| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! 10:40 - Mar 24 with 2309 views | SwansIndependent |
 Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! 24th Mar 2023 10:39If only life was as simple as having no bad news ? And when we had that news it would always be something positive to end with ? Earlier today we received a note from the coastguard in Falmouth that an old bottle from many years ago had been found. In this bottle was a note, a scripture if you like and on closer inspection it came from Jack Butty.  1
Left a bit, right a bit, steady - FIRE !
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:07 - Mar 24 with 1765 views | vetchonian |
It is all about opinions BUT
Martinball is nowhere near the attractive attacking football we witnessed enroute to the PL under MArtinez, and Rodgers or whilst we were there under ROdgers and Laudrup
The team structure he adapts with wing backs as his most advanced wide players never works
HIs philosophy was about retaining the ball keeping possession tiring the opposition so as they "eventually stop running".
I'm sorry but it wont matter how much he has his style of football is not that served up by Martinez which was getting the ball forward as fast as possible on the floor and scoring goals , under Brendan it was still about attacking but keeping the ball if there was no attacking option to create a new one.
He is a nice man and yes he needs to show self belief in his system otherwise how do you get others to buy in yet it seems many of the seasoned pros in the team dont share his belief......that should say a lot
Two seasons on his system doesnt work...in fact 4 season on he couldnt get it successful at MKDons either.
It seems many believe passing it around inside our own half is a return to "the Swansea Way" it never happened under Martinez and was not the major factor in our game under Brendan..
As regards developing young players apart from Ollie Cooper who has blossomed this season though he made debuts in the first team under previous managers which young players has Martin brought on I would say he has done more to set players back
Rhys Williams arrived with us with a better predigree than Geuhi having played in the PL and Champions League for Liverpool where he played on the left hand side of the defence yet our erstwhile manager decided he would be better playing on the right with Cabango having played most of his football on the right side playing on the left.
This led to both of these guys getting osme stick and Rhys Williams some nasty stuff llok where WIliiams is now!
Again its all personal opinion , look how Martin threw Congrave under the bus....and how he has treated/ managed Whittaker.
For me Martin should go in the summer....but its not my decision | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:29 - Mar 24 with 1745 views | swancity |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:07 - Mar 24 by vetchonian |
It is all about opinions BUT
Martinball is nowhere near the attractive attacking football we witnessed enroute to the PL under MArtinez, and Rodgers or whilst we were there under ROdgers and Laudrup
The team structure he adapts with wing backs as his most advanced wide players never works
HIs philosophy was about retaining the ball keeping possession tiring the opposition so as they "eventually stop running".
I'm sorry but it wont matter how much he has his style of football is not that served up by Martinez which was getting the ball forward as fast as possible on the floor and scoring goals , under Brendan it was still about attacking but keeping the ball if there was no attacking option to create a new one.
He is a nice man and yes he needs to show self belief in his system otherwise how do you get others to buy in yet it seems many of the seasoned pros in the team dont share his belief......that should say a lot
Two seasons on his system doesnt work...in fact 4 season on he couldnt get it successful at MKDons either.
It seems many believe passing it around inside our own half is a return to "the Swansea Way" it never happened under Martinez and was not the major factor in our game under Brendan..
As regards developing young players apart from Ollie Cooper who has blossomed this season though he made debuts in the first team under previous managers which young players has Martin brought on I would say he has done more to set players back
Rhys Williams arrived with us with a better predigree than Geuhi having played in the PL and Champions League for Liverpool where he played on the left hand side of the defence yet our erstwhile manager decided he would be better playing on the right with Cabango having played most of his football on the right side playing on the left.
This led to both of these guys getting osme stick and Rhys Williams some nasty stuff llok where WIliiams is now!
Again its all personal opinion , look how Martin threw Congrave under the bus....and how he has treated/ managed Whittaker.
For me Martin should go in the summer....but its not my decision |
You’ve got a severe case of selective memory there
I can recall our fans becoming frustrated at the Liberty when Martinez and ROdgers were here. We played a similar possession based game to what we implement now. We had better players though. Certainly in goal and defensively but there were certainly periods where similar issues were causing problems.
I feel that we are just 3/4 players away from being a promotion team. I hope Martin stays. Anyone watching us at Millwall will know that we are making progress even in defeat as you don’t always get what you deserve. | |
| Only an idiot would eat a turkey curry on Christmas day |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:47 - Mar 24 with 1712 views | onehunglow |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:29 - Mar 24 by swancity |
You’ve got a severe case of selective memory there
I can recall our fans becoming frustrated at the Liberty when Martinez and ROdgers were here. We played a similar possession based game to what we implement now. We had better players though. Certainly in goal and defensively but there were certainly periods where similar issues were causing problems.
I feel that we are just 3/4 players away from being a promotion team. I hope Martin stays. Anyone watching us at Millwall will know that we are making progress even in defeat as you don’t always get what you deserve. |
It’s a case of you viewing matters differently to vetchy.
You enjoying a defeat to many means your viewpoint is odd.
I’ve met nobody in 70 years that enjoys losing .
Of course MRtin needs time,but for what God knows.
Frankly, like many I’m past caring now as anyone disagreeing with him or his follows leads to approbrium and indeed veiled threats .
Personally I am confident allowing him to remain much longer will hardly bring us success or maybe that is second place to the process .
The support for him in incredible . | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:51 - Mar 24 with 1715 views | theloneranger |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:07 - Mar 24 by vetchonian |
It is all about opinions BUT
Martinball is nowhere near the attractive attacking football we witnessed enroute to the PL under MArtinez, and Rodgers or whilst we were there under ROdgers and Laudrup
The team structure he adapts with wing backs as his most advanced wide players never works
HIs philosophy was about retaining the ball keeping possession tiring the opposition so as they "eventually stop running".
I'm sorry but it wont matter how much he has his style of football is not that served up by Martinez which was getting the ball forward as fast as possible on the floor and scoring goals , under Brendan it was still about attacking but keeping the ball if there was no attacking option to create a new one.
He is a nice man and yes he needs to show self belief in his system otherwise how do you get others to buy in yet it seems many of the seasoned pros in the team dont share his belief......that should say a lot
Two seasons on his system doesnt work...in fact 4 season on he couldnt get it successful at MKDons either.
It seems many believe passing it around inside our own half is a return to "the Swansea Way" it never happened under Martinez and was not the major factor in our game under Brendan..
As regards developing young players apart from Ollie Cooper who has blossomed this season though he made debuts in the first team under previous managers which young players has Martin brought on I would say he has done more to set players back
Rhys Williams arrived with us with a better predigree than Geuhi having played in the PL and Champions League for Liverpool where he played on the left hand side of the defence yet our erstwhile manager decided he would be better playing on the right with Cabango having played most of his football on the right side playing on the left.
This led to both of these guys getting osme stick and Rhys Williams some nasty stuff llok where WIliiams is now!
Again its all personal opinion , look how Martin threw Congrave under the bus....and how he has treated/ managed Whittaker.
For me Martin should go in the summer....but its not my decision |
... "look where Williams is now! ...
Since Liverpool once again recalled him early from a season long loan in January - this time with Blackpool - he's played 3 Premier League 2 games!! |  |
| Everyday above ground ... Is a good day! 😎 |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:56 - Mar 24 with 1705 views | vetchonian |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:29 - Mar 24 by swancity |
You’ve got a severe case of selective memory there
I can recall our fans becoming frustrated at the Liberty when Martinez and ROdgers were here. We played a similar possession based game to what we implement now. We had better players though. Certainly in goal and defensively but there were certainly periods where similar issues were causing problems.
I feel that we are just 3/4 players away from being a promotion team. I hope Martin stays. Anyone watching us at Millwall will know that we are making progress even in defeat as you don’t always get what you deserve. |
Fans were never frustrated when Martinez was here in fact I know of fans who had not been for a while raving about how we were playing...Martinez did not pass the ball for passing sake ....his mantra was fast attacking football if we had high possession stats then it was because we always had the ball and were running at the opposition with it
I do recall some supporters frustrations under Brendan when the ball would go backwards when there were no clear attacking opportunities .....to say the endless "to me to you Chuckle brothers" football we have witnessed under Martin is anything like that played by Martinez, Rodgers or Laudrup is way off the mark and I am sure there will be many more who would concur | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 14:00 - Mar 24 with 1696 views | onehunglow |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:56 - Mar 24 by vetchonian |
Fans were never frustrated when Martinez was here in fact I know of fans who had not been for a while raving about how we were playing...Martinez did not pass the ball for passing sake ....his mantra was fast attacking football if we had high possession stats then it was because we always had the ball and were running at the opposition with it
I do recall some supporters frustrations under Brendan when the ball would go backwards when there were no clear attacking opportunities .....to say the endless "to me to you Chuckle brothers" football we have witnessed under Martin is anything like that played by Martinez, Rodgers or Laudrup is way off the mark and I am sure there will be many more who would concur |
Martinez appealed to all.
Fact.
He was a personal inspiration and lifted the club and our expectations .
His legacy is safe
Martin has done remotely laudable as Bobby . Nothing . | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 17:08 - Mar 24 with 1600 views | swancity |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:56 - Mar 24 by vetchonian |
Fans were never frustrated when Martinez was here in fact I know of fans who had not been for a while raving about how we were playing...Martinez did not pass the ball for passing sake ....his mantra was fast attacking football if we had high possession stats then it was because we always had the ball and were running at the opposition with it
I do recall some supporters frustrations under Brendan when the ball would go backwards when there were no clear attacking opportunities .....to say the endless "to me to you Chuckle brothers" football we have witnessed under Martin is anything like that played by Martinez, Rodgers or Laudrup is way off the mark and I am sure there will be many more who would concur |
I recall one game especially when we drew 0-0. I was sitting on half way in the east stand. There was a lot of restlessness with our passing in deep areas. I understood that it’s the best way to try to play the game. Martinez changed our style for the better virtually overnight but let’s not try to pretend that there weren’t any difficult moments. Same with ROdgers. Football fans want to see crosses, shots, goalmouth action, saves.
We are a bit different to most clubs in the way we play. It’s commendable and long May it continue. | |
| Only an idiot would eat a turkey curry on Christmas day |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 17:44 - Mar 24 with 1559 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:29 - Mar 24 by swancity |
You’ve got a severe case of selective memory there
I can recall our fans becoming frustrated at the Liberty when Martinez and ROdgers were here. We played a similar possession based game to what we implement now. We had better players though. Certainly in goal and defensively but there were certainly periods where similar issues were causing problems.
I feel that we are just 3/4 players away from being a promotion team. I hope Martin stays. Anyone watching us at Millwall will know that we are making progress even in defeat as you don’t always get what you deserve. |
Hang on, under martinez it was very much a case of "we're gonna score more goals than you" and we usualy did, we weren't great in defence because we were so attack oriented.
Under Rodgers we did spend a lot of time passing it in our own half BUT not in our own penalty area and when a chance to attack was there we didn't turn them down anything like as often we do now.
You cannot judge a season on one game and I dont judge Martin on one game, I jdge him on 18 months and counting. We have gone backwards by several steps. | | | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:39 - Mar 24 with 1479 views | KeithHaynes |
Here’s a question, has Martin delivered more exciting football ( when it works ) than Steve Cooper ? |  |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:50 - Mar 24 with 1464 views | Whiterockin |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:39 - Mar 24 by KeithHaynes |
Here’s a question, has Martin delivered more exciting football ( when it works ) than Steve Cooper ? |
Yes but it hasn't worked often enough. |  | | |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 00:23 - Mar 25 with 1371 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:39 - Mar 24 by KeithHaynes |
Here’s a question, has Martin delivered more exciting football ( when it works ) than Steve Cooper ? |
Not for me.
I don’t really get excited by passes. I get excited by winning, attacking and great organisation.
Give me a tight, disciplined and organised 1-0 win over a error strewn senseless and open 3-1 loss any day of the week.
One of the worst games I’ve witnessed that people hark back to as “exciting” was the Palace 5-4 win at home. I was furious after that game and football rarely gets me angry.
1.29 goals a game for Russ, 1.27 for goals a game for Cooper.
Nothing in it in terms of attacking football.
However Cooper was able to organise a defence, play a game plan suited to the players we had and make the sufficient tactical decisions to get us winning games almost every week to the point he equalled Brendan’s record with a far inferior side.
Russ’ system has never worked, ever. Didn’t work at MK and certainly hasn’t worked here.
He’s realised this recently and tried to play wingers, except he’s got rid of them all from our squad meaning he’s having to put Piroe and even Cullen out there.
So there is a chance that after 2 years of realising central possession doesn’t work that he will now adapt, but for me the fact it’s taken him 2 years (4 including MK) to realise what was obvious after 2 weeks is a sackable offence by itself.
There is very little trust there that he will continue to play the wider attacking system we have been calling for. We have had a million false dawns and be eventually just goes back to type.
I’d get rid in the summer, regardless of back end of season results from here on in. |  |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 07:26 - Mar 25 with 1335 views | vetchonian |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:39 - Mar 24 by KeithHaynes |
Here’s a question, has Martin delivered more exciting football ( when it works ) than Steve Cooper ? |
how exciting would Martinball appear watched under the same conditions as Cooper ....in empty stadiums with zero atmosphere and sat t home in the tele? | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 08:58 - Mar 25 with 1291 views | RichardO |
Maybe, now he realises why he brought in two new young defenders because we badly needed them in his first season and he still badly needs them in his second.
So he has gone back to playing them both because they are able to defend better than those he has tried to play otherwise.
Maybe that is being harsh on the other defenders but Lati, Sorinola and even Naughton if we press higher up the pitch they will get found out by their lack of pace.
Steve Cooper knew it and tried to put safe guards in place Roberts on the right and Bidewell on the left. Bidewell was there to cover Manning's surges forward which then has left him stranded up front, Manning is still making those runs which has left someone needing to cover which is why 4-4-2 is better.
Funny how Martin wants to play quick passing from one side to other and yet teams have been doing it better than us and quicker without fear of a player within 5 yards of them and yet we try it with very little space in our defensive third and yet against Bristol we pushed on with the defence further up the pitch we ended up with more space and time for our defenders.
I can understand why with games coming thick and fast and with young players he has tried to protect them by rotation but the inconsistencies in his team selections, substitutions timings and the wholesale positional changes while making them, is beyond me.
If it works don't change it. If changes needed for whatever reason keep it simple.
Will be interesting to see if he starts with same team against Coventry or makes the seemingly random wholesale changes again. | | | |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 10:49 - Mar 25 with 1238 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:39 - Mar 24 by KeithHaynes |
Here’s a question, has Martin delivered more exciting football ( when it works ) than Steve Cooper ? |
"Exciting", not using Matinball, his version is never more exciting, unless you like the excitement of trying to keep the ball out of the back of our net.
The exciting football this season has been when he dumps his stupid passing for passings sake and goes conventional fast attacking football.
All about opinion isn't it? | | | |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 10:58 - Mar 25 with 1226 views | KeithHaynes |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 10:49 - Mar 25 by A_Fans_Dad |
"Exciting", not using Matinball, his version is never more exciting, unless you like the excitement of trying to keep the ball out of the back of our net.
The exciting football this season has been when he dumps his stupid passing for passings sake and goes conventional fast attacking football.
All about opinion isn't it? |
You seem to think that a question or conversation is part of an argument in your own head, it’s very weird. | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 12:36 - Mar 25 with 1179 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 10:58 - Mar 25 by KeithHaynes |
You seem to think that a question or conversation is part of an argument in your own head, it’s very weird. |
If you don't want answers that require opinions, don't ask the questions that require opinions. [Post edited 25 Mar 2023 12:38]
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 13:34 - Mar 25 with 1141 views | KeithHaynes |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 12:36 - Mar 25 by A_Fans_Dad |
If you don't want answers that require opinions, don't ask the questions that require opinions. [Post edited 25 Mar 2023 12:38]
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You really do need to chill out. Not everything is a ruck, as much as it solves many things. | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 17:10 - Mar 25 with 1060 views | Dr_Winston |
When we play well under Russy it's far more entertaining than most games under Cooper. Unfortunately we don't play well anywhere often enough, and the reasons we don't play well are largely within our own means to solve. We have a coach so wedded to his own idiotic ideals of how he wants to play and incapable of anything approaching defensive organisation that we keep shooting ourselves in the foot.
Cooper plays tedious football (or did here at least) and I'm glad he f*cked off but on the evidence available he's a significantly superior coach to Martin. [Post edited 25 Mar 2023 17:11]
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| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 18:49 - Mar 25 with 984 views | dantheswansman |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 17:10 - Mar 25 by Dr_Winston |
When we play well under Russy it's far more entertaining than most games under Cooper. Unfortunately we don't play well anywhere often enough, and the reasons we don't play well are largely within our own means to solve. We have a coach so wedded to his own idiotic ideals of how he wants to play and incapable of anything approaching defensive organisation that we keep shooting ourselves in the foot.
Cooper plays tedious football (or did here at least) and I'm glad he f*cked off but on the evidence available he's a significantly superior coach to Martin. [Post edited 25 Mar 2023 17:11]
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75% of Martins problems and issues are the incompetent owners at Swansea City, Cooper left because of it and he wasn't the first either
A great analogy i was told many years ago, you cannot polish a turd |  | | |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 19:06 - Mar 25 with 979 views | swancity |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 17:10 - Mar 25 by Dr_Winston |
When we play well under Russy it's far more entertaining than most games under Cooper. Unfortunately we don't play well anywhere often enough, and the reasons we don't play well are largely within our own means to solve. We have a coach so wedded to his own idiotic ideals of how he wants to play and incapable of anything approaching defensive organisation that we keep shooting ourselves in the foot.
Cooper plays tedious football (or did here at least) and I'm glad he f*cked off but on the evidence available he's a significantly superior coach to Martin. [Post edited 25 Mar 2023 17:11]
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Cobblers. All of it and no that’s not what’s keeping your ears apart either.
You can’t legislate for costly individual errors. That’s been an issue for a few months. And that’s why changes to the team have been made. The style is good. We have shown that in patches albeit too many errors have stopped our progress. Millwall recently being a good example. | |
| Only an idiot would eat a turkey curry on Christmas day |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:25 - Mar 25 with 947 views | vetchonian |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 18:49 - Mar 25 by dantheswansman |
75% of Martins problems and issues are the incompetent owners at Swansea City, Cooper left because of it and he wasn't the first either
A great analogy i was told many years ago, you cannot polish a turd |
yet under the same ownership the previous manager got us us to 6th place and the play offs and the 4th place and to the play off final
this manager managed some good wins this season such as WBA away and despite only losing one player from the team that did that hS struggled
the man is a frauld our owners may not seem the best but they are keeping our club solvent...this.manager spent money on Fisher really? | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:34 - Mar 25 with 929 views | Treforys_Jack |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:25 - Mar 25 by vetchonian |
yet under the same ownership the previous manager got us us to 6th place and the play offs and the 4th place and to the play off final
this manager managed some good wins this season such as WBA away and despite only losing one player from the team that did that hS struggled
the man is a frauld our owners may not seem the best but they are keeping our club solvent...this.manager spent money on Fisher really? |
Enough said, but let's just keep blaming the owners is it. The only thing I blame them for, is not sacking RM |  | | |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:55 - Mar 25 with 909 views | Dr_Winston |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 20:25 - Mar 25 by vetchonian |
yet under the same ownership the previous manager got us us to 6th place and the play offs and the 4th place and to the play off final
this manager managed some good wins this season such as WBA away and despite only losing one player from the team that did that hS struggled
the man is a frauld our owners may not seem the best but they are keeping our club solvent...this.manager spent money on Fisher really? |
Russy took one look at Benda and Fulton then decided that they were both surplus to requirements.
That fact alone should be enough to secure his dismissal. | |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 21:04 - Mar 25 with 895 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 19:06 - Mar 25 by swancity |
Cobblers. All of it and no that’s not what’s keeping your ears apart either.
You can’t legislate for costly individual errors. That’s been an issue for a few months. And that’s why changes to the team have been made. The style is good. We have shown that in patches albeit too many errors have stopped our progress. Millwall recently being a good example. |
Yes you can, these “individual errors” are a direct result of the system.
They aren’t “unlucky”, they are guaranteed.
If you keep passing around your box, it’s going to go wrong. Not might go wrong, WILL go wrong. You do it all centrally so there is no outball and no escape out wide then the press can be even more aggressive and even harder to get out.
The style is woeful; who are you kidding? | |
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| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 21:08 - Mar 25 with 894 views | Treforys_Jack |
| Russell Martin and the reasons why he needs more time at Swansea ! on 21:04 - Mar 25 by Dr_Parnassus |
Yes you can, these “individual errors” are a direct result of the system.
They aren’t “unlucky”, they are guaranteed.
If you keep passing around your box, it’s going to go wrong. Not might go wrong, WILL go wrong. You do it all centrally so there is no outball and no escape out wide then the press can be even more aggressive and even harder to get out.
The style is woeful; who are you kidding? |
Very high risk, very low reward...... in and around our own penalty area, what could possibly go wrong. | | | |
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