug 7 by raynor94
Fair play, exciting article
Why?
I mean ignore the headline which is misrepresenting what is said in the article and what you’re left with us ‘owners will need to put in money’. So the club is being run at a loss and has taken on debt. Exactly what everyone has kept saying shouldn’t happen.
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More bad news for the non believers. on 12:27 - Aug 7 with 1901 views
'New' investment suggests investment has already occurred. When in reality all that has happened is that the club received a (zero risk for the lenders) loan. (At 5% interest).
Bit of a contradiction in the article besides this in that Winter states "there's funds available" and then that the "owner's will have to invest again". Well if there's funds available, why are they planning to put more money in? Maybe they're enjoying their 5% zero risk in uncertain times?
Plus we know these people do not keep their word- that zoom interview included statements which they didn't keep. So until they do loan the club more, I don't see why anyone would believe them.
In addition, this is horrible news for the club. Realistically, what are they going to loan in? The club is already in the hole to them for 10mill ish (interest on top of that). If that type of figure is loaned again, where are Swansea as a championship club going to Get 20mill plus to pay these people back? Ladening the club with debt is extremely dodgy in my opinion.
More bad news for the non believers. on 12:26 - Aug 7 by londonlisa2001
Why?
I mean ignore the headline which is misrepresenting what is said in the article and what you’re left with us ‘owners will need to put in money’. So the club is being run at a loss and has taken on debt. Exactly what everyone has kept saying shouldn’t happen.
That's the Championship though, isn't it. Unless we can produce and sell players every year or so debt is inevitable. Almost every club is spending more than it takes in simply on wages. Almost every club has enormous and increasing debts.
Developing £20m+ players for Chelsea and Liverpool gets us nowhere.
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More bad news for the non believers. on 13:21 - Aug 7 with 1735 views
More bad news for the non believers. on 12:59 - Aug 7 by jasper_T
That's the Championship though, isn't it. Unless we can produce and sell players every year or so debt is inevitable. Almost every club is spending more than it takes in simply on wages. Almost every club has enormous and increasing debts.
Developing £20m+ players for Chelsea and Liverpool gets us nowhere.
We aren’t going to go up and the owners aren’t going to recover their money without loan players.
If the long term plan is to stay in the Championship and sell a starlet every year to tick us over, then fair enough we don’t need them. It’s probably an unpopular view, but they generally improve our side or get sent back.
We’ll get the odd Hourihane. I think we’re better off with young, hungry talents than established squad players who can’t get a game to be honest.
I don’t think we’d have got near the playoffs without Brewster and Gallagher then Guehi. We may well have challenged top two had Gibbs-White not been injured then recalled. Even Morris would have given us an option when Ayew and Lowe were running on empty.
If we’ve got better than the likes of Garner and Laird waiting for their chance, then of course, don’t bring them in. If not, there’s a balance between developing our own players and remaining competitive.
More bad news for the non believers. on 12:59 - Aug 7 by jasper_T
That's the Championship though, isn't it. Unless we can produce and sell players every year or so debt is inevitable. Almost every club is spending more than it takes in simply on wages. Almost every club has enormous and increasing debts.
Developing £20m+ players for Chelsea and Liverpool gets us nowhere.
Maybe the case. But for ages we’ve been treated to ‘the club is being run sustainably’ haven’t we?
Would be cheaper to run a club of course if we didn’t spend every couple of seasons paying off management teams?
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More bad news for the non believers. on 13:33 - Aug 7 with 1679 views
More bad news for the non believers. on 13:24 - Aug 7 by londonlisa2001
Maybe the case. But for ages we’ve been treated to ‘the club is being run sustainably’ haven’t we?
Would be cheaper to run a club of course if we didn’t spend every couple of seasons paying off management teams?
You are much better at the financial side than me. But with the trust unable to match the other owners percentage wise with investment, what other options are available apart from loans into the club.
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More bad news for the non believers. on 13:43 - Aug 7 with 1631 views
More bad news for the non believers. on 13:33 - Aug 7 by Whiterockin
You are much better at the financial side than me. But with the trust unable to match the other owners percentage wise with investment, what other options are available apart from loans into the club.
Living within our means and not having to borrow from anywhere seems a good idea to me. Ok I can buy that the last loan was to cover Covid, but why would the club want another loan? Now fans are back and Ayews wages gone, why do we need another lot? To gamble on premier league promotion? Sounds risky to me.
More bad news for the non believers. on 13:43 - Aug 7 by Chief
Living within our means and not having to borrow from anywhere seems a good idea to me. Ok I can buy that the last loan was to cover Covid, but why would the club want another loan? Now fans are back and Ayews wages gone, why do we need another lot? To gamble on premier league promotion? Sounds risky to me.
Maybe to be able to lure a decent manager to the club? After QPR assistant turning us down, it's probably a need for the club to ensure a new manager a few signings, or settle for a lower rate manager who would come to us with a piss poor squad. Plus we had to pay Cooper off.
Maybe it's not the best way to work, but I'd much rather a few small loans in order to steady the club and secure staying in this division, with a very good chance of progression, rather than take whoever we can afford, with a threadbare squad, staring at a relegation battle.
Edit: I'm not saying to do it every year. But a loan to sort the shambles that we were in out, yes.
More bad news for the non believers. on 13:43 - Aug 7 by Chief
Living within our means and not having to borrow from anywhere seems a good idea to me. Ok I can buy that the last loan was to cover Covid, but why would the club want another loan? Now fans are back and Ayews wages gone, why do we need another lot? To gamble on premier league promotion? Sounds risky to me.
Last season we had a parachute payment of £15m propping up the budget. Ayew's wages are gone and crowds will be back but that's not worth £15m. We only turned a narrow profit in the season where our parachute was closer to £35m.
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More bad news for the non believers. on 14:10 - Aug 7 with 1552 views
More bad news for the non believers. on 14:06 - Aug 7 by jasper_T
Last season we had a parachute payment of £15m propping up the budget. Ayew's wages are gone and crowds will be back but that's not worth £15m. We only turned a narrow profit in the season where our parachute was closer to £35m.
And we also sold Rodon for a lesser price to apparently get our hands on ready cash.....
This is never going to end. There'll always be some excuse as to why were skint, why we don't spend much, why we need loans, why we need sell and undersell. It's depressing.
More bad news for the non believers. on 14:06 - Aug 7 by jasper_T
Last season we had a parachute payment of £15m propping up the budget. Ayew's wages are gone and crowds will be back but that's not worth £15m. We only turned a narrow profit in the season where our parachute was closer to £35m.
Several wages are gone over the past year and a bit, not just Ayew.
Routledge, Dyer - both relatively high earnings. Guehi, Woodman, Hourihane. Others to go, replaced with cheaper options.
The season you are talking about was a very, very different squad.
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More bad news for the non believers. on 14:16 - Aug 7 with 1535 views
More bad news for the non believers. on 14:10 - Aug 7 by Chief
And we also sold Rodon for a lesser price to apparently get our hands on ready cash.....
This is never going to end. There'll always be some excuse as to why were skint, why we don't spend much, why we need loans, why we need sell and undersell. It's depressing.
Our income this season will be what it is going forward (unless we get promoted/relegated). The diminishing parachute is gone, so we're a normal ~£20m a year club now with crowds back.
Welcome to football in the EFL. Everyone's skint, selling key players and/or racking up eye-watering debt. You're right, it probably doesn't end until there's serious change in how the game is run. The temptation of the PL windfall has driven the game mad.
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More bad news for the non believers. on 14:23 - Aug 7 with 1512 views
More bad news for the non believers. on 14:10 - Aug 7 by Chief
And we also sold Rodon for a lesser price to apparently get our hands on ready cash.....
This is never going to end. There'll always be some excuse as to why were skint, why we don't spend much, why we need loans, why we need sell and undersell. It's depressing.
First game of the season ? No depression.
A great believer in taking anything you like to wherever you want to.
More bad news for the non believers. on 14:16 - Aug 7 by jasper_T
Our income this season will be what it is going forward (unless we get promoted/relegated). The diminishing parachute is gone, so we're a normal ~£20m a year club now with crowds back.
Welcome to football in the EFL. Everyone's skint, selling key players and/or racking up eye-watering debt. You're right, it probably doesn't end until there's serious change in how the game is run. The temptation of the PL windfall has driven the game mad.
Well yea so what's costing the ongoing money then considering we have shed all the premier league earners? As I say, I can buy loans to get through covid. But ongoing? We aren't going to give Martin the money needed to get promoted so this season so I don't like this one bit.
More bad news for the non believers. on 14:45 - Aug 7 by Chief
Well yea so what's costing the ongoing money then considering we have shed all the premier league earners? As I say, I can buy loans to get through covid. But ongoing? We aren't going to give Martin the money needed to get promoted so this season so I don't like this one bit.
Basic wages and operating costs. The vast majority of Championship clubs spend more than £20m a season on payroll. It's not a profitable league to be in.
Despite the increase, #CAFC £12m wage bill is one of the lowest in the Championship, only above Barnsley £11m (#LTFC did not divulge wages), so it was perhaps unsurprising they were relegated. Miles behind #LUFC £78m, #FFC £73m and WBA £67m (all included hefty promotion bonuses). pic.twitter.com/2CQKwqmfAe
More bad news for the non believers. on 14:56 - Aug 7 by jasper_T
Basic wages and operating costs. The vast majority of Championship clubs spend more than £20m a season on payroll. It's not a profitable league to be in.
Despite the increase, #CAFC £12m wage bill is one of the lowest in the Championship, only above Barnsley £11m (#LTFC did not divulge wages), so it was perhaps unsurprising they were relegated. Miles behind #LUFC £78m, #FFC £73m and WBA £67m (all included hefty promotion bonuses). pic.twitter.com/2CQKwqmfAe
Yea but we also sell players while only investing a small percentage back in. So we usually get a lot in player fees. Grimes will be gone soon I presume.
More bad news for the non believers. on 15:15 - Aug 7 by Chief
Yea but we also sell players while only investing a small percentage back in. So we usually get a lot in player fees. Grimes will be gone soon I presume.
Net profits on player sales aren't unusual either. We had the lowest net transfer profit in the top 6 last season except for Barnsley. There's nothing to suggest selling Rodon for £11m should mean we're set for a few years.
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More bad news for the non believers. on 18:08 - Aug 7 with 1288 views
More bad news for the non believers. on 17:14 - Aug 7 by jasper_T
Net profits on player sales aren't unusual either. We had the lowest net transfer profit in the top 6 last season except for Barnsley. There's nothing to suggest selling Rodon for £11m should mean we're set for a few years.
No, but it should have meant we were 'set' for last season (and that's on the back of a profit year).
And this year all the top earners are gone, and we're going to sell again. That's why I'm puzzled by the need for more loans.
More bad news for the non believers. on 18:11 - Aug 7 by shingle
Yep you are definitely not the type of guy to rely on in a crisis.
Not sure how you come to that conclusion. I have an excellent track record of reliability over a very successful of over 30 year career, One or two hairy moment along the way.
This forum is full of people that comment negatively on "Yanks" and "sellouts". Today we hear of likely extra cash from the USA (Winter calls an investment) , and possible sponsorship of the stadium with links to a so called "sellout". They were the shirt sponsor at one time.
If the loan(s) are converted they will not add to the clubs debt. I expect this to happen.
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