| Dale v Shrewsbury 13:29 - Nov 17 with 24723 views | SuddenLad |
Live commentary on BBC Radio Matey. |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 00:20 - Nov 18 with 3086 views | nordenblue |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 23:53 - Nov 17 by tony_roch975 |
But Hill's been saying exactly that for 2 years and when he does he gets slated on here for 'lacking ambition'. |
If he just for once played his best 11 in their strongest positions he would perhaps gain some empathy from most fans.
Whilst he continues to piss about playing one of the best forwards the clubs EVER had in midfield, leaving one of the best and most consistent energetic players out of the side like a naughty school boy, then insisting that a goal keeper for some bizzare reason is required to be some sort of fooking Pele with a pair of gloves on, he will rightly get slated on here. |  | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 04:06 - Nov 18 with 2992 views | frenzied |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 20:34 - Nov 17 by 49thseason |
It's not the fact of losing, after the first 20 or 30 seasons you get used to that, it's the reasons behind losing that cause the deepest hurt.
In the final analysis, a team is only as good as the sum of its parts and we are currently 3 points above the relegation zone. Of the new players this season, I am reasonably impressed with Dooley, I am pleased Hart is making an impression but for the rest... they add little to nothing. The manager can't seem to pick his best team because he doesn't know what it is. We are leaking goals and not scoring enough to compensate, it's not shambolic but there is clearly something amiss and it has been going on for 2 seasons now. If he doesn't know what the problems are, he should do. Or, he should be honest and simply admit that with crowds of 3000 it's getting harder to compete financially and a lower L1 existence is the best we can hope for.
We have become the new Oldham. |
I agree with most of this..these are our “halcyon” days ..it’s that it doesnt always feel like it thou at times..
Fans at for example Stockport must crave for rainy nights at Edgeley park watching a turgid nil nil against league 2 opposition.
The comparison to Oldham is relevant.
From a fans perspective it always looks very simplistic...”do this and that will happen”....Hill is trying to put it right but it may well be the solution will be found by luck more than judgement | | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 06:13 - Nov 18 with 2963 views | kiwidale |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 04:06 - Nov 18 by frenzied |
I agree with most of this..these are our “halcyon” days ..it’s that it doesnt always feel like it thou at times..
Fans at for example Stockport must crave for rainy nights at Edgeley park watching a turgid nil nil against league 2 opposition.
The comparison to Oldham is relevant.
From a fans perspective it always looks very simplistic...”do this and that will happen”....Hill is trying to put it right but it may well be the solution will be found by luck more than judgement |
Good post that Frenzied we can be hard to please at times then again all we want is to stop the 3 goals or more model that's employed at present. | |
| This is not the time for bickering.
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 08:05 - Nov 18 with 2904 views | frenzied |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 06:13 - Nov 18 by kiwidale |
Good post that Frenzied we can be hard to please at times then again all we want is to stop the 3 goals or more model that's employed at present. |
Quite agree Kiwi..
Wether it be ability ,organisation ,confidence or leadership on the pitch is anyones guess as to why the 3 goal scenario is repeated on a regular basis | | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 08:57 - Nov 18 with 2805 views | funkkk |
Our problems are nothing to do with budget or fan base. Nor do I believe Hill's ego would allow him to be blasé about where we finish each season. We have a squad good enough to be competitive in the division but Hill and his staff aren't getting the best out of them. |  | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 09:41 - Nov 18 with 2709 views | James1980 |
There seems to be an issue transferring what happens on the training pitch to a matchday. Stating the obvious but Hill and the coaching team are not training the players to make these mistakes. On the subject of team selection I expect there are many factors taken into consideration, perhaps Hill over thinks at times. | |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 10:12 - Nov 18 with 2664 views | macro |
Three main problems IMO
Goalkeeper - For me Lillis every time, I prefer Moore to Norman who is a calamity keeper
Defensive frailty - which has been evident for 18 months or more now
Not playing people in correct positions - neither Dooley or Henderson are midfielders, hence a powder puff midfield yesterday -
There has to be questions asked over the coaching of both the Goalkeepers and defence. Why are the same defenders (bar Hart) as the run in the last 3 months of the season now throwing in mistake after mistake |  | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 10:43 - Nov 18 with 2595 views | pioneer |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 23:53 - Nov 17 by tony_roch975 |
But Hill's been saying exactly that for 2 years and when he does he gets slated on here for 'lacking ambition'. |
I think the message has got through...pretty pointless having things like a season ticket push if at the same time you are saying it will be really hard for us to compete in this division. Its all part of the same marketing message but they dont seem to get it.
The public dont come to watch balance sheets or care hearing about sell on clauses. They want to hear about giving it all we have to try to get up in that top half and challenge for a play off spot. I wont see it as failure if we dont manage it. But I am sick of the apparent message the best we should expect to be fighting for survival.
Its almost as if preparing kids for premier league careers is now our primary purpose in life. | | | |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 10:45 - Nov 18 with 2590 views | tony_roch975 |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 00:20 - Nov 18 by nordenblue |
If he just for once played his best 11 in their strongest positions he would perhaps gain some empathy from most fans.
Whilst he continues to piss about playing one of the best forwards the clubs EVER had in midfield, leaving one of the best and most consistent energetic players out of the side like a naughty school boy, then insisting that a goal keeper for some bizzare reason is required to be some sort of fooking Pele with a pair of gloves on, he will rightly get slated on here. |
Don't disagree with that but as ever in life it's about balancing competing interests - (JW11 is better than Hendo at high speed pressing but that means Hendo in midfield; playing several energetic but impetuous players like Rathbone & Cannon together makes us more vulnerable defensively; attacking WBs need covering wide midfielders who may therefore be less effective attacking). Basically most of our squad are enthusiastic, talented, but lack consistency (which is why they're playing for us) - the more you pay, the more consistent the player! But you've just proved my point - when he's honest he gets slated (just as you've done). | |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 10:54 - Nov 18 with 2577 views | 442Dale |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 10:12 - Nov 18 by macro |
Three main problems IMO
Goalkeeper - For me Lillis every time, I prefer Moore to Norman who is a calamity keeper
Defensive frailty - which has been evident for 18 months or more now
Not playing people in correct positions - neither Dooley or Henderson are midfielders, hence a powder puff midfield yesterday -
There has to be questions asked over the coaching of both the Goalkeepers and defence. Why are the same defenders (bar Hart) as the run in the last 3 months of the season now throwing in mistake after mistake |
On the last point, it gets stranger with every passing week that we haven’t reverted to the five at the back which the manager and players were all comfortable with. Especially as the fullbacks are still required to provide the width using the current system.
Lillis
Rafferty-McGahey-MJW-Delaney-Hart
Camps-Rathbone-Dooley/Cannon
Henderson-Andrew/Williams11
Try the above for a few matches, it has options to go to a back 4 during the game with subs and see what happens. It really is made far more complicated than it needs to be; we stayed up last year because of a simple plan, something Hill himself refers to. Stick to it, reduce the squad size in January and utilise the players we have within a structure where they’re all contributing.
It’s not rocket science, it doesn’t require a massive budget to compete, it’s not punching above our weight, it’s making the most of what we have. It’s not that hard to do. |  |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 11:04 - Nov 18 with 2553 views | Cleedale |
I think we've just plateaued. But hey we're still away from the relegation zone. What would some be posting if we were in the bottom 4?
Also, there's a lot of conjecture about 'stuff' not being transferred from the training ground to the actual game...but then we're probably coming up against clubs with much bigger budgets - week in week out. What might be happening 'between our own players' in training is never the same as the actual day.
Just 'perhaps'...we aren't quite as good as we think we are...cometh the day...in the present day League 1. Cripes, we played Luton off the park and OK we didn't win BUT when there are clubs in the Conference paying strikers in the region of £4k-£5k per week we really need to get things in perspective sometimes.
And also, let's not forget what great stuff IS going on. If you haven't yet seen this then take a look at Adshead's glorious 'debut' goal for England.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BqQD1NxA8Ez/
UTD! | | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 11:16 - Nov 18 with 2533 views | macro |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 11:04 - Nov 18 by Cleedale |
I think we've just plateaued. But hey we're still away from the relegation zone. What would some be posting if we were in the bottom 4?
Also, there's a lot of conjecture about 'stuff' not being transferred from the training ground to the actual game...but then we're probably coming up against clubs with much bigger budgets - week in week out. What might be happening 'between our own players' in training is never the same as the actual day.
Just 'perhaps'...we aren't quite as good as we think we are...cometh the day...in the present day League 1. Cripes, we played Luton off the park and OK we didn't win BUT when there are clubs in the Conference paying strikers in the region of £4k-£5k per week we really need to get things in perspective sometimes.
And also, let's not forget what great stuff IS going on. If you haven't yet seen this then take a look at Adshead's glorious 'debut' goal for England.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BqQD1NxA8Ez/
UTD! |
I’m assuming you didn’t attend yesterdays game then | | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 11:28 - Nov 18 with 2514 views | aleanddale |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 21:10 - Nov 17 by D_Alien |
It's possible that last season's great escape helped prolong a sense of something that might've been apparent for some time - that week in, week out, winning isn't the most important thing. I'm aware that might sound daft, but since our financial model has been built around developing talent to offset the relatively meagre income from our fanbase, i think it's become more about surviving rather than thriving in L1 whilst our younger players are provided with more experienced professionals in the squad to help bring them on
In that sense, i don't see that Hill is too concerned about fans expectations - including those fans who travel the length and breadth of the country to support Dale. And with the board apparently fully behind this model, who's prepared to try and change it?
The great escape possibly has the effect of him thinking we can do the same again should this way of conducting first team affairs lead to danger - and even if we dropped into L2 it wouldn't be of huge concern. Of course, along the way it'd be a bonus if something else clicked into place and we found ourselves riding high in the league again, but it seems to me that'd be more by accident than design
Am i bothered? I don't know, when we have occasions like the Spurs tie and the finale against Charlton to look back on; but be prepared for an uncomfortable experience during the bread and butter of the season |
surviving not thriving. I like that D_Alien.
Good post - we have occasional days in the sun as you mentioned.
Crazy but a win on Saturday and we could be 6 points above the drop zone and 12 points ahead of Bradford. I maintain its the 90 minutes between 3-5pm on a Saturday that I go for and whilst I see the players obviously trying / caring and playing for the Manager they have my support and this will see us safe this season.
Things obviously not 100% with Keeper and defence situation as we have conceded 34 times in 18 league games.
Is there a deeper issue? crisis? I don't think so and the fact does remain that whilst we play in the 3rd tier we are punching above our natural weight.
Roll on Saturday and see if we get a win... they do wonders for the mood on this messageboard. | | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 11:31 - Nov 18 with 2510 views | aleanddale |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 00:20 - Nov 18 by nordenblue |
If he just for once played his best 11 in their strongest positions he would perhaps gain some empathy from most fans.
Whilst he continues to piss about playing one of the best forwards the clubs EVER had in midfield, leaving one of the best and most consistent energetic players out of the side like a naughty school boy, then insisting that a goal keeper for some bizzare reason is required to be some sort of fooking Pele with a pair of gloves on, he will rightly get slated on here. |
whilst I don't agree 100% that post made me laugh out loud and there is a lot of what you posted that is food for thought. | | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 15:09 - Nov 18 with 2247 views | 49thseason |
The goalkeeping situation is interesting to say the least:
League games:
Lillis has played 9, won 8 points (0.88 pts per game) and kept 2 clean sheets (22%)
Norman has played 4 won 4 points (1.00 Pt PG) and kept 1 clean sheet (25%)
Moore has played 4 won 7 points (1.75 Pt PG) and kept 3 clean sheets (75%)
Goals per game conceded:
Lillis 23 in 9 2.55 per game
Norman 8 in 4 2.00 per game
Moore 3 in 4 0.75 per game
Statistically, Moore has to play.
I have discounted the drawn game v Bristol R when Norman was sent off and Lillis was subbed on. |  | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 15:49 - Nov 18 with 2197 views | chalky_ncfc |
This probably won't go down well but I think that you should be happy with where Dale is and having a manager like Hill in charge,League One is just about Dales ceiling considering the size of your fan base and position with larger,more attractive clubs around you and you seem a very stable club in the whole
Look at Notts,arguably a 'bigger' club than Dale but we are second from bottom in League Two and unless the rot stops we will be relegated into the National League for the first time in our history,in the last decade we have had 2 owners,11 (soon to be 12) managers and 211 players go through the club,sometimes it's best to settle with what you've got | |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 16:03 - Nov 18 with 2174 views | BartRowou |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 15:49 - Nov 18 by chalky_ncfc |
This probably won't go down well but I think that you should be happy with where Dale is and having a manager like Hill in charge,League One is just about Dales ceiling considering the size of your fan base and position with larger,more attractive clubs around you and you seem a very stable club in the whole
Look at Notts,arguably a 'bigger' club than Dale but we are second from bottom in League Two and unless the rot stops we will be relegated into the National League for the first time in our history,in the last decade we have had 2 owners,11 (soon to be 12) managers and 211 players go through the club,sometimes it's best to settle with what you've got |
Ey up Chalky lad...
Forest fans are of the opinion that their board has severed ties with County due to your chairman's disrespectful comments towards them. They are now more likely to loan players to Mansfield eg Tyler Walker. Is this accurate? |  |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 16:25 - Nov 18 with 2122 views | chalky_ncfc |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 16:03 - Nov 18 by BartRowou |
Ey up Chalky lad...
Forest fans are of the opinion that their board has severed ties with County due to your chairman's disrespectful comments towards them. They are now more likely to loan players to Mansfield eg Tyler Walker. Is this accurate? |
That's correct Bart,I don't know the finer details but I know that there's been a falling out between the two clubs about what's been said about Forest by the owner (I think),it's all snowballed from the preseason friendly that Notts and Forest was supposed to have held but got cancelled for whatever reason,I've got to admit that it's Notts fault by all accounts | |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 18:25 - Nov 18 with 1986 views | 442Dale |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 16:25 - Nov 18 by chalky_ncfc |
That's correct Bart,I don't know the finer details but I know that there's been a falling out between the two clubs about what's been said about Forest by the owner (I think),it's all snowballed from the preseason friendly that Notts and Forest was supposed to have held but got cancelled for whatever reason,I've got to admit that it's Notts fault by all accounts |
In yet another “it’s all about me” move, Hardy has now said he’s taking a break from social media.
48 hours is what I’d want in a sweepstake. | |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 21:08 - Nov 18 with 1757 views | rochdaleriddler |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 16:03 - Nov 18 by BartRowou |
Ey up Chalky lad...
Forest fans are of the opinion that their board has severed ties with County due to your chairman's disrespectful comments towards them. They are now more likely to loan players to Mansfield eg Tyler Walker. Is this accurate? |
I bet they never loan us any more |  |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 21:15 - Nov 18 with 1747 views | James1980 |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 21:08 - Nov 18 by rochdaleriddler |
I bet they never loan us any more |
I have thought Clough's lack of game time could be detrimental in future loan deals. When a player is loaned in how much does the parent club keep tabs on their player? Does the loanee club send back regular reports about how the player is getting on in training? | |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 21:32 - Nov 18 with 1734 views | rochdaleriddler |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 21:15 - Nov 18 by James1980 |
I have thought Clough's lack of game time could be detrimental in future loan deals. When a player is loaned in how much does the parent club keep tabs on their player? Does the loanee club send back regular reports about how the player is getting on in training? |
Don’t know, but surely the reason for sending a player out is to give him gametime | |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 21:48 - Nov 18 with 1713 views | nordenblue |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 10:45 - Nov 18 by tony_roch975 |
Don't disagree with that but as ever in life it's about balancing competing interests - (JW11 is better than Hendo at high speed pressing but that means Hendo in midfield; playing several energetic but impetuous players like Rathbone & Cannon together makes us more vulnerable defensively; attacking WBs need covering wide midfielders who may therefore be less effective attacking). Basically most of our squad are enthusiastic, talented, but lack consistency (which is why they're playing for us) - the more you pay, the more consistent the player! But you've just proved my point - when he's honest he gets slated (just as you've done). |
Why does another player pressing require Hendo to then play in midfield,keep him up front to do what he does consistently best and thats score goals,he wont score many from the halfway line and as good at pressing Williams may be he will never bag anywhere near the amount of goals Hendo does year on year.
You'd put Cannons name first on the team sheet regardless of formation or any other coaching book nonsense they like to swallow.
Hilly is far from honest and mostly tries to baffle fans with cliched bullshit, on the rare occasion he actually talks openly that is. | | | |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 21:49 - Nov 18 with 1710 views | James1980 |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 21:32 - Nov 18 by rochdaleriddler |
Don’t know, but surely the reason for sending a player out is to give him gametime |
Yes one would think so and that the loan deal would have a minimum amount of minutes/matches in it deoending on injuries, perhaps one of the reasons Norman was picked yesterday. | |
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| Dale v Shrewsbury on 11:24 - Nov 19 with 1469 views | dingdangblue |
| Dale v Shrewsbury on 17:46 - Nov 17 by rochdaleriddler |
I hate seeing dale lose, if we can’t have a moan on here, it’s a poor do. I didn’t go today , sounds like the same old errors, the buck stops with Hill, I get it that we have no divine right to win, but they are not a good team, and are in turmoil. People on here said we had a tough start, and we would see where we are when we start playing lesser teams. We cannot defend |
Were we in turmoil v Charlton and Luton or just from today? |  |
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