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Same old England 13:31 - Nov 20 with 12992 views

How have England got such an easy draw on paper yet again in this World Cup ?

Before looking at the draw I thought they won't get past both Brazil and Argentina but it looks likely that Brazil and Argentina are going to be in a different half of the draw and destined to play each other in the semis, so any potential winner from the other half won't have to play the both of them (unless one of Brazil/Argentina don't win their group and perhaps they would be not that good anyway in that scenario).

Brazil might be deemed to be better overhaul than Argentina but possibly not head to head versus Argentina (didn't Argentina beat Brazil in the last Copa America ) so if Argentina get past Brazil in the semis then there is as much chance of an Argentina v England as there is of any other possible finals.

Iran, USA and Wales in the group for one of the 'big teams' in the form of England means they couldn't ask for better draw than that, then the possible easiest last 16 tie for them (possibly Senegal from Africa) then a potential Quarter final against France, France seem to be on the way down they lost 2-0 to Denmark last time out, they have injuries to their top players like Benzema and Pogba then England would have on paper a possible semi final against ageing Belgium.

England couldn't hand pick a better draw if they tried.

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Same old England on 21:44 - Nov 29 with 1320 views

trampie

Same old England on 21:38 - Nov 29 by Togg
Really does it mean that much to you. Personally I don't give a flying fig! Far more important things to worry and obsess about.

I'm a football fan and therefore these things don't go unnoticed.

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Same old England on 21:48 - Nov 29 with 1295 views

Togg

Same old England on 21:44 - Nov 29 by trampie
I'm a football fan and therefore these things don't go unnoticed.

Nothing to do with football mate your views on everything England and the English is totally bigoted, xenophobia and borderline racist. I wonder sometimes if you are on a wind up.

Same old England on 21:52 - Nov 29 with 1275 views

trampie

Facts are facts, easy draws and luck in running is what it is.

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Same old England on 22:41 - Nov 29 with 1227 views

Sirjohnalot

Same old England on 21:52 - Nov 29 by trampie
Facts are facts, easy draws and luck in running is what it is.

The FIFA that gave England an easy draw are the same ones who wouldn’t let their captain wear the armband he wanted.

England are a quality side with young, decent player who seem like really good blokes. Not sure what the problem is

Same old England on 23:15 - Nov 29 with 1190 views

trampie

Same old England on 22:41 - Nov 29 by Sirjohnalot
The FIFA that gave England an easy draw are the same ones who wouldn’t let their captain wear the armband he wanted. England are a quality side with young, decent player who seem like really good blokes. Not sure what the problem is

And your point is caller ?

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Same old England on 23:50 - Nov 29 with 1156 views

Dr_Parnassus

Wasn’t England’s group the hardest in the competition then?

All 4 teams ranked in the top 20.

The average ranking of the teams in this group was 15th.

I’ll compare to the rest now, haven’t busted a myth in a while.

Group A
Netherlands (8th)
Ecuador (44th)
Qatar (50th)
Senegal (18th)

Average ranking: 30th
Average ranking of Seed 1 opponents: 37th

Group B
England (5th)
USA (16th)
Iran (20th)
Wales (19th)

Average ranking: 15th
Average ranking of Seed 1 opponents: 18th

Group C
Poland (26th)
Argentina (3rd)
Saudi Arabia (51st)
Mexico (13th)

Average ranking: 23rd
Average ranking of Seed 1 opponents: 30th

Group D
France (4th)
Tunisia (30th)
Australia (38th)
Denmark (10th)

Average ranking: 20th
Average ranking of Seed 1 opponents: 36th

Group E
Spain (7th)
Costa Rica (31st)
Germany (11th)
Japan (24th)

Average ranking: 18th
Average ranking of Seed 1 opponents: 22nd

Group F
Croatia (12th)
Belgium (2nd)
Morocco (22nd)
Canada (41st)

Average ranking: 19th
Average ranking of Seed 1 opponents: 25th

Group G
Brazil (1st)
Switzerland (15th)
Cameroon (43rd)
Serbia (21st)

Average ranking: 20th
Average ranking of Seed 1 opponents: 26th

Group H
Portugal (9th)
Ghana (61st)
South Korea (28th)
Uruguay (14th)

Average ranking: 28th
Average ranking of Seed 1 opponents: 34th

Officially the hardest group.

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Same old England on 06:27 - Nov 30 with 1118 views

TenbySwan

Foden clearly dived for the free kick,

But Danny Ward!!!!

Same old England on 08:08 - Nov 30 with 1092 views

jack247

Same old England on 23:50 - Nov 29 by Dr_Parnassus

As the bottom seeded team, which we were, I can’t see a group I’d have swapped us into and their fourth seeded team out.

I think they don’t allow more than 2 European teams in a group, which I’m obviously ignoring here.

That wasn’t a winnable group, but there aren’t many better combinations of second and third ranked teams than USA and Iran.

Page has to carry the can unfortunately. He got the credit when it was deserved. Bale is a special case, because he can win a game out of nowhere, but if we’re carrying him, we can’t carry Ramsey too.

Same old England on 08:14 - Nov 30 with 1089 views

raynor94

Same old Trampie, always getting it wrong

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Same old England on 08:30 - Nov 30 with 1081 views

Dr_Parnassus

Same old England on 08:08 - Nov 30 by jack247

No group was winnable for us, look at the top seeds in them all. No chance we were getting through regardless of what group we were in.

But for England, 3 opponents inside the top 20 is probably as tough as it gets in a World Cup draw. All were capable of taking something off them.

Anyone suggesting it was an easy group have a very loose grasp on the truth or little knowledge of the game outside of Europe. Iran and USA have been among the most improved sides in recent years surging into the top 20.

Iran had lost something like 2 of their last 18 games before the World Cup and facing some excellent opposition and USA have the ability to beat anyone in world football.

Give me a group with Qatar or Costa Rica in any day, we may actually win a game then.

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Same old England on 10:55 - Nov 30 with 1030 views

trampie

England is not Wales, from England's perspective being one of the big boys in football terms (perhaps I should say underachieving big boys) not getting out of the group would be failure, what counts as a good draw for England is not just the group they find themselves in but probable knockout opponents and they could not ask for better.

As regards rankings does it matter or should it matter who England draw from pots 3 and 4, the team they drew from pot 2 was one of the weakest of the lot.
FIFA rankings have historically not been as good as ELO rankings so FIFA have tried to introduce more of an ELO rankings element into their system, all the same ELO ranks Wales and USA worse than what FIFA does, ELO ranks groups G, F and E as stronger than England's group, the bookmakers if you count the favourites as 1 and second favourite as 2 etc etc agree that group G is the strongest and group E being stronger with England and Wales group B one of the weakest.
Group G is Brazil, Serbia, Switzerland and Cameroon and Group E is Spain, Germany, Japan with Costa Rica.
Personally I would say there is more strength in depth in Group H in Portugal, Uruguay, Ghana and South Korea than in England/Wales group.

Luckily for England, Brazil and Spain are due to meet in the quarters, then if Argentina make it after their hiccup it could be Brazil against Argentina in the semi final with Netherlands and Uruguay also in that half.
England are looking at Senegal (possibly the weakest last 16 opponent), a depleted France in the quarters and then on paper an aging Belgium or an aging Portugal in the semis, although in fairness nobody fancies Belgium at all.

[Post edited 30 Nov 2022 11:40]

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Same old England on 11:47 - Nov 30 with 999 views

STID2017

Same old England on 10:55 - Nov 30 by trampie

[Post edited 30 Nov 2022 11:40]

Every cup competition has so-called easy teams
If England ( or any other country ) are to win it then they need to face and beat some of the "favourites" .
Whether they face France, Belgium, Portugal, Brazil, Germany or Uruguay or whoever, there will be no easy games and all the opposition have to be beaten.
As Brian Clough said "On paper we should win. Trouble is, the game is played on grass" ( excuse a possible slight misquote )

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Same old England on 12:39 - Nov 30 with 973 views

trampie

Same old England on 11:47 - Nov 30 by STID2017

Not necessarily, 2021 women's US open tennis.

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Same old England on 13:43 - Nov 30 with 942 views

raynor94

Same old England on 10:55 - Nov 30 by trampie

[Post edited 30 Nov 2022 11:40]

Put the spade down, the Dr has left you looking a fool again

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Same old England on 14:06 - Nov 30 with 925 views

trampie

Same old England on 08:08 - Nov 30 by jack247

Yes Wales was in the easiest group (leaving aside having to play a Persian Gulf team in the Persian Gulf in the midday sun).

Wales was only in pot 4 because of the Ukraine war and we would only have missed out on pot 2 by 1 place if it wasn't for the war causing us to qualify late through no fault of our own.

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Same old England on 15:51 - Nov 30 with 892 views

Dr_Parnassus

Same old England on 13:43 - Nov 30 by raynor94
Put the spade down, the Dr has left you looking a fool again

Wasn’t difficult, a very rookie error made by many people who have limited footballing knowledge and trying to cover it up with nonsense.

After the England v Iran game, there were a load of comments on here disrespecting them as opposed to acknowledging the excellent English performance.

I said that we would have a hard time against them and that they are a good side, probably better than us. People underestimate Middle Eastern and African sides because they rarely see them, it’s simply laziness.

I can’t think of too many groups over the years with ALL teams in the top 20 FIFA rankings.

Having said that, our effort was embarrassing. A farewell tour for Ramsey and Bale rather than a serious attempt to progress.

Everything felt a little forced in the build up, even down to the Sheen speeches that he wheeled out time and time again. The Yma O Hyd song. Seemed to be forced/contrived identity and pride where as at the Euros it all fell into place naturally.

It felt fake this time round. Trying too hard to recreate what we once had - football seemed to come a very distant second in that focus.

[Post edited 30 Nov 2022 15:56]

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Same old England on 16:00 - Nov 30 with 870 views

trampie

Same old England on 22:41 - Nov 29 by Sirjohnalot
The FIFA that gave England an easy draw are the same ones who wouldn’t let their captain wear the armband he wanted. England are a quality side with young, decent player who seem like really good blokes. Not sure what the problem is

Mason Greenwood and Phil Foden ?

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Same old England on 16:20 - Nov 30 with 853 views

onehunglow

Same old England on 08:30 - Nov 30 by Dr_Parnassus

I wouldn’t have been confident anyway
We were confident of beatingbIran,took them for granted and got smacked

Page is another clown who got lucky by default into a big job

That said, he picked Joe to go when still unfit and risking his heath in doing so.

We have no class keep, a shocking porous defence ,non existent midfield and no quality strikers

We’d have a good chance against Faroe Islands as long as they didn’t choose from all of them.

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Same old England on 16:48 - Nov 30 with 832 views

raynor94

Same old England on 16:00 - Nov 30 by trampie
Mason Greenwood and Phil Foden ?

Greenwood had 1 cap before his arrest, will never play for England again.

Foden?

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Same old England on 16:56 - Nov 30 with 830 views

onehunglow

Same old England on 16:00 - Nov 30 by trampie
Mason Greenwood and Phil Foden ?

Phil Foden, a talent we do not possess
Put the hate speech to be ffs

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Same old England on 17:32 - Nov 30 with 813 views

trampie

Is Foden finally first choice for his club these days ?

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Same old England on 17:40 - Nov 30 with 801 views

trampie

So teams in England's way to the final the way it's shaping up is Senegal already lost a match, France already lost a match, Belgium (on ranking) already lost a match, their place might be taken by Morocco.
Morocco or Portugal v England in a semi final I wonder, assuming England beat Sengal and France both missing quite a few of their better players.

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Same old England on 17:51 - Nov 30 with 792 views

raynor94

Same old England on 17:32 - Nov 30 by trampie
Is Foden finally first choice for his club these days ?

Come on Tramps, dish the dirt on Foden, because that was what you were insinuating

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Same old England on 17:59 - Nov 30 with 775 views

trampie

I just remember some of the sent home in disgrace headlines, can't be arsed to check the finer details.

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Same old England on 18:04 - Nov 30 with 770 views

raynor94

Same old England on 17:59 - Nov 30 by trampie
I just remember some of the sent home in disgrace headlines, can't be arsed to check the finer details.

Typical old guff from you, oh and I did check on Foden, 54 goals from 114 appearances, not bad for a 22 year old, a bit better than Dan James

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