| Bar access 15:52 - Aug 12 with 34161 views | rochdaleriddler |
Sandy laners not allowed to have a pint at half time, but main stand is?? |  |
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| Bar access on 13:08 - Aug 16 with 2407 views | TVOS1907 |
| Bar access on 12:55 - Aug 16 by James1980 |
Very good question I will ask next time I see him. I take it from other posts on this thread that even if the nightlife in Rochdale was on the wane, it isn't anymore. |
So where is your friend from? |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Bar access on 14:24 - Aug 16 with 2300 views | off2div1 |
How's about a song about the finer points of Rochdale.The Coop the lovely Town Hall( even Hitler wanted to nick it) and other places.Just like the poet said about Manchester after Arena tragedy.  |  | | |
| Bar access on 15:48 - Aug 16 with 2222 views | pioneer |
I think you can take the boy (girl) out of Rochdale but you cannot take Rochdale out of the boy(girl).
Yes there are many very unpleasant parts of the town ( I spent the first 18 years on my life in one of them - Kirkholt - I look back and wonder how I survived) and plenty of wonderful aspects to it, particularly its location/proximity to wonderful countryside. I still return to see the dale and visit my parents grave in the cemetry (usually as part of the same visit) though less regularly than previously as my Rochdale based relatives have passed away and most of my friends from Rochdale have also left town. I used to deliberately go through the town centre and do bits of shopping but over the years the shops declined and my shopping became and remains limited to flowers from Asda for the above mentioned grave. I still visit a pal of mine in Bacup frequently and wear my Dale and Hornets shirts and other teamwear with great pride around the world. I have a photo of thirteen of the original pioneers on my office notice board - something visitors to my office ask about on a frequent basis. Only last year a bloke jumped out of a delivery van as I was on my way to the office a long way away from Spotland wearing my Dale weatherproof top and stopped me to talk about the previous nights Paint trophy game!
I suspect most people who leave do so for economic reasons - not many high paying jobs around. I wonder how many who do so ever return.
The town has been the victim of some terrible 'business' decisions by organisations like the NHS. I wouldn't want to live in a town of Rochdale's size that has no full service hospital - that is scandalous. It prevents me from considering retiring back to Rochdale as the end of my working days rapidly approaches. I had a relative who had to spend two hours each way commuting by public transport to visit his dying wife in North Manchester General in Crumpsall. The trust that is 'in charge' has the poorest record of any trust in the country when it comes to pay outs for legal cases. Of the four hospital sites in the trust only Rochdale Infirmary (the 'smallest' in the trust) has a quality rating of good - yet for most things Rochdale folks have to travel to Crumpsall, Fairfield or Oldham which have ratings of 'inadequate' or 'needs improvement'. No amount of wonderful countryside, wine bars or river walks can compensate for inadequate public services. Those responsible for the deterioration in public services should hang their heads in shame. Julian Tudor Hart was a GP in the welsh coalfields in the 1960s and came up with the concept of the inverse care law - those with greatest needs receive poorest access to care. The fine people (and taxpayers) of Rochdale are victims of that law.
My own mother (in Rochdale) and my mother-in-law (in Baguley) both suffered similar health conditions in their later years - the care and support they received was 'chalk and cheese' - it is unfair that Rochdale residents should not receive the same quantity and quality of care as folks in other towns and cities.
I understand people who have always lived there, and never had a reason or an opportunity to leave feeling very proud of the town and resenting criticism from those who have left. But its difficult to get a balanced view if you haven't experienced anything else. I hope all the new initiatives. developments and investment can turn the place around. But I wouldn't want to grow old or be sick in Rochdale.
Apologies to anyone who feels insulted by this - that is not the intention - simply reflections of a leaver and frequenter returner who remains very proud of his roots.
Up the Dale |  | | |
| Bar access on 16:09 - Aug 16 with 2196 views | D_Alien |
| Bar access on 15:48 - Aug 16 by pioneer |
I think you can take the boy (girl) out of Rochdale but you cannot take Rochdale out of the boy(girl).
Yes there are many very unpleasant parts of the town ( I spent the first 18 years on my life in one of them - Kirkholt - I look back and wonder how I survived) and plenty of wonderful aspects to it, particularly its location/proximity to wonderful countryside. I still return to see the dale and visit my parents grave in the cemetry (usually as part of the same visit) though less regularly than previously as my Rochdale based relatives have passed away and most of my friends from Rochdale have also left town. I used to deliberately go through the town centre and do bits of shopping but over the years the shops declined and my shopping became and remains limited to flowers from Asda for the above mentioned grave. I still visit a pal of mine in Bacup frequently and wear my Dale and Hornets shirts and other teamwear with great pride around the world. I have a photo of thirteen of the original pioneers on my office notice board - something visitors to my office ask about on a frequent basis. Only last year a bloke jumped out of a delivery van as I was on my way to the office a long way away from Spotland wearing my Dale weatherproof top and stopped me to talk about the previous nights Paint trophy game!
I suspect most people who leave do so for economic reasons - not many high paying jobs around. I wonder how many who do so ever return.
The town has been the victim of some terrible 'business' decisions by organisations like the NHS. I wouldn't want to live in a town of Rochdale's size that has no full service hospital - that is scandalous. It prevents me from considering retiring back to Rochdale as the end of my working days rapidly approaches. I had a relative who had to spend two hours each way commuting by public transport to visit his dying wife in North Manchester General in Crumpsall. The trust that is 'in charge' has the poorest record of any trust in the country when it comes to pay outs for legal cases. Of the four hospital sites in the trust only Rochdale Infirmary (the 'smallest' in the trust) has a quality rating of good - yet for most things Rochdale folks have to travel to Crumpsall, Fairfield or Oldham which have ratings of 'inadequate' or 'needs improvement'. No amount of wonderful countryside, wine bars or river walks can compensate for inadequate public services. Those responsible for the deterioration in public services should hang their heads in shame. Julian Tudor Hart was a GP in the welsh coalfields in the 1960s and came up with the concept of the inverse care law - those with greatest needs receive poorest access to care. The fine people (and taxpayers) of Rochdale are victims of that law.
My own mother (in Rochdale) and my mother-in-law (in Baguley) both suffered similar health conditions in their later years - the care and support they received was 'chalk and cheese' - it is unfair that Rochdale residents should not receive the same quantity and quality of care as folks in other towns and cities.
I understand people who have always lived there, and never had a reason or an opportunity to leave feeling very proud of the town and resenting criticism from those who have left. But its difficult to get a balanced view if you haven't experienced anything else. I hope all the new initiatives. developments and investment can turn the place around. But I wouldn't want to grow old or be sick in Rochdale.
Apologies to anyone who feels insulted by this - that is not the intention - simply reflections of a leaver and frequenter returner who remains very proud of his roots.
Up the Dale |
I sympathise with much of what you say, and i know we've locked horns over the NHS in the past, but i'm not posting with that in mind
I'd simply like to point out that if you connect two of the valid points you make together, there's an answer to your NHS point which just happens to be true
The reason healthcare facilities in Rochdale can never be full scale is down to insufficient highly qualified specialists wanting to live in the locality. Services have to be concentrated where the best clinicians wish to live and work, thus advancing their careers. That's teaching hospitals in major cities.
In the past we've had a few good individual clinicians who've served the town well, but more often than not we could only attract third-raters who made a great show of parading up and down the corridors of Birch Hill and the Infirmary but whose skills left patients with poor outcomes compared to what they might've expected at a teaching hospital. Sometimes, the consultants came to Rochdale because they couldn't hack it elsewhere (and i use hack advisedly).
So if you want the best for your sick or injured relatives, you need to live somewhere where the clinicians see lots of similar cases to retain their practical skills which they simply wouldn't in a town the size of Rochdale. When the London terrorist incidents occurred the victims stood a far greater chance of survival from stab wounds because the clinicians (both doctors & nurses) in the local A&E had lots of experience in dealing with them
That's the reality. Best wishes for the future |  |
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| Bar access on 16:10 - Aug 16 with 2196 views | rochdaleriddler |
| Bar access on 10:46 - Aug 16 by KenBoon |
I agree about college bank. They need to go. I believe they're not particularly nice to live in. Also they've become the default image of Rochdale when reporting news. Demolishing them wouldn't solve the root problems, but it'd further improve the town centre, provide better living conditions and remove an eyesore. |
Nice to live in or not, demolishing them will mean rehousing a lot of people, as Rbh have demolished a lot of flats recently at small bridge, kirkholt etc where are the displaced folk to go. Keep the flats, evict the knob heads, enforce the tenancy conditions. The buildings are fine | |
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| Bar access on 16:44 - Aug 16 with 2135 views | pioneer |
| Bar access on 16:09 - Aug 16 by D_Alien |
I sympathise with much of what you say, and i know we've locked horns over the NHS in the past, but i'm not posting with that in mind
I'd simply like to point out that if you connect two of the valid points you make together, there's an answer to your NHS point which just happens to be true
The reason healthcare facilities in Rochdale can never be full scale is down to insufficient highly qualified specialists wanting to live in the locality. Services have to be concentrated where the best clinicians wish to live and work, thus advancing their careers. That's teaching hospitals in major cities.
In the past we've had a few good individual clinicians who've served the town well, but more often than not we could only attract third-raters who made a great show of parading up and down the corridors of Birch Hill and the Infirmary but whose skills left patients with poor outcomes compared to what they might've expected at a teaching hospital. Sometimes, the consultants came to Rochdale because they couldn't hack it elsewhere (and i use hack advisedly).
So if you want the best for your sick or injured relatives, you need to live somewhere where the clinicians see lots of similar cases to retain their practical skills which they simply wouldn't in a town the size of Rochdale. When the London terrorist incidents occurred the victims stood a far greater chance of survival from stab wounds because the clinicians (both doctors & nurses) in the local A&E had lots of experience in dealing with them
That's the reality. Best wishes for the future |
I understand your argument but we are not talking about tertiary care specialists here where regionalisation is required to support sufficient volume to make procedured safe and effective. Damn good quality secondary care is provided in many other towns of Rochdale's size. I suspect that the reluctance of clinicians to work in Rochdale has more to do with the facilities and support available (or more to the point not available) as a result of managerial decisions to 'run down' local services. They dont have to live there in order to provide care there.
Lets face it Pennine Acute Trust has a well deserved reputation. In the circles I move in I have heard it referred to as the 'killing fields' which is about as insulting as calling the town a 'shithole'.
Getting rid of regional health authorities was a disaster because places that included teaching hospitals/best docs were simply freed up from any responsibility/accountability for areas outside teaching hospitals immediate catchment areas. Places like Rochdale have simply been cast away, forgotten and its population largely left to be sick and die. This is NOT a criticism of the front line workers in the NHS - they are working under different conditions to their colleagues in other locations.
In this day and age of robotics, telemedicine etc there is no excuse for such health care deserts. No reason why those high quality/high volume consultants cannot be required to provide part of their contracted time in local hospitals (called allocating resources in accordance with need - a basic principle of Bevan's NHS, somewhat different to allocating resources in accordance with consultants preferences). | | | |
| Bar access on 17:13 - Aug 16 with 2088 views | D_Alien |
| Bar access on 16:44 - Aug 16 by pioneer |
I understand your argument but we are not talking about tertiary care specialists here where regionalisation is required to support sufficient volume to make procedured safe and effective. Damn good quality secondary care is provided in many other towns of Rochdale's size. I suspect that the reluctance of clinicians to work in Rochdale has more to do with the facilities and support available (or more to the point not available) as a result of managerial decisions to 'run down' local services. They dont have to live there in order to provide care there.
Lets face it Pennine Acute Trust has a well deserved reputation. In the circles I move in I have heard it referred to as the 'killing fields' which is about as insulting as calling the town a 'shithole'.
Getting rid of regional health authorities was a disaster because places that included teaching hospitals/best docs were simply freed up from any responsibility/accountability for areas outside teaching hospitals immediate catchment areas. Places like Rochdale have simply been cast away, forgotten and its population largely left to be sick and die. This is NOT a criticism of the front line workers in the NHS - they are working under different conditions to their colleagues in other locations.
In this day and age of robotics, telemedicine etc there is no excuse for such health care deserts. No reason why those high quality/high volume consultants cannot be required to provide part of their contracted time in local hospitals (called allocating resources in accordance with need - a basic principle of Bevan's NHS, somewhat different to allocating resources in accordance with consultants preferences). |
And absolutely no criticism implied in my post about current NHS staff locally, who do their very best in often difficult circumstances.
Your reference to secondary/tertiary care is a moot point, but has little to do with running down of local facilities
As an example, someone suffering a heart attack would in the past be taken to the local A&E where a bloodclot busting agent was treatment of choice. This was simple enough, and locally we did well in terms of timely delivery of this service. Then medicine moved on. The treatment which superceded it is angioplasty. With the best will in the world, there is no way that every local district hospital could have sufficient specialist facilities to cater for this procedure, therefore ambulances are now directed to take patients to Manchester Royal Infirmary. They're usually transferred back to a more local hospital with 24/48 hours, but the specialist backup facilities required should it go wrong or complications set in simply wouldn't be available 24/7 everywhere, and it's a vain argument to say that it 'should'. There might be one type of complication every month in somewhere like Rochdale, and having a whole team on standby just in case isn't best use of resources, plus the diagnostic skills would wither
I understand your frustration and agree with some of your points, but there are also very good clinical reasons - i.e. in the best interests of patients - why services are concentrated in major centres. Having to travel a greater distance for relatives for a short while is a complete pain, but less painful than visiting the cemetery ad infinitum when it could've been avoided
Apologies if anyone reading this feels affected by the stark descriptions, but this is how it is
[Post edited 16 Aug 2017 17:24]
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| Bar access on 17:14 - Aug 16 with 2080 views | soulboy |
| Bar access on 22:54 - Aug 15 by KenBoon |
Unless Oldham is the mecca of nightlife (certainly it hasn't since the heyday of The Hitman and Her) then no sane person would take a tram from Rochdale to Manchester. Even lazy f**ks like me would walk up the hill and get on the train.
I don't venture into the town centre often as I don't live there anymore, but when I was last there it seemed quiet but much improved. It smelt quite strongly of marijuana too. |
Not very familiar with The Hitman and Her, but for me Oldhams heyday was 1974/75, both Baileys and Cats Whiskers being great clubs  |  | | |
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| Bar access on 17:28 - Aug 16 with 2041 views | mingthemerciless |
| Bar access on 17:13 - Aug 16 by D_Alien |
And absolutely no criticism implied in my post about current NHS staff locally, who do their very best in often difficult circumstances.
Your reference to secondary/tertiary care is a moot point, but has little to do with running down of local facilities
As an example, someone suffering a heart attack would in the past be taken to the local A&E where a bloodclot busting agent was treatment of choice. This was simple enough, and locally we did well in terms of timely delivery of this service. Then medicine moved on. The treatment which superceded it is angioplasty. With the best will in the world, there is no way that every local district hospital could have sufficient specialist facilities to cater for this procedure, therefore ambulances are now directed to take patients to Manchester Royal Infirmary. They're usually transferred back to a more local hospital with 24/48 hours, but the specialist backup facilities required should it go wrong or complications set in simply wouldn't be available 24/7 everywhere, and it's a vain argument to say that it 'should'. There might be one type of complication every month in somewhere like Rochdale, and having a whole team on standby just in case isn't best use of resources, plus the diagnostic skills would wither
I understand your frustration and agree with some of your points, but there are also very good clinical reasons - i.e. in the best interests of patients - why services are concentrated in major centres. Having to travel a greater distance for relatives for a short while is a complete pain, but less painful than visiting the cemetery ad infinitum when it could've been avoided
Apologies if anyone reading this feels affected by the stark descriptions, but this is how it is
[Post edited 16 Aug 2017 17:24]
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Very interesting dialogue between you and Pioneer. Especially as I'm at the age were these issues are becoming more important than they used to be. Thanks to you both. [Post edited 16 Aug 2017 22:22]
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| Bar access on 17:29 - Aug 16 with 2035 views | ColDale |
| Bar access on 17:28 - Aug 16 by mingthemerciless |
Very interesting dialogue between you and Pioneer. Especially as I'm at the age were these issues are becoming more important than they used to be. Thanks to you both. [Post edited 16 Aug 2017 22:22]
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And all because us Sandy Laners couldn't get a bloody pint on Saturday! |  | | |
| Bar access on 17:34 - Aug 16 with 2031 views | pioneer |
| Bar access on 17:13 - Aug 16 by D_Alien |
And absolutely no criticism implied in my post about current NHS staff locally, who do their very best in often difficult circumstances.
Your reference to secondary/tertiary care is a moot point, but has little to do with running down of local facilities
As an example, someone suffering a heart attack would in the past be taken to the local A&E where a bloodclot busting agent was treatment of choice. This was simple enough, and locally we did well in terms of timely delivery of this service. Then medicine moved on. The treatment which superceded it is angioplasty. With the best will in the world, there is no way that every local district hospital could have sufficient specialist facilities to cater for this procedure, therefore ambulances are now directed to take patients to Manchester Royal Infirmary. They're usually transferred back to a more local hospital with 24/48 hours, but the specialist backup facilities required should it go wrong or complications set in simply wouldn't be available 24/7 everywhere, and it's a vain argument to say that it 'should'. There might be one type of complication every month in somewhere like Rochdale, and having a whole team on standby just in case isn't best use of resources, plus the diagnostic skills would wither
I understand your frustration and agree with some of your points, but there are also very good clinical reasons - i.e. in the best interests of patients - why services are concentrated in major centres. Having to travel a greater distance for relatives for a short while is a complete pain, but less painful than visiting the cemetery ad infinitum when it could've been avoided
Apologies if anyone reading this feels affected by the stark descriptions, but this is how it is
[Post edited 16 Aug 2017 17:24]
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I dont think we disagree on the (tertiary care) examples you provide - but I am not talking about heart attacks, angioplasties and the desire of some clinicians to work in medical schools. I am talking about services being provided in Crumpsal, Oldham and B**y. Are you suggesting that they are able to get consultants to work there, but not in Rochdale - now that is a kick in the teeth for the town.
There is no evidence to suggest 2 hour public transport commutes to visit patients 'condemned' in Crumpsal are rewarded with higher quality care . . . quite the opposite if you look at the Quality Commission reports on Crumpsal Hospital. In the case of my relative it came together with those 'visits to the cemetery ad infinitum'.
The people of Rochdale are being badly let down by the NHS (and I suspect other public services). | | | |
| Bar access on 17:52 - Aug 16 with 1991 views | Shun |
To add to D_Alien's points, taking services away from some hospitals has allowed other hospitals to be able to specialise in certain areas. For example, Fairfield Hospital is currently number one in the UK for treating strokes, and has been for the past 5 years. So we literally live in the best part of the country if you have a stroke (bearing in mind Fairfield's proximity to Rochdale). That kind of excellence simply wouldn't happen if every hospital in the area had a stroke ward. |  | | |
| Bar access on 17:59 - Aug 16 with 1972 views | mingthemerciless |
My GP told me that his practice is finding it hard to attract new GP's to the town. He reckons the national reputation of the town puts people off. | | | |
| Bar access on 18:02 - Aug 16 with 1964 views | mingthemerciless |
| Bar access on 17:29 - Aug 16 by ColDale |
And all because us Sandy Laners couldn't get a bloody pint on Saturday! |
I saw my first match at Spotland in 1962. I've lost count of the football and rugby matches I've been to since then. I like a pint after the game but in all that time I've never had a pint at half time. It's too much of a rush for me. [Post edited 16 Aug 2017 18:03]
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| Bar access on 18:22 - Aug 16 with 1926 views | MoonyDale |
| Bar access on 17:59 - Aug 16 by mingthemerciless |
My GP told me that his practice is finding it hard to attract new GP's to the town. He reckons the national reputation of the town puts people off. |
On the subject of GP's and the lack of them, I have various medical issues and the last appointment I made to see mine resulted in a 6 week wait to see my own GP....6 weeks ffs, I was able to attend the walk in center but what about those who can't ? Sounds like it's just as difficult getting a pint in the Sandy........ |  |
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| Bar access on 18:22 - Aug 16 with 1924 views | James1980 |
| Bar access on 13:08 - Aug 16 by TVOS1907 |
So where is your friend from? |
South London by birth but has relatives and friends from the Greater Manchester area | |
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| Bar access on 18:24 - Aug 16 with 1920 views | Shun |
| Bar access on 17:59 - Aug 16 by mingthemerciless |
My GP told me that his practice is finding it hard to attract new GP's to the town. He reckons the national reputation of the town puts people off. |
Absolutely. I mentioned this a few years ago on here, that there was becoming a genuine shortage of GPs, not just locally but nationally. It's becoming a media issue now too. A lot of surgeries are replacing them with Advanced Nurse Practitioners. | | | |
| Bar access on 19:21 - Aug 16 with 1844 views | 49thseason |
| Bar access on 18:24 - Aug 16 by Shun |
Absolutely. I mentioned this a few years ago on here, that there was becoming a genuine shortage of GPs, not just locally but nationally. It's becoming a media issue now too. A lot of surgeries are replacing them with Advanced Nurse Practitioners. |
You can get a 20 minute appointmet to see a gp at Highfield for £70.00 or there are apps like Babylon which charge £25 for a one-off appointment or you can have unlimited appointments for a £5 a month subscription.
I hate going to see my GP (even if I can get an appointment before the problem sorts itself out). The receptionists are generally uncommunicative and occasionally downright rude. I say generally because they change every time I go. The waiting for your "turn" bears no apparent relationship to the appointment time you were given and inevitably "Dr Watsit is out, will you see Dr Thingy instead"? Seeing Dr Thingy then involves a one finger rumage through the computer which is always "very slow today" and results in a laughable instruction to "pop back in a couple of weeks " oblivious to the fact that there are no appointments for a month at least. At this point, paying seventy quid to see a pleasant GP with time for a chat in a clean environment that actually runs to time, offers you a coffee and generally treats you like a valued customer looks like a good investment. |  | | |
| Bar access on 19:46 - Aug 16 with 1787 views | SuddenLad |
| Bar access on 18:22 - Aug 16 by MoonyDale |
On the subject of GP's and the lack of them, I have various medical issues and the last appointment I made to see mine resulted in a 6 week wait to see my own GP....6 weeks ffs, I was able to attend the walk in center but what about those who can't ? Sounds like it's just as difficult getting a pint in the Sandy........ |
In defence of GP surgeries, I have been a patient with the same Rochdale based practice since childhood. I can (and do) ring the surgery and arrange an appointment with any of the 3 GP's to be seen within 24 hours, and on most occasions for later the same day.
I hear stories about people having to wait over 72 hours to see their GP. That has never, ever happened to me (or my immediate family) in all our experience with the surgery. |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Bar access on 20:02 - Aug 16 with 1760 views | pioneer |
| Bar access on 18:22 - Aug 16 by MoonyDale |
On the subject of GP's and the lack of them, I have various medical issues and the last appointment I made to see mine resulted in a 6 week wait to see my own GP....6 weeks ffs, I was able to attend the walk in center but what about those who can't ? Sounds like it's just as difficult getting a pint in the Sandy........ |
I think its less a problem of shortage of GPs and more a problem of shortage of GP time. Tony Blair gave them a licence to print money, in effect, so they tended to 'adjust their work-life balance' so to speak.
There is a simple assumption that if you pay people more they will work more. Sadly its wrong! In economics there is what is called a 'backward bending supply curve' - where people who are already well paid, faced with an increase in rate of pay can work less and still make more money.
Its not only the UK NHS that has made this mistake. | | | |
| Bar access on 20:39 - Aug 16 with 1706 views | TVOS1907 |
| Bar access on 18:22 - Aug 16 by James1980 |
South London by birth but has relatives and friends from the Greater Manchester area |
Ah, right. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Bar access on 20:44 - Aug 16 with 1692 views | Shun |
| Bar access on 20:02 - Aug 16 by pioneer |
I think its less a problem of shortage of GPs and more a problem of shortage of GP time. Tony Blair gave them a licence to print money, in effect, so they tended to 'adjust their work-life balance' so to speak.
There is a simple assumption that if you pay people more they will work more. Sadly its wrong! In economics there is what is called a 'backward bending supply curve' - where people who are already well paid, faced with an increase in rate of pay can work less and still make more money.
Its not only the UK NHS that has made this mistake. |
Unfortunately, it very much is a problem of a shortage of GPs. I spoke of it years ago and it's become worse now. | | | |
| Bar access on 21:10 - Aug 16 with 1659 views | kiwidale |
| Bar access on 17:28 - Aug 16 by mingthemerciless |
Very interesting dialogue between you and Pioneer. Especially as I'm at the age were these issues are becoming more important than they used to be. Thanks to you both. [Post edited 16 Aug 2017 22:22]
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Agreed its been informative and opened my eyes, both have articulated their opinions well without any insults. I cant see that setting at trend on here anytime soon. [Post edited 16 Aug 2017 21:17]
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| This is not the time for bickering.
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| Bar access on 22:49 - Aug 16 with 1565 views | rochdaleriddler |
| Bar access on 17:52 - Aug 16 by Shun |
To add to D_Alien's points, taking services away from some hospitals has allowed other hospitals to be able to specialise in certain areas. For example, Fairfield Hospital is currently number one in the UK for treating strokes, and has been for the past 5 years. So we literally live in the best part of the country if you have a stroke (bearing in mind Fairfield's proximity to Rochdale). That kind of excellence simply wouldn't happen if every hospital in the area had a stroke ward. |
It's crap for a lot of other things | |
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| Bar access on 23:08 - Aug 16 with 1546 views | downunder |
| Bar access on 17:14 - Aug 16 by soulboy |
Not very familiar with The Hitman and Her, but for me Oldhams heyday was 1974/75, both Baileys and Cats Whiskers being great clubs |
Oldham was a great night out just for the pubs. OB was a great pint. |  | | |
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