| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing 19:51 - Jul 2 with 6519 views | Northernr |
 Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing 2nd Jul 2019 19:44The sixth new signing of QPR’s busy summer 2019 is Dominic Ball, a player unable to breakthrough at relegated Rotherham but one known to new manager Mark Warburton which can ring alarm bells in this part of the world.  6
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 12:02 - Jul 3 with 1264 views | Superhoop83 |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 10:41 - Jul 3 by Northernr |
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Suze! Have you seen the big scissors? Have you moved the big scissors?
(I know quoting lines isn't funny but I'm willing to make an exception for Alan.) |  |
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 12:16 - Jul 3 with 1237 views | Northernr |
There's some brave faces being put on this and that's fair enough. We'll wait and see, of course. Might turn into a surprise hit, yes he might. Only brought in as cover, fine. Probably not costing very much, ok, all relative. We're in a tight spot, need players, he's free. All fine. 30 appearances for Aberdeen, roll out the bunting.
But let's be honest here. We've signed a player who Rotherham didn't think was good enough for their League One team, or either of their relegated Championship teams. A player who Warburton himself didn't think was good enough for a regular spot in his Rangers team in the second tier of Scotish football - 15 starts. Who the Aberdeen fans don't rate - see above article. A player who's worked with the manager twice before, a player whose dad worked with the manager before. It doesn't quite stink, but it doesn't smell too great does it? Come on guys, if this was Redknapp what would you be saying... | | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 12:22 - Jul 3 with 1216 views | daveB |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 12:16 - Jul 3 by Northernr |
There's some brave faces being put on this and that's fair enough. We'll wait and see, of course. Might turn into a surprise hit, yes he might. Only brought in as cover, fine. Probably not costing very much, ok, all relative. We're in a tight spot, need players, he's free. All fine. 30 appearances for Aberdeen, roll out the bunting.
But let's be honest here. We've signed a player who Rotherham didn't think was good enough for their League One team, or either of their relegated Championship teams. A player who Warburton himself didn't think was good enough for a regular spot in his Rangers team in the second tier of Scotish football - 15 starts. Who the Aberdeen fans don't rate - see above article. A player who's worked with the manager twice before, a player whose dad worked with the manager before. It doesn't quite stink, but it doesn't smell too great does it? Come on guys, if this was Redknapp what would you be saying... |
Blimey, not sure I've ever seen such a reaction a free transfer utility player before. You may well turn out to be right of course but we heard similar about Grant Hall, Alex Baptiste and others in recent years and were told Cousins was going to be fantastic so I'm finding it hard to get upset about this. if Gary Penrice suggested a free transfer who didn't do very well at other clubs would that make the signing better in any way? |  | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 12:33 - Jul 3 with 1184 views | DavieQPR |
Sometimes you need someone who is happy to just be a bench warmer. To put Scottish football in perspective, Washington has just signed for the third best team in Scotland. |  | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing (n/t) on 12:38 - Jul 3 with 1166 views | KernowRanger |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 01:13 - Jul 3 by isawqpratwcity |
I've never been one to say "what does Les do?", but the signings this season are entirely Warburton retreads. Therefore, despite the spectacular success of signings like Derry and Hill, I have to sympathise with Clive's last question about Ferdinand and Penrice and the overall theme about manager-specific signings. We'll have to wait and see. |
Worth bearing in mind that we won't know whether Ferdinand/Penrice have vetoed any other signings Warbuton has wanted
Might be they haven't but might be they have and these are just the ones everyone at the club is happy with [Post edited 3 Jul 2019 12:45]
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:08 - Jul 3 with 1100 views | bosh67 |
The fact that we are looking at yet another winger slightly concerns me. We have them coming out our ears. With Smudge gone we only appear to have Oteh as our one remaining out and out striker. And he sat on the bench for 90% of his loan in a lower league. A penalty against Leeds (despite scoring it) hardly makes him the saviour goal threat. |  |
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:17 - Jul 3 with 1074 views | TGRRRSSS |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 12:22 - Jul 3 by daveB |
Blimey, not sure I've ever seen such a reaction a free transfer utility player before. You may well turn out to be right of course but we heard similar about Grant Hall, Alex Baptiste and others in recent years and were told Cousins was going to be fantastic so I'm finding it hard to get upset about this. if Gary Penrice suggested a free transfer who didn't do very well at other clubs would that make the signing better in any way? |
If this was Redknapp or Hughes doing this type of signing there's be a lot more hue and cry....
Warburton is starting to worry me.... agents, pockets, multiple clubs, knows the old man...……... |  | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:21 - Jul 3 with 1072 views | CliveWilsonSaid |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 12:16 - Jul 3 by Northernr |
There's some brave faces being put on this and that's fair enough. We'll wait and see, of course. Might turn into a surprise hit, yes he might. Only brought in as cover, fine. Probably not costing very much, ok, all relative. We're in a tight spot, need players, he's free. All fine. 30 appearances for Aberdeen, roll out the bunting.
But let's be honest here. We've signed a player who Rotherham didn't think was good enough for their League One team, or either of their relegated Championship teams. A player who Warburton himself didn't think was good enough for a regular spot in his Rangers team in the second tier of Scotish football - 15 starts. Who the Aberdeen fans don't rate - see above article. A player who's worked with the manager twice before, a player whose dad worked with the manager before. It doesn't quite stink, but it doesn't smell too great does it? Come on guys, if this was Redknapp what would you be saying... |
I don’t know much about the guy. Might be good to have people around who know what’s expected by Warburton? Not sure really. I’m a bit nonplussed by it all To be honest. |  |
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:29 - Jul 3 with 1060 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 12:16 - Jul 3 by Northernr |
There's some brave faces being put on this and that's fair enough. We'll wait and see, of course. Might turn into a surprise hit, yes he might. Only brought in as cover, fine. Probably not costing very much, ok, all relative. We're in a tight spot, need players, he's free. All fine. 30 appearances for Aberdeen, roll out the bunting.
But let's be honest here. We've signed a player who Rotherham didn't think was good enough for their League One team, or either of their relegated Championship teams. A player who Warburton himself didn't think was good enough for a regular spot in his Rangers team in the second tier of Scotish football - 15 starts. Who the Aberdeen fans don't rate - see above article. A player who's worked with the manager twice before, a player whose dad worked with the manager before. It doesn't quite stink, but it doesn't smell too great does it? Come on guys, if this was Redknapp what would you be saying... |
I do get that, of course, Clive.
My only point is that I would be far more worried about those points (and they are valid) if we spent a load of money on him, and he was going to be first-choice. As it is, he's a fourth-choice freebie on (most-likely) low wages, something the Roterham and Aberdeen fans probably aren't factoring in. |  |
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:33 - Jul 3 with 1055 views | Northernr |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 12:22 - Jul 3 by daveB |
Blimey, not sure I've ever seen such a reaction a free transfer utility player before. You may well turn out to be right of course but we heard similar about Grant Hall, Alex Baptiste and others in recent years and were told Cousins was going to be fantastic so I'm finding it hard to get upset about this. if Gary Penrice suggested a free transfer who didn't do very well at other clubs would that make the signing better in any way? |
I'm not going to go around and around on this because I agree with you, it is quite the reaction to a free transfer on (hopefully) minimal wage but...
Yes, it would be better if Gary Penrice was suggesting a sht free transfer. The theory, which you well know because you've (rightly) been banging this drum for years as well, is that you have a DOF and/or HOR who are here long term, and they recruit players with a long term vision and a consistent through line, whereas managers are only here short term so make short term decisions and bring in their mates. If you do the system properly, and appoint managers that suit it, then you don't get the situation we keep having where every time you sack a manager the new bloke wants to ditch six of the players he inherits and bring in six of his own.
Now, we've botched the system already in several ways...
- Not appointing managers that suit it
- Foisting managerial hirings and firings that they didn't want on the people running the club and the system
- allowing said managers to ditch the players they inherited anyway (Holloway) or allowing them to refuse the transfers that had been lined up as part of the system (McClaren)
But appointing a manager and just allowing him to make signings like this makes the system entirely redundant to the point where the people in it may as well not be here. Hoos is more than capable of negotiating contracts and transfer fees. | | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:34 - Jul 3 with 1049 views | Northernr |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:29 - Jul 3 by BrianMcCarthy |
I do get that, of course, Clive.
My only point is that I would be far more worried about those points (and they are valid) if we spent a load of money on him, and he was going to be first-choice. As it is, he's a fourth-choice freebie on (most-likely) low wages, something the Roterham and Aberdeen fans probably aren't factoring in. |
True. I do say that in the piece TBF. I think message boards/Twitter can make opinions seem stronger than they actually are. I'm not overly happy about this one, I have concerns, but I'm not climbing the walls.
Barrie McKay next. Who Warburton has signed twice before... 
This post has been edited by an administrator | | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:38 - Jul 3 with 1032 views | rsonist |
[Edit - McKay cringing] [Post edited 3 Jul 2019 13:39]
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:40 - Jul 3 with 1019 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:34 - Jul 3 by Northernr |
True. I do say that in the piece TBF. I think message boards/Twitter can make opinions seem stronger than they actually are. I'm not overly happy about this one, I have concerns, but I'm not climbing the walls.
Barrie McKay next. Who Warburton has signed twice before...
This post has been edited by an administrator |
"I'm not overly happy about this one, I have concerns, but I'm not climbing the walls."
Yep, that's me as well. | |
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:48 - Jul 3 with 992 views | rsonist |
Hogan...? Kevin O'Connor? | | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:57 - Jul 3 with 957 views | Northernr |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 09:38 - Jul 3 by stevec |
I've enquired at Specsavers about those blue and white hooped contact lenses and I know for a fact they don't come cheap. |
Some players who made more than 20 appearances in defence for the top six in Scotland last season….
Dominic Ball, Aberdeen (on loan from Rotherham)
Shaleum Logan, Aberdeen (formerly of Stockport, Tranmere and Scunthorpe, released by Brentford when they were League One)
Kirk Broadfoot, Kilmarnock (34 years old, released by Rotherham, previously with Blackpool, 34 starts last year for a team that finished 3rd)
Stephen O’Donnell, Kilmarnock (released by Luton when they were in League Two)
David Gray, Hibs, (released by Burton Albion when they were League Two, previously with Stevenage, Preston, Plymouth…)
Steven Whittaker, Hibs (released by Norwich)
Christophe Berra, Hearts (34 years old, 62 apps in two seasons after being released by mighty Ipswich)
Michael Smith, Hearts (released by Peterborough)
Would you like me to do 2017/18? | | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 14:00 - Jul 3 with 945 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:17 - Jul 3 by TGRRRSSS |
If this was Redknapp or Hughes doing this type of signing there's be a lot more hue and cry....
Warburton is starting to worry me.... agents, pockets, multiple clubs, knows the old man...……... |
Redknapp or Hughes didn't do free transfers, though. |  |
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 14:16 - Jul 3 with 904 views | Antti_Heinola |
ok now we've signed Conor from Liverpool, this Ball one looks even worse. I'm on the boo bandwagon. | |
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| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 14:32 - Jul 3 with 878 views | Match82 |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 14:16 - Jul 3 by Antti_Heinola |
ok now we've signed Conor from Liverpool, this Ball one looks even worse. I'm on the boo bandwagon. |
Ok, I'll trade places. My concern with Ball is that it was beginning to look like a pattern. The Conor signing suggests it's not. So I now feel better about Ball being squad depth and not signed merely because of who he knows. |  | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 14:36 - Jul 3 with 871 views | daveB |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:33 - Jul 3 by Northernr |
I'm not going to go around and around on this because I agree with you, it is quite the reaction to a free transfer on (hopefully) minimal wage but...
Yes, it would be better if Gary Penrice was suggesting a sht free transfer. The theory, which you well know because you've (rightly) been banging this drum for years as well, is that you have a DOF and/or HOR who are here long term, and they recruit players with a long term vision and a consistent through line, whereas managers are only here short term so make short term decisions and bring in their mates. If you do the system properly, and appoint managers that suit it, then you don't get the situation we keep having where every time you sack a manager the new bloke wants to ditch six of the players he inherits and bring in six of his own.
Now, we've botched the system already in several ways...
- Not appointing managers that suit it
- Foisting managerial hirings and firings that they didn't want on the people running the club and the system
- allowing said managers to ditch the players they inherited anyway (Holloway) or allowing them to refuse the transfers that had been lined up as part of the system (McClaren)
But appointing a manager and just allowing him to make signings like this makes the system entirely redundant to the point where the people in it may as well not be here. Hoos is more than capable of negotiating contracts and transfer fees. |
for me as i said earlier on this thread signings need to fit profile of player the director of football sets so they need to tick certain boxes such as age, development potential, fitting into a way we want to play, sell on value etc and as long as those boxes are ticked I'm not overly bothered if they are picked by Penrice, Ferdinand or the manager
Ferdinands role should not just be about the first team, the academy is a big part of it and recruiting good players for the under 23's who become first team players such as Eze and hopefully chair, this is a big part of what he has to get right. The first team recruitment is always going to be a lot to do with the manager and the key with that is the make sure you are consistent with the type of manager you appoint so you don't have completely different needs every year. We've certainly got that wrong in recent years | | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 15:46 - Jul 3 with 801 views | karl |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 13:57 - Jul 3 by Northernr |
Some players who made more than 20 appearances in defence for the top six in Scotland last season….
Dominic Ball, Aberdeen (on loan from Rotherham)
Shaleum Logan, Aberdeen (formerly of Stockport, Tranmere and Scunthorpe, released by Brentford when they were League One)
Kirk Broadfoot, Kilmarnock (34 years old, released by Rotherham, previously with Blackpool, 34 starts last year for a team that finished 3rd)
Stephen O’Donnell, Kilmarnock (released by Luton when they were in League Two)
David Gray, Hibs, (released by Burton Albion when they were League Two, previously with Stevenage, Preston, Plymouth…)
Steven Whittaker, Hibs (released by Norwich)
Christophe Berra, Hearts (34 years old, 62 apps in two seasons after being released by mighty Ipswich)
Michael Smith, Hearts (released by Peterborough)
Would you like me to do 2017/18? |
You do your reputation as a fair and balanced reporter a disservice with your attitude to Scottish football, I know you do it to an extent as a windup/joke but this should be a piece you're taking seriously.
Aberdeen under McInnes are very much built around their defence and having watched them a lot, in the flesh and TV then I would categorically say that Ball is a back up defender the same as Lynch, Birdwell and Furlong would be if they had Logan, McKenna, Devlin and Lowe available. Leistner I would put 50/50 with Devlin.
Ball would have started a good number of those games in midfield and covered across the back 4.
I do agree that he is not good enough but your reasoning is way off and picking 5 or 6 players from non Aberdeen teams to argue your point is weak too.
Warburton worries me and I do hope he gets off to a flier, which I think he is capable of, as I'm concerned that he has no alternative plan to change to. |  | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 15:52 - Jul 3 with 792 views | Northernr |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 15:46 - Jul 3 by karl |
You do your reputation as a fair and balanced reporter a disservice with your attitude to Scottish football, I know you do it to an extent as a windup/joke but this should be a piece you're taking seriously.
Aberdeen under McInnes are very much built around their defence and having watched them a lot, in the flesh and TV then I would categorically say that Ball is a back up defender the same as Lynch, Birdwell and Furlong would be if they had Logan, McKenna, Devlin and Lowe available. Leistner I would put 50/50 with Devlin.
Ball would have started a good number of those games in midfield and covered across the back 4.
I do agree that he is not good enough but your reasoning is way off and picking 5 or 6 players from non Aberdeen teams to argue your point is weak too.
Warburton worries me and I do hope he gets off to a flier, which I think he is capable of, as I'm concerned that he has no alternative plan to change to. |
Knew you'd be along soon.
Well I bow to your superior knowledge of course but Logan is at Aberdeen and never made it above League One down here, and Kilmarnock did finish third last year with a 34 year old free transfer from Rotherham at centre half.
This post has been edited by an administrator | | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 16:00 - Jul 3 with 784 views | karl |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 15:52 - Jul 3 by Northernr |
Knew you'd be along soon.
Well I bow to your superior knowledge of course but Logan is at Aberdeen and never made it above League One down here, and Kilmarnock did finish third last year with a 34 year old free transfer from Rotherham at centre half.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Logan is a cracking young player who McInnes has developed over a couple of years, much as Furlong needs, in that case I put Logan ahead of Furlong at the moment. It might change but not for the season past.
Kilmarnock were coached brilliantly, the team Clarke had basically went from bottom of the league to the best results in Scotland over a calender 12 months, Broadfoot was an important piece but imo the unit was key with Clarkes coaching and seemed to keep pretty much injury free. | | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 16:02 - Jul 3 with 782 views | karl |
And your (cheap) edit adds to my point that you're basically on the wind up, weakening your valid concerns about Ball | | | |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 16:11 - Jul 3 with 769 views | Northernr |
| Ball arrival raises old recruitment questions — Signing on 16:02 - Jul 3 by karl |
And your (cheap) edit adds to my point that you're basically on the wind up, weakening your valid concerns about Ball |
Sorry, wasn't intended that way, was trying to make it look less aggressive. I do, as I say, bow to your superior knowledge. | | | |
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