| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here and lie to you’ 14:00 - Feb 20 with 1562 views | SwansIndependent |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 15:02 - Feb 20 with 1430 views | onehunglow |
Not long ago,he was praising the bravery and attitude of the players-his players. | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:13 - Feb 20 with 1315 views | A_Fans_Dad |
A project that has very little chance of succeding and even if it does is too easy to play against.
The SwansIndependent can write what they like, but that doesn't mean it is possible or even that desirable.
Give me quick, accurate forward or cross field passing with pace any time of the day. | | | |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:43 - Feb 20 with 1249 views | onehunglow |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:13 - Feb 20 by A_Fans_Dad |
A project that has very little chance of succeding and even if it does is too easy to play against.
The SwansIndependent can write what they like, but that doesn't mean it is possible or even that desirable.
Give me quick, accurate forward or cross field passing with pace any time of the day. |
Just watching Wolves.
#They get a chance 20 yards out and the lad strikes it at goal.
Grimes or any of ours would have been looking to pass it sideways
Fact | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:54 - Feb 20 with 1234 views | Catullus |
The big problem isn't the process really. Most Swansea fans had accepted the "process" and were eager to see it through, to have good footballl, to be entertained.
The real problem is that he is sticking to a rigid model even when we can't do it. There's no pragmatism in games against better teams or when we are a bit short because of illness or injury. he doesn't change things to suit resources. That's not great management and it doesn't just invite criticism, it demands it.
As much as anybody, including myself wants to see entertaining football, we don't want to see us getting thrashed regularly, we don't want to see slow, negative, boring football with constant mistakes that gift the oppo goals.
But that is where we are. | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:57 - Feb 20 with 1224 views | onehunglow |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:54 - Feb 20 by Catullus |
The big problem isn't the process really. Most Swansea fans had accepted the "process" and were eager to see it through, to have good footballl, to be entertained.
The real problem is that he is sticking to a rigid model even when we can't do it. There's no pragmatism in games against better teams or when we are a bit short because of illness or injury. he doesn't change things to suit resources. That's not great management and it doesn't just invite criticism, it demands it.
As much as anybody, including myself wants to see entertaining football, we don't want to see us getting thrashed regularly, we don't want to see slow, negative, boring football with constant mistakes that gift the oppo goals.
But that is where we are. |
Didnt Potter spout similiar before adding the great fans,city,stadium,club etc.
Potter was and is ambitious ;they are employed by us. | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 23:07 - Feb 20 with 1044 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:54 - Feb 20 by Catullus |
The big problem isn't the process really. Most Swansea fans had accepted the "process" and were eager to see it through, to have good footballl, to be entertained.
The real problem is that he is sticking to a rigid model even when we can't do it. There's no pragmatism in games against better teams or when we are a bit short because of illness or injury. he doesn't change things to suit resources. That's not great management and it doesn't just invite criticism, it demands it.
As much as anybody, including myself wants to see entertaining football, we don't want to see us getting thrashed regularly, we don't want to see slow, negative, boring football with constant mistakes that gift the oppo goals.
But that is where we are. |
Good football and entertaining football is certainly not the style of play he is adopting though.
When people say “when it works”, what are they referring to exactly? Are they saying when we do exactly the same as we do now, but absolutely no individual errors? Because that will never happen in a million years, it’s not a realistic thing to expect.
So I don’t know what needs to happen here for this to fulfil the brief of “good football” or “entertaining football”. Is the way he wants us to play either of those things? It’s dreadful whether it “works” or not, opposition fans laugh at us.
Winning a game doesn’t mean the system we deployed worked. We should be able to win some games deploying any kind of system really, we will win because we have better players. People using isolated wins to state that the system “sometimes works” aren’t thinking clearly.
This system is the wrong one, a blind man (or woman) can see that. It didn’t work at MK Dons and it isn’t working here, so is the pinnacle of this great project to finish mid table like them? That’s the max output of this system that there is evidence for. |  |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 23:31 - Feb 20 with 1034 views | STID2017 |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:54 - Feb 20 by Catullus |
The big problem isn't the process really. Most Swansea fans had accepted the "process" and were eager to see it through, to have good footballl, to be entertained.
The real problem is that he is sticking to a rigid model even when we can't do it. There's no pragmatism in games against better teams or when we are a bit short because of illness or injury. he doesn't change things to suit resources. That's not great management and it doesn't just invite criticism, it demands it.
As much as anybody, including myself wants to see entertaining football, we don't want to see us getting thrashed regularly, we don't want to see slow, negative, boring football with constant mistakes that gift the oppo goals.
But that is where we are. |
Good post [Post edited 20 Feb 2022 23:32]
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 23:44 - Feb 20 with 1005 views | SwaneeRiver |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:54 - Feb 20 by Catullus |
The big problem isn't the process really. Most Swansea fans had accepted the "process" and were eager to see it through, to have good footballl, to be entertained.
The real problem is that he is sticking to a rigid model even when we can't do it. There's no pragmatism in games against better teams or when we are a bit short because of illness or injury. he doesn't change things to suit resources. That's not great management and it doesn't just invite criticism, it demands it.
As much as anybody, including myself wants to see entertaining football, we don't want to see us getting thrashed regularly, we don't want to see slow, negative, boring football with constant mistakes that gift the oppo goals.
But that is where we are. |
Good post
I would agree that in an ideal footballing world we would all accept "the process" if it were showing signs of leading to the place we want to be - which is team which is getting its share of good results while playing exciting football.
As you say this would of course mean he would need to be a pragmatic and and adaptable manager, sadly this has so far not turned out to be the case.
Totally agree the slow negative football and poor performances and defeats like we have seen the last three away matches are not what we want to see.
I am not sure if the owners will be inclined to pay out to sack him though, I think they will be quite prepared to leave him see out "the process" until either he is successful or he decides to leave | | | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:04 - Feb 21 with 952 views | KeithHaynes |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:13 - Feb 20 by A_Fans_Dad |
A project that has very little chance of succeding and even if it does is too easy to play against.
The SwansIndependent can write what they like, but that doesn't mean it is possible or even that desirable.
Give me quick, accurate forward or cross field passing with pace any time of the day. |
We can only write a viewpoint and offer everyone else to do the same, on here or by writing their own reports and thoughts. |  |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:17 - Feb 21 with 942 views | PawelAbbott |
We are only part way on the path he has us on.A few more heavy defeats and he really coukd get us all the way to League one.
I don't see where SwansIndependent think he is taking us. He has taken a top 4 side and made them the whipping boys of the division.
You can't sit there after 6 months and say that the players can't play your system. That's just stupid.
I can't go in to work and say "These colleagues aren't good enough. I won't be able to do much until you replace then all" Work with what you've got. Play a system thar suits your players.
I'd much rather he came out after an ugly win and say "it's not the style I wanted, we are building on that, but it is the result"
Rather than we got battered and then "we are trying to play fantasy football but I'm lumbered with Championship players"
Just go!!! | | | |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:23 - Feb 21 with 930 views | KeithHaynes |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:17 - Feb 21 by PawelAbbott |
We are only part way on the path he has us on.A few more heavy defeats and he really coukd get us all the way to League one.
I don't see where SwansIndependent think he is taking us. He has taken a top 4 side and made them the whipping boys of the division.
You can't sit there after 6 months and say that the players can't play your system. That's just stupid.
I can't go in to work and say "These colleagues aren't good enough. I won't be able to do much until you replace then all" Work with what you've got. Play a system thar suits your players.
I'd much rather he came out after an ugly win and say "it's not the style I wanted, we are building on that, but it is the result"
Rather than we got battered and then "we are trying to play fantasy football but I'm lumbered with Championship players"
Just go!!! |
Thing is they won’t sack him, so we need to look at what we have with some form of balanced view.
Okay, if it gets drastic then there may be a rethink, but as it stands there isn’t. So it’s no use shouting for him to go, it’s pointless. | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:33 - Feb 21 with 916 views | swan65split |
Going to be a tough week for Martin and the team , strap yourselves in and stock up on the ale. |  | | |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:35 - Feb 21 with 916 views | PawelAbbott |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:23 - Feb 21 by KeithHaynes |
Thing is they won’t sack him, so we need to look at what we have with some form of balanced view.
Okay, if it gets drastic then there may be a rethink, but as it stands there isn’t. So it’s no use shouting for him to go, it’s pointless. |
So they won't sack him because they're skint. Then he needs to change his mantra of possession football over results.
He needs to look at what he has with a balanced view. He hasn't got Xavi and Iniesta running his midfield. So, don't try getting them to play a way that they can't. What is worse is that they play a way that most teams out witted about 10 years ago. Even the Spanish national team have adapted.
You can't cling on to a job that you're clearly out of your depth in because your employer can't afford to pay you off. | | | |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:49 - Feb 21 with 902 views | KeithHaynes |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:35 - Feb 21 by PawelAbbott |
So they won't sack him because they're skint. Then he needs to change his mantra of possession football over results.
He needs to look at what he has with a balanced view. He hasn't got Xavi and Iniesta running his midfield. So, don't try getting them to play a way that they can't. What is worse is that they play a way that most teams out witted about 10 years ago. Even the Spanish national team have adapted.
You can't cling on to a job that you're clearly out of your depth in because your employer can't afford to pay you off. |
I’m uncertain they can or can’t afford to pay him off. What I do know is it would be very dangerous to do so at this point, As I said it would make the last six months a complete waste of time. | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:55 - Feb 21 with 896 views | PawelAbbott |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:23 - Feb 21 by KeithHaynes |
Thing is they won’t sack him, so we need to look at what we have with some form of balanced view.
Okay, if it gets drastic then there may be a rethink, but as it stands there isn’t. So it’s no use shouting for him to go, it’s pointless. |
Not sacking him as it costs too much is a fallacy and makes no financial sense.
Last season Jay Fulton was a first team regular, earning around £10k a week. Under Martin he has rarely played. Martin is earning around £10k a week. So, we are happy for him to side line a first team player for 12 months but not side line him?
Fulton had a sell on value last summer. Now, he is arguably worthless. Martin would have a sell on value if we won games but he doesn't. More money us lost on wages of players than the cost of axing the manager.
If the club keep him simply because they can't pay him off then what happens in the transfer window?
Why give millions in transfer budget to a manager you ha e no faith in? The intuitive thing for the owners to do would be to keep the money for a manager whose judgement they do trust.
If they have lost faith then accept the loss and let him go.
Right now his cost to remo e us cheaper because the assistant has already gone. | | | |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 08:01 - Feb 21 with 885 views | KeithHaynes |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:55 - Feb 21 by PawelAbbott |
Not sacking him as it costs too much is a fallacy and makes no financial sense.
Last season Jay Fulton was a first team regular, earning around £10k a week. Under Martin he has rarely played. Martin is earning around £10k a week. So, we are happy for him to side line a first team player for 12 months but not side line him?
Fulton had a sell on value last summer. Now, he is arguably worthless. Martin would have a sell on value if we won games but he doesn't. More money us lost on wages of players than the cost of axing the manager.
If the club keep him simply because they can't pay him off then what happens in the transfer window?
Why give millions in transfer budget to a manager you ha e no faith in? The intuitive thing for the owners to do would be to keep the money for a manager whose judgement they do trust.
If they have lost faith then accept the loss and let him go.
Right now his cost to remo e us cheaper because the assistant has already gone. |
I’m uncertain where it’s been mentioned by me in recent threads the cost of sacking is a falicy.
I’m merely looking at the whole picture and my viewpoint is as I’ve stated. Of course other opinions are always welcome. That’s what we are all about. | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 08:21 - Feb 21 with 875 views | STID2017 |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:55 - Feb 21 by PawelAbbott |
Not sacking him as it costs too much is a fallacy and makes no financial sense.
Last season Jay Fulton was a first team regular, earning around £10k a week. Under Martin he has rarely played. Martin is earning around £10k a week. So, we are happy for him to side line a first team player for 12 months but not side line him?
Fulton had a sell on value last summer. Now, he is arguably worthless. Martin would have a sell on value if we won games but he doesn't. More money us lost on wages of players than the cost of axing the manager.
If the club keep him simply because they can't pay him off then what happens in the transfer window?
Why give millions in transfer budget to a manager you ha e no faith in? The intuitive thing for the owners to do would be to keep the money for a manager whose judgement they do trust.
If they have lost faith then accept the loss and let him go.
Right now his cost to remo e us cheaper because the assistant has already gone. |
I believe they will not sack him at the time.
Whether this is a financial decision or whether they are taking a pragmatic view at this time I am not sure,
.However i think that he needs to begin to show signs of being more flexible with his style of play and team selection, otherwise if fans perceive he is not learning and we continue losing ( and especially in the manner of the last three away games ) then he could lose the backing of fans at the games before we reach the end of the season | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 08:37 - Feb 21 with 861 views | KeithHaynes |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 08:21 - Feb 21 by STID2017 |
I believe they will not sack him at the time.
Whether this is a financial decision or whether they are taking a pragmatic view at this time I am not sure,
.However i think that he needs to begin to show signs of being more flexible with his style of play and team selection, otherwise if fans perceive he is not learning and we continue losing ( and especially in the manner of the last three away games ) then he could lose the backing of fans at the games before we reach the end of the season |
I have a sneaking suspicion if the swans lose tomorrow night it could start getting a bit feisty. | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 09:05 - Feb 21 with 842 views | onehunglow |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:23 - Feb 21 by KeithHaynes |
Thing is they won’t sack him, so we need to look at what we have with some form of balanced view.
Okay, if it gets drastic then there may be a rethink, but as it stands there isn’t. So it’s no use shouting for him to go, it’s pointless. |
Not being able to sack is not a justification to support him.
The club needs support not him. | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 11:57 - Feb 21 with 802 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:04 - Feb 21 by KeithHaynes |
We can only write a viewpoint and offer everyone else to do the same, on here or by writing their own reports and thoughts. |
Which is what I did.
I also think that it is way past time that managers had a "sacking clause" built in to their contracts just like normal people.
Severence pay yes, but not more than a month's salary, maybe if that was the case Martin would already have changed his methods a bit to improve our football.
What incentive does he have to change if he is guaranteed 3 years because the club can't afford to get rid of him. | | | |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 12:06 - Feb 21 with 790 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 08:01 - Feb 21 by KeithHaynes |
I’m uncertain where it’s been mentioned by me in recent threads the cost of sacking is a falicy.
I’m merely looking at the whole picture and my viewpoint is as I’ve stated. Of course other opinions are always welcome. That’s what we are all about. |
Club income is going to suffer all the time he is here and not playing pragmatic football.
Attendances will drop as will season ticket sales.
I know a few very long term supporters who have drifted away due to the combination of COVID and football tactics that they can see are beyond stupid.
Seeing your club brought to lower and lower standards is very demoralising.
I know there will always be the hardcore die hard fans but even their numbers are likely to dwindle. | | | |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 12:19 - Feb 21 with 776 views | KeithHaynes |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 11:57 - Feb 21 by A_Fans_Dad |
Which is what I did.
I also think that it is way past time that managers had a "sacking clause" built in to their contracts just like normal people.
Severence pay yes, but not more than a month's salary, maybe if that was the case Martin would already have changed his methods a bit to improve our football.
What incentive does he have to change if he is guaranteed 3 years because the club can't afford to get rid of him. |
Not sure about three years but definitely three months. | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 12:24 - Feb 21 with 767 views | onehunglow |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 12:19 - Feb 21 by KeithHaynes |
Not sure about three years but definitely three months. |
You meeting Russy, Guv | |
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| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 12:27 - Feb 21 with 763 views | pencoedjack |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 16:54 - Feb 20 by Catullus |
The big problem isn't the process really. Most Swansea fans had accepted the "process" and were eager to see it through, to have good footballl, to be entertained.
The real problem is that he is sticking to a rigid model even when we can't do it. There's no pragmatism in games against better teams or when we are a bit short because of illness or injury. he doesn't change things to suit resources. That's not great management and it doesn't just invite criticism, it demands it.
As much as anybody, including myself wants to see entertaining football, we don't want to see us getting thrashed regularly, we don't want to see slow, negative, boring football with constant mistakes that gift the oppo goals.
But that is where we are. |
Good post.
Although at the moment I don't see anything entertaining in Martins football, I love possession based football but possession for the sake of possession is boring.
The keeper passing to the centre half to the full back back to the keeper & repeat is boring to watch & mind-blowing when you are losing & need to get the ball forward.
There is no movement for players to pass the ball into to get forward.
I have been very pro Martin but his lack of nous to change from what seems to be his only plan to play football is starting to wear thin with me. |  | | |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 12:41 - Feb 21 with 749 views | Flashberryjack |
| Russell Martin : The first few glimpses of pressure ‘ I don’t come out here on 07:49 - Feb 21 by KeithHaynes |
I’m uncertain they can or can’t afford to pay him off. What I do know is it would be very dangerous to do so at this point, As I said it would make the last six months a complete waste of time. |
I'm sorry to say this, but it's beginning to look like the last six months, has been a complete waste of time and money. |  |
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