| The big Martin question… 05:26 - Dec 13 with 2837 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Is he learning?
Lots of people have said he is a manager learning his trade, which is probably true to some extent but is he learning the right lessons, or ignoring the really important ones?
I have gone on record several times now and stated that Martin has some excellent potential there if he can move away from his obsession with “dominance” and learn that dominating possession doesn’t mean dominating the opposition or indeed the game.
Having a possession game is great, it can be a very exciting and successful style but it can also be an extremely dull and harmful one depending on how it is implemented.
The words from the MK Dons fans have been ringing in my head this week with regards to this. So I had a quick look back at some match reports and they are scarily similar to what we are seeing now, I stopped looking after a while but felt I could have gone on and kept clicking on what is essentially identi-kit post match pressers and comments.
These could have been written this season and nobody would be able to tell the difference. He genuinely doesn’t seem to understand why his teams lose regularly despite “dominance” and I say that in the loosest possible terms because his version of dominance doesn’t really dominate anything apart from the clock.
It’s all the same stuff, and this goes on and on and on. This was only a few of them.
The theme is the same all the time “we dominated”, “on another night we would have won if x, y, z happened” and “they won because we made errors”.
What concerns me is at no point does it sound like he has looked into why his team make individual errors, why they dominate the possession yet lose or why his teams fail to be consistent.
There doesn’t seem to be a lot of analysis or reflection there, that was no more evident than when he gave this interview stating that there is nothing tactically or structurally wrong (again) “because they dominated”.
It seems to be as far as the reflection and analysis goes. Which may explain why he seems to be stuck in a Groundhog Day loop now for a third season on the bounce, the only difference is the team names.
Happy to take alternative views on this… let’s keep it civil though chaps, this is intended for a real discussion on this subject. [Post edited 13 Dec 2021 5:56]
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| The big Martin question… on 07:31 - Dec 13 with 1735 views | felixstowe_jack |
He needs to play players in their correct positions, then we might be able to defend and start passing from midfield quickly. [Post edited 13 Dec 2021 10:22]
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| The big Martin question… on 09:33 - Dec 13 with 1665 views | 3swan |
There has to be a point where every detail gets reviewed, and a big part of that is can the players as a collective play the roles they are being asked to play. Imo Martin is waiting in hope that he can get players in January that can tip the balance in his favour. At the moment it seems as if so many players aren't comfortable. All well and good having a long term view and a project, but along that journey many need to buy in and more importantly the fans. This happens when improvement is seen, but this has stalled. Post January will be interesting. | | | |
| The big Martin question… on 09:34 - Dec 13 with 1662 views | A_Fans_Dad |
NO | | | |
| The big Martin question… on 10:24 - Dec 13 with 1620 views | felixstowe_jack |
| The big Martin question… on 09:33 - Dec 13 by 3swan |
There has to be a point where every detail gets reviewed, and a big part of that is can the players as a collective play the roles they are being asked to play. Imo Martin is waiting in hope that he can get players in January that can tip the balance in his favour. At the moment it seems as if so many players aren't comfortable. All well and good having a long term view and a project, but along that journey many need to buy in and more importantly the fans. This happens when improvement is seen, but this has stalled. Post January will be interesting. |
If players are uncomfortable playing in the wrong position play them in their correct positions. Would anyone be happy asking the goalkeeper to play in midfield. | |
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| The big Martin question… on 10:45 - Dec 13 with 1613 views | sw02sea |
Nice to see someone’s done their due diligence on Russell Martin.
It’s starting to look like it’s a shame The Yanks didn’t do theirs!
I’m already getting sick to death of listening to his post match analysis, of basically saying it’s all the players fault, and nothing to do with him picking them out of position, and playing them in a system that unless you play for Man City, is going to be technically, a bridge to far for most of them.
According to RM there isn’t going to be major changes in the January window, so unless he changes the system to match the skill sets of the available players, he is going to pee off those players, who will eventually stop playing for him.
Then we have the fans.
How long before they give up on his mantra of “Possession” football at all costs ?
They would have probably died of boredom by then anyway.
I have to put my hands up here, and say I wasn’t too enamoured with “Cooperball” football, but totally admired how he managed the players at his disposal, to achieve two playoffs.
He obviously knew how to set up a team, and was acutely aware tactically how to get the best results for his club, which unfortunately for us, he did on Saturday.
How long is it going to take for RM to do the same ? | | | |
| The big Martin question… on 11:34 - Dec 13 with 1584 views | onehunglow |
Potential how and where
Better players
More skilled
More tactically astute
Fitter
Stronger.
Resilient
He's had 4 months and there is no sign whatoever of any progress. Laughable.
He is full of himself proven at every press conference.
If you are happy with a manager saying we were fantastic and happy with performance when he LOSES 4-1 at home then you have being conned.
Get him out and now.
There | |
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| The big Martin question… on 12:41 - Dec 13 with 1564 views | sw02sea |
The big Martin question has to be, is his favourite bedtime reading …….
“The Emperor’s new Clothes” by Hans Christian Andersen | | | |
| The big Martin question… on 12:42 - Dec 13 with 1558 views | onehunglow |
| The big Martin question… on 12:41 - Dec 13 by sw02sea |
The big Martin question has to be, is his favourite bedtime reading …….
“The Emperor’s new Clothes” by Hans Christian Andersen |
Fairy Tale mun | |
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| The big Martin question… on 13:39 - Dec 13 with 1538 views | KeithHaynes |
| The big Martin question… on 11:34 - Dec 13 by onehunglow |
Potential how and where
Better players
More skilled
More tactically astute
Fitter
Stronger.
Resilient
He's had 4 months and there is no sign whatoever of any progress. Laughable.
He is full of himself proven at every press conference.
If you are happy with a manager saying we were fantastic and happy with performance when he LOSES 4-1 at home then you have being conned.
Get him out and now.
There |
As has been said already, it isn’t going to happen.
It’s pointless repeating it. If he loses the next five he will still be here. |  |
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| The big Martin question… on 14:00 - Dec 13 with 1520 views | onehunglow |
| The big Martin question… on 13:39 - Dec 13 by KeithHaynes |
As has been said already, it isn’t going to happen.
It’s pointless repeating it. If he loses the next five he will still be here. |
Its a s pointless as the relentless Martin we played fantastic narrative | |
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| The big Martin question… on 14:47 - Dec 13 with 1501 views | KeithHaynes |
| The big Martin question… on 14:00 - Dec 13 by onehunglow |
Its a s pointless as the relentless Martin we played fantastic narrative |
That’s what he is saying, I assume you mean Russell Martin ? As the clubs manager he is entitled to say what he likes and do as he see’s fit whilst he is in post. Ok, you can say the same thing as well, but in our case nothing that is said changes anything. In his case it either will or won’t. That’s the point.
We report what we see, and what we know, which sometimes isn’t in this domain. I’m confident he will sort this out. | |
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| The big Martin question… on 15:02 - Dec 13 with 1481 views | Oldjack |
dump the prolific sideways and backward passes |  |
| Prosser the Tosser dwells on Phil's bum hole like a rusty old hemorrhoid ,fact
You Greedy Bastards Get Out Of OUR Club!
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| The big Martin question… on 15:14 - Dec 13 with 1464 views | onehunglow |
| The big Martin question… on 14:47 - Dec 13 by KeithHaynes |
That’s what he is saying, I assume you mean Russell Martin ? As the clubs manager he is entitled to say what he likes and do as he see’s fit whilst he is in post. Ok, you can say the same thing as well, but in our case nothing that is said changes anything. In his case it either will or won’t. That’s the point.
We report what we see, and what we know, which sometimes isn’t in this domain. I’m confident he will sort this out. |
Could I ask ,based on what you have seen this far, how are you confident as opposed to hopeful. | |
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| The big Martin question… on 15:19 - Dec 13 with 1463 views | KeithHaynes |
| The big Martin question… on 15:14 - Dec 13 by onehunglow |
Could I ask ,based on what you have seen this far, how are you confident as opposed to hopeful. |
Very confident.
This post has been edited by an administrator | |
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| The big Martin question… on 15:27 - Dec 13 with 1442 views | 3swan |
| The big Martin question… on 15:19 - Dec 13 by KeithHaynes |
Very confident.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Did you type hopeful before the edit 🤔😀 | | | |
| The big Martin question… on 15:34 - Dec 13 with 1428 views | Treforys_Jack |
Certainly doesn't appear to be learning, unless I'm missing something. |  | | |
| The big Martin question… on 15:56 - Dec 13 with 1418 views | sw02sea |
I wonder how confident the Owners will be in a few months, if RM hasn’t turned things around by then.
And Gawd help us if an offer comes in for Piroe in January.
Who’s left to put the round thing into the nettie thing ?
He’ll be sold on the cheap, just like Connor Roberts, and we’ll end up with a MK Dons cast off.
This will be down to the lack of scouting expertise, after another bit of dubious business when Andy Scott was forced out, unless Mark Allen steps up to the plate. | | | |
| The big Martin question… on 16:03 - Dec 13 with 1409 views | NotLoyal |
| The big Martin question… on 15:56 - Dec 13 by sw02sea |
I wonder how confident the Owners will be in a few months, if RM hasn’t turned things around by then.
And Gawd help us if an offer comes in for Piroe in January.
Who’s left to put the round thing into the nettie thing ?
He’ll be sold on the cheap, just like Connor Roberts, and we’ll end up with a MK Dons cast off.
This will be down to the lack of scouting expertise, after another bit of dubious business when Andy Scott was forced out, unless Mark Allen steps up to the plate. |
Andy Scott was offered 75k more a year to go to Middlesbrough if correct. Hasn't Mark Allen got a far greater track record than Scott? |  |
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| The big Martin question… on 16:29 - Dec 13 with 1385 views | KeithHaynes |
| The big Martin question… on 16:03 - Dec 13 by NotLoyal |
Andy Scott was offered 75k more a year to go to Middlesbrough if correct. Hasn't Mark Allen got a far greater track record than Scott? |
I’m certain we don’t need two people on big salaries vying for similar positions. Scott was obviously not happy with the reconstruction of the recruitment dept. But as I see it, we are not a charity, don’t mind him leaving personally. Even when we got bombarded with news on this we really didn’t see it as important. | |
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| The big Martin question… on 16:31 - Dec 13 with 1382 views | onehunglow |
| The big Martin question… on 15:56 - Dec 13 by sw02sea |
I wonder how confident the Owners will be in a few months, if RM hasn’t turned things around by then.
And Gawd help us if an offer comes in for Piroe in January.
Who’s left to put the round thing into the nettie thing ?
He’ll be sold on the cheap, just like Connor Roberts, and we’ll end up with a MK Dons cast off.
This will be down to the lack of scouting expertise, after another bit of dubious business when Andy Scott was forced out, unless Mark Allen steps up to the plate. |
We simply have to do what we can to keep JP.He s already been mucked about and I doubt he would hesitate to move away.
Martin is lucky to have him but he s being wasted.
Getting the ball to him should be the Plan | |
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| The big Martin question… on 16:35 - Dec 13 with 1381 views | ReslovenSwan1 |
| The big Martin question… on 15:56 - Dec 13 by sw02sea |
I wonder how confident the Owners will be in a few months, if RM hasn’t turned things around by then.
And Gawd help us if an offer comes in for Piroe in January.
Who’s left to put the round thing into the nettie thing ?
He’ll be sold on the cheap, just like Connor Roberts, and we’ll end up with a MK Dons cast off.
This will be down to the lack of scouting expertise, after another bit of dubious business when Andy Scott was forced out, unless Mark Allen steps up to the plate. |
You need to pay attention to details.
Connor Roberts had decided he was leaving and would not sign a new deal. He was out of contract this summer. Mr Winter suggested to him he should sign new deal to secure his World cup quest.
Winter would advised him that Joe Rodon could not get game time. Four months on neither Joe nor Connors have played much football but have had meeting with their cash investment advisors. Connor declined and was moved on for £2.5m.
Scott did well with Piroe but to date not so well with Whittaker Obafemi and Hamer and Rhys Williams. Allen's academy reconstruction does not seem to be doing well up to now and Cardiff city have creamed a lot the best South Wales talent. Some one has taken their eye off the ball. Losing Huw Jenkins was a loss. |  |
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| The big Martin question… on 16:47 - Dec 13 with 1369 views | vetchonian |
| The big Martin question… on 16:35 - Dec 13 by ReslovenSwan1 |
You need to pay attention to details.
Connor Roberts had decided he was leaving and would not sign a new deal. He was out of contract this summer. Mr Winter suggested to him he should sign new deal to secure his World cup quest.
Winter would advised him that Joe Rodon could not get game time. Four months on neither Joe nor Connors have played much football but have had meeting with their cash investment advisors. Connor declined and was moved on for £2.5m.
Scott did well with Piroe but to date not so well with Whittaker Obafemi and Hamer and Rhys Williams. Allen's academy reconstruction does not seem to be doing well up to now and Cardiff city have creamed a lot the best South Wales talent. Some one has taken their eye off the ball. Losing Huw Jenkins was a loss. |
As the old saying goes "Never say never"
From the few games WHittaker played last season he seemed a good prospect and didnt he score a hat tick earlier this season?
It seems our ersthwile manager has decided to discard him....
What is it with you and HJ?
Depsite all the good he did do...or was maybe lucky to be around when there were good folk working at the club he also did a heck of lot of things wrong. | |
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| The big Martin question… on 17:12 - Dec 13 with 1356 views | Flynnidine_Zidownes |
| The big Martin question… on 15:02 - Dec 13 by Oldjack |
dump the prolific sideways and backward passes |
That’s not the problem. We’re getting chances but missing them and having brain farts in defence. Not a good combination. Earlier in the season we were taking our chances and keeping clean sheets.
That’s the difference. The mistakes are of our own making. People go on about teams “finding us out”. Well they haven’t. We’re gifting teams goals and missing gilt edged chances. We are beating ourselves. | | | |
| The big Martin question… on 17:13 - Dec 13 with 1352 views | onehunglow |
| The big Martin question… on 16:47 - Dec 13 by vetchonian |
As the old saying goes "Never say never"
From the few games WHittaker played last season he seemed a good prospect and didnt he score a hat tick earlier this season?
It seems our ersthwile manager has decided to discard him....
What is it with you and HJ?
Depsite all the good he did do...or was maybe lucky to be around when there were good folk working at the club he also did a heck of lot of things wrong. |
Whittaker scored a hat trick and then incredibly saw his performances rubbished as he was apparently lazy.
This is what we are up against .
The lad no doubt won’t run like a headless chicken nor will he put himself about much BUT he can and has finished …and did so against both Plymouth AND Manchester City BUT not even worthy of a bench .
No more needs to be said | |
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| The big Martin question… on 17:18 - Dec 13 with 1354 views | Flynnidine_Zidownes |
| The big Martin question… on 17:13 - Dec 13 by onehunglow |
Whittaker scored a hat trick and then incredibly saw his performances rubbished as he was apparently lazy.
This is what we are up against .
The lad no doubt won’t run like a headless chicken nor will he put himself about much BUT he can and has finished …and did so against both Plymouth AND Manchester City BUT not even worthy of a bench .
No more needs to be said |
He’s a victim of the system though. He’s a winger and we don’t play wingers. He’s been brought on in the Laird position a few times and struggles to get back for defensive duties.
I’m more confused about the Fulton situation. | | | |
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