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I don’t believe my views are negative or positive. They are realistic.
Season ticket holder for a decade, now live on the other side of the world. Probably seen more Swans matches both home and away than you have had hot dinners.
I would question maybe there is a link between football knowledge (or lack of) and someone seeing reality as “negative”. Can you tell me a bit about your footballing knowledge and expertise? From what you have contributed so far it doesn’t look extensive, so just wondering if there is a link there.
Thanks.
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
Negative views and match attendance on 00:20 - Sep 13 by Dr_Parnassus
What a strange question.
I don’t believe my views are negative or positive. They are realistic.
Season ticket holder for a decade, now live on the other side of the world. Probably seen more Swans matches both home and away than you have had hot dinners.
I would question maybe there is a link between football knowledge (or lack of) and someone seeing reality as “negative”. Can you tell me a bit about your footballing knowledge and expertise? From what you have contributed so far it doesn’t look extensive, so just wondering if there is a link there.
Thanks.
So never attend any Swans matches. Thanks. 4 more to reply. Just curious if there is a pattern.
It's not a competition for best Swans supporter. As I have said, I rarely attend away matches anymore. There are far more enthusiastic fans who attend all away matches than me.
If you have seen more Swans matches than me, then well done you. I admit to missing 2 home league matches in the last 25 years. Work commitments.
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Negative views and match attendance on 00:54 - Sep 13 with 2150 views
Negative views and match attendance on 00:46 - Sep 13 by WalterBoyd
So never attend any Swans matches. Thanks. 4 more to reply. Just curious if there is a pattern.
It's not a competition for best Swans supporter. As I have said, I rarely attend away matches anymore. There are far more enthusiastic fans who attend all away matches than me.
If you have seen more Swans matches than me, then well done you. I admit to missing 2 home league matches in the last 25 years. Work commitments.
So how does season ticket holder for a decade and probably seen more matches home and away than you have had hot dinners - get translated to; “never attend any matches” then?
That’s patently incorrect.
I would absolutely say I have seen more Swansea matches than you then. I have been to nearly every single away ground.
Shame you can’t formulate any footballing opinions then considering you have seen so many home matches. You would have thought that it would have given you the confidence in yourself to state them, you know, as opposed to making up stupid points about “match attendance” as opposed to combating any points made.
See me. Must try harder. C-
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 0:57]
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
Negative views and match attendance on 00:54 - Sep 13 by Dr_Parnassus
So how does season ticket holder for a decade and probably seen more matches home and away than you have had hot dinners - get translated to; “never attend any matches” then?
That’s patently incorrect.
I would absolutely say I have seen more Swansea matches than you then. I have been to nearly every single away ground.
Shame you can’t formulate any footballing opinions then considering you have seen so many home matches. You would have thought that it would have given you the confidence in yourself to state them, you know, as opposed to making up stupid points about “match attendance” as opposed to combating any points made.
See me. Must try harder. C-
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 0:57]
Who said I haven't been to every away ground ?
You keep making up answers to questions never asked.
5 posters, very negative, are commenting on recent matches. That is fine.
You have made it clear you dont attend any.
One poster yesterday was having a rant about the manager and team, did not watch the game, did not know the score. Thought we had lost.
It's very funny. Carry on.
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Negative views and match attendance on 01:16 - Sep 13 with 2134 views
Negative views and match attendance on 01:13 - Sep 13 by WalterBoyd
Who said I haven't been to every away ground ?
You keep making up answers to questions never asked.
5 posters, very negative, are commenting on recent matches. That is fine.
You have made it clear you dont attend any.
One poster yesterday was having a rant about the manager and team, did not watch the game, did not know the score. Thought we had lost.
It's very funny. Carry on.
I say. I don’t think you watch many at all, which is why you have such little football knowledge in your posts. I believe you are a forum troll.
How have I made it clear I never attend any? You have yet again made a complete fool of yourself by failing to understand what people write.
You claim to go to all the home matches (bar two) but can’t string a coherent footballing related sentence together and fail to combat any points you claim to disagree with.
You are overtired. Go to bed.
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 8:11]
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
Negative views and match attendance on 00:20 - Sep 13 by Dr_Parnassus
What a strange question.
I don’t believe my views are negative or positive. They are realistic.
Season ticket holder for a decade, now live on the other side of the world. Probably seen more Swans matches both home and away than you have had hot dinners.
I would question maybe there is a link between football knowledge (or lack of) and someone seeing reality as “negative”. Can you tell me a bit about your footballing knowledge and expertise? From what you have contributed so far it doesn’t look extensive, so just wondering if there is a link there.
Thanks.
What a silly thing to say, how can you possibly know how many games another supporter has been to?
As for reality, well you have your version of reality but reality isn't often neutral, it's positive or negative the majority of the time and some of your views are definitely negative. On the other hand you were very positive about Cooper. Myself, I am being positive about the current situation whereas I eventually turned negative towards Cooper.
Ho many games do you think I have seen? Do you think you seen more home and away than I? How many do you think you've seen. I have been a season ticket holder longer than you, does that mean I know more than you?
Football knowledge, you have an opinion but despite your own view of your own opinion, many disagree. To start with, Liverpool beat Leeds yesterday, that's the reality, to Liverpool fans that's a positive, to Leeds negative though both sets of fans may have contrasting opinions about various parts of the game, for example, Elliots injury is a reality and will be a negative to Liverpool. I notice your old habit for denigrating another posters is still there, "doesn't look extensive" is simply your opinion and others may disagree.
A reality about football opinions is, we could have several posts with different opinions on a subject and we could all be wrong or all be right and it's possible the manager does something different to all those opinions so we never know. Even the acknowledged experts sometimes admit they don't know it all, I've even seen Lineker hold his hands up and say' what do I know' after getting something wrong.
Negative views and match attendance on 09:08 - Sep 13 by Catullus
What a silly thing to say, how can you possibly know how many games another supporter has been to?
As for reality, well you have your version of reality but reality isn't often neutral, it's positive or negative the majority of the time and some of your views are definitely negative. On the other hand you were very positive about Cooper. Myself, I am being positive about the current situation whereas I eventually turned negative towards Cooper.
Ho many games do you think I have seen? Do you think you seen more home and away than I? How many do you think you've seen. I have been a season ticket holder longer than you, does that mean I know more than you?
Football knowledge, you have an opinion but despite your own view of your own opinion, many disagree. To start with, Liverpool beat Leeds yesterday, that's the reality, to Liverpool fans that's a positive, to Leeds negative though both sets of fans may have contrasting opinions about various parts of the game, for example, Elliots injury is a reality and will be a negative to Liverpool. I notice your old habit for denigrating another posters is still there, "doesn't look extensive" is simply your opinion and others may disagree.
A reality about football opinions is, we could have several posts with different opinions on a subject and we could all be wrong or all be right and it's possible the manager does something different to all those opinions so we never know. Even the acknowledged experts sometimes admit they don't know it all, I've even seen Lineker hold his hands up and say' what do I know' after getting something wrong.
It's not silly in the slightest, if someone (who claims to be a new poster) signs up to the forum and spends his time trolling individuals rather than talking about football, I would say its a safe bet they don't watch too many games.
There is no version of reality, the reality I post is based on facts and common sense, you know this by now. I was not 'positive' about Cooper, we were 4th, my views aligned with that fact. I'm not negative about Martin, we are 21st and my views align with that fact too.
I have no idea how many games you have seen. As much as I disagree with an awful lot of what you say, you at least offer footballing opinion rather than spending your time looking for attention. So I am happy to give you the benefit of the doubt.
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
An interesting thread , hopefully not to be derailed by "my dads bigger than your syndrome" IMO watching it live at the game creates a bigger picture of movement off the ball, who's' willing to make the runs into the channel ( something which Liard did plenty of for example ) The cameras tend to follow the ball which can lead to a tunnel view of the game and not who's jogging back for example or creating space .We all have opinions but none have nothing to do with how many games you watch its how you absorb the information provided.
"In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master."
Negative views and match attendance on 09:40 - Sep 13 by Boundy
An interesting thread , hopefully not to be derailed by "my dads bigger than your syndrome" IMO watching it live at the game creates a bigger picture of movement off the ball, who's' willing to make the runs into the channel ( something which Liard did plenty of for example ) The cameras tend to follow the ball which can lead to a tunnel view of the game and not who's jogging back for example or creating space .We all have opinions but none have nothing to do with how many games you watch its how you absorb the information provided.
Couldn’t disagree more. It’s a complete myth usually peddled on football forums to avoid awkward points regarding the game. It’s an easy “out” for someone to claim that the points are not valid because you saw it through a camera rather than a plastic seat.
Typical angle of a televised game:-
I would say without fail, every game I go to, someone I am with will ask “who scored that”?, “That was a foul wasn’t it?”, “Surely that was offside, no?”, “who passed that?”, ''was that deflected?'' Etc etc etc
I have never ever been asked that question in a televised game with all the angles and all the replays. Just doesn’t happen.
How many times have you seen something you swear blind is a penalty until you re-watch it at home and realise it wasn't? Anyone who says that hasn't happened to them is lying.
The amount of times I have had to rewatch games I have recorded to show one of my mates that they didn’t see what they claimed it’s unbelievable. I would say every single game that can be recorded had to be rewatched for some reason or another.
People often see what they want to see rather than what actually happened. The examples on here are endless, from season ticket holders sat in their seat. I have had to show them that they didn’t see that as they insist I’m wrong.
The television cameras are designed to fit the action zones in, often pretty much all active players will be visible such as the example above. The notion that it follows the ball isn’t true, they are pivot cameras that follow action regardless of where the ball is. If there is a scuffle they will show that on wide zoom giving you are far better view than anyone in the stadium, to a point you can literally lip read in slow motion what players are saying.
One of the first follow up training sessions after a match will be a review of the match, televised. Often to highlight things missed at ground level. A lot of clubs have their own personal cameraman to take advantage of the benefits that come with the footage.
I will never agree with anyone that claims games cannot be accurately assessed through coverage. To me it will always be nonsense, designed to discredit awkward views that cannot be reasoned with by common sense.
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 10:02]
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
Negative views and match attendance on 09:40 - Sep 13 by Boundy
An interesting thread , hopefully not to be derailed by "my dads bigger than your syndrome" IMO watching it live at the game creates a bigger picture of movement off the ball, who's' willing to make the runs into the channel ( something which Liard did plenty of for example ) The cameras tend to follow the ball which can lead to a tunnel view of the game and not who's jogging back for example or creating space .We all have opinions but none have nothing to do with how many games you watch its how you absorb the information provided.
I think that's the point the OP is making, being physically in the stadium you can see the bigger picture.
Most of us who were there seemed to be more positive after the game because the performance was obviously better.
Dr P is wrapped up in stats and our league position, he can't see we're moving in the right direction, all he can see is the result and the league position.
BTW the way Dr P, 'giving you the benefit of the doubt'...how very magnanimous of you!
My view of the game was this, many of us can see the positive steps but we don't think, well we know that there is still plenty to be done. On field relationships need to form. We need to learn how each other move and what runs our forwards make. We need to speed up the passing a tad and be braver again with the forward passes. We had plenty of shots but we need to improve the shooting positions which means speeding up movement too but it will hopefully all come, before November would be great thank you Russell!
The absolute reality is that we made so many changes that getting good results straight away would have been miraculous! As long as we keep improving though, it won't be long before the wins start adding up. I'm pretty confident of a mid table finish.
Negative views and match attendance on 10:01 - Sep 13 by Catullus
I think that's the point the OP is making, being physically in the stadium you can see the bigger picture.
Most of us who were there seemed to be more positive after the game because the performance was obviously better.
Dr P is wrapped up in stats and our league position, he can't see we're moving in the right direction, all he can see is the result and the league position.
BTW the way Dr P, 'giving you the benefit of the doubt'...how very magnanimous of you!
My view of the game was this, many of us can see the positive steps but we don't think, well we know that there is still plenty to be done. On field relationships need to form. We need to learn how each other move and what runs our forwards make. We need to speed up the passing a tad and be braver again with the forward passes. We had plenty of shots but we need to improve the shooting positions which means speeding up movement too but it will hopefully all come, before November would be great thank you Russell!
The absolute reality is that we made so many changes that getting good results straight away would have been miraculous! As long as we keep improving though, it won't be long before the wins start adding up. I'm pretty confident of a mid table finish.
Don't be so ludicrous.
Stats support what I see, not the other way around. The fact that my views are backed up by the factual statistics are a total endorsement of my ability to read a game via coverage. Anyone who suggests my opinion is formed from stats and league position is severely misunderstanding my posts.... which wouldn't shock me.
It is confirmation, not a source.
Why would getting decent results be miraculous? I will give you an example.
Cooper changed the style completely from Potter. He had to teach that to all the players, new and old.
He lost Mcburnie, James, Fer, and Borja and was given 500k to replace them. We got 16 points from 18 games. Wonderful return and a successful implementation of the style.
We don't need to emulate that return of course, but some form that would align with a mid table finish is the minimum that should be expected. Yet we have 5 points from 6 games and looked absolutely rudderless in most of them.
So new style, new players, new manager, lost key players in 2018.... the difference between acceptable results there and needing months on end before showing them here is what? What excuse is left? pre season?
Would spending 10 times as much this season as that one make up for it?
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 10:15]
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
I am curious Walt as to just who you are. Are you a PS former stalwart sent over to carry on old spats. You ve called out some of the most interesting posters,the ones people like you always reply to even though you hate what they post.
I was told Dwight was ….as for AC ,no idea but they are interesting posters who do not ,as you do,seek to get personal
Interesting OP I would like to know how you define a negative poster? Is it anyone who has not joined the band of happy clappers who are convinced now we have a new manager all is well and hunky dory . IS it anyine whi questions if things have actually improved? LAst season you could say the majority of posters were negative as there were always many on here decrying the "quality " of football , the managers tactics , choice and ignoring of players, lack of goals,yet this season anyone who dares to do the same is deemed negative.
I was amused reading the matchday thread and it is mentioned here how watching games on the tv doesnt give the same perspective as bein gin the ground...yet for all of last season ( playoff games exclded) all of us watched games only via a screen yet created myths and views on the stylr of play and what was happening yet now annyone who was not actually at the game and watched via screen is not seeing all tha is happeneing. and so cannot appreciate what is going on....funny how last season that was ok?
Each individual is entitiled to their own opinion we will not always agree but I cannot believe the hypocrosiy that exists......I know I will get accused of being a Cooper fan boy....Im not related nor do I have a crush for me it is the "crap" and myths created and then when you sit back and see what is happening now ....Cooper was much maligned for not playing Whittaker ....yet Martin doesnt even put him on the bench despite him getting a hat trick .....no brickbats.... As I said it is the hypocrisy and prdeujice that I dislike. I wish MArtin well I hope he succeeds then my beloved Swans will once again be flying ...IT is early days and we are going through a "revolution" but soon that period of grace will have to end. Football fans suffer often from a lack of perspective and it seems many of our fanbase have been suffering for m this since relegation. I watch the Swans to see us win , I also like good football and I would not turn up week after week to watch our cousins up the road play as they do.....But I will not be ahppy to endure moths of what we witnessed on Saturday against a very poor Hull side....we saw against Stoke what a team who will use the high press can do to us. For all our possesion we only mustered 4 shots on target And by the way I do watch at the stadium season ticket holder of many years....and a Northbank regular in the Vetch days I intended to stay away untill aleasr 10 games in but lets look at some stats
LAst season apparantly we played dull defensive football wellin the first 6 games we had an average of 55% possesion an average of 11 shots per game with and average of 4 shots on target per game with a total of 7 goals averaging at 1.16 goals per game COmpare that with this season where we noe play attacking possesion football yet with an average of 64% possession ( +9%) we only have averaged 9 shots per game (18% less) with an average of 3 being on target (25% less) and only 5 goals scored an average of 0.83 per game yet it is alledged we are a moke attractive attacking force. We pass the ball a lot but mostly sideways and back.... So call me negative....the stats reflect what I saw Saturday and in the match day threads people were blaming the ref as we hould have had penalties and more free kicks...our style and possesion should generate resuls....as performances go it want great and beleive me being in the stadium it makles things 10 times better but I am sure if this had been last season and we were watchin ghte game at home on tv many of our opinions would not be as positive as they are!!!
Negative views and match attendance on 13:37 - Sep 13 by vetchonian
Interesting OP I would like to know how you define a negative poster? Is it anyone who has not joined the band of happy clappers who are convinced now we have a new manager all is well and hunky dory . IS it anyine whi questions if things have actually improved? LAst season you could say the majority of posters were negative as there were always many on here decrying the "quality " of football , the managers tactics , choice and ignoring of players, lack of goals,yet this season anyone who dares to do the same is deemed negative.
I was amused reading the matchday thread and it is mentioned here how watching games on the tv doesnt give the same perspective as bein gin the ground...yet for all of last season ( playoff games exclded) all of us watched games only via a screen yet created myths and views on the stylr of play and what was happening yet now annyone who was not actually at the game and watched via screen is not seeing all tha is happeneing. and so cannot appreciate what is going on....funny how last season that was ok?
Each individual is entitiled to their own opinion we will not always agree but I cannot believe the hypocrosiy that exists......I know I will get accused of being a Cooper fan boy....Im not related nor do I have a crush for me it is the "crap" and myths created and then when you sit back and see what is happening now ....Cooper was much maligned for not playing Whittaker ....yet Martin doesnt even put him on the bench despite him getting a hat trick .....no brickbats.... As I said it is the hypocrisy and prdeujice that I dislike. I wish MArtin well I hope he succeeds then my beloved Swans will once again be flying ...IT is early days and we are going through a "revolution" but soon that period of grace will have to end. Football fans suffer often from a lack of perspective and it seems many of our fanbase have been suffering for m this since relegation. I watch the Swans to see us win , I also like good football and I would not turn up week after week to watch our cousins up the road play as they do.....But I will not be ahppy to endure moths of what we witnessed on Saturday against a very poor Hull side....we saw against Stoke what a team who will use the high press can do to us. For all our possesion we only mustered 4 shots on target And by the way I do watch at the stadium season ticket holder of many years....and a Northbank regular in the Vetch days I intended to stay away untill aleasr 10 games in but lets look at some stats
LAst season apparantly we played dull defensive football wellin the first 6 games we had an average of 55% possesion an average of 11 shots per game with and average of 4 shots on target per game with a total of 7 goals averaging at 1.16 goals per game COmpare that with this season where we noe play attacking possesion football yet with an average of 64% possession ( +9%) we only have averaged 9 shots per game (18% less) with an average of 3 being on target (25% less) and only 5 goals scored an average of 0.83 per game yet it is alledged we are a moke attractive attacking force. We pass the ball a lot but mostly sideways and back.... So call me negative....the stats reflect what I saw Saturday and in the match day threads people were blaming the ref as we hould have had penalties and more free kicks...our style and possesion should generate resuls....as performances go it want great and beleive me being in the stadium it makles things 10 times better but I am sure if this had been last season and we were watchin ghte game at home on tv many of our opinions would not be as positive as they are!!!
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 13:44]
It’s easy that. Anyone who disagrees with him. Worse are those who keep the spats going for many years
Too many fans doing analysis, bottom line for me is did I enjoy it more than I have been. Despite the frustration "yes I did" end of conversation for me. If you want to analyse everything then get a job within football on analysis.
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 17:16]
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Negative views and match attendance on 16:49 - Sep 13 with 1679 views
Are the 'Cooperites' of 2021 the 'Monkists' of 2014-2015. Monk got some tremendous results far better than Cooper. He also lost very big players in red hot Bony and got Eder and fat Franck in return. He murmured a bit but never grumbled.
Round heads and Cavaliers. Utilitarians and the more glamorous. "non negotiable s" and "showboaters".
"Swansea city. Its the philosophy stupid". Potter loved Trundle. I doubt "Coops" had much time for him. Personally I would always prefer a bit of pazzazz. Always felt Huw should have signed Gerard Deulofeu.
Confidence, swagger, love, freedom .
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 16:57]
Wise sage since Toshack era
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Negative views and match attendance on 17:10 - Sep 13 with 1659 views
Negative views and match attendance on 16:49 - Sep 13 by ReslovenSwan1
Would I be wrong in equating
Potter to Cooper as the equivalent of
Laudrup to Monk.
Are the 'Cooperites' of 2021 the 'Monkists' of 2014-2015. Monk got some tremendous results far better than Cooper. He also lost very big players in red hot Bony and got Eder and fat Franck in return. He murmured a bit but never grumbled.
Round heads and Cavaliers. Utilitarians and the more glamorous. "non negotiable s" and "showboaters".
"Swansea city. Its the philosophy stupid". Potter loved Trundle. I doubt "Coops" had much time for him. Personally I would always prefer a bit of pazzazz. Always felt Huw should have signed Gerard Deulofeu.
Confidence, swagger, love, freedom .
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 16:57]
" Potter loved Trundle" I think you meant Celina?
Im not a Cooper ist, Potter ist Monkist Laudrup ist I am Swansea City Fan I also believe in perspective anf fairness and unbiased opinions and consisetency
By the way I was critical of Monk. as manager another of HJ's mistakes especially when HJ allowed MOnk to consign Curt to the tea room after HJ had made his famous "continuity" speech re Curt following the deaprture of MArtinez et al!!! I get frustrated that somehow it seemsthis season football is so much better.......realisitcally it seems so becasue we can be athe stadium...if we had to watch that gmae on Saturday as we did last year then the boo boys would have been out..yet the current manager is defended...for me the jury is out on Martin but he has my support...I always judge managers in results and their football not where they come from their roots, playing pedigree ....I was never that impressed by Trundle an entertainer who self promoted himself via Soccer Saturday ...he did well fo us but his limitations were proven when he left to go to Bristol #City and flopped....I always said a "low ranking PL club " would have paid £1m fo him if they thought he had what was needed at higher level but no one took the gamble...whiich also shows how we fans get rose tinted specs about players, managers et al too...Then again we are all free to have our own opinions
Negative views and match attendance on 16:26 - Sep 13 by Treforys_Jack
Too many fans doing analysis, bottom line for me is did I enjoy it more than I have been. Despite the frustration "yes I did" end of conversation for me. If you want to analyse everything then get a job within football on analysis.
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 17:16]
So you can only analyse a match if you then make it your job?
Right.
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
It's a fair question. Would love to know the answer and would certainly add to the psychology of it all.
Possibly a trait because they are unable to go so bring those who do go down to a level of unhappiness that they are familiar with. Not saying that but just a suggestion.
I would say personally and it's just my opinion that I think the OP has a good point.
Negative views and match attendance on 20:39 - Sep 13 by magicdaps10
It's a fair question. Would love to know the answer and would certainly add to the psychology of it all.
Possibly a trait because they are unable to go so bring those who do go down to a level of unhappiness that they are familiar with. Not saying that but just a suggestion.
I would say personally and it's just my opinion that I think the OP has a good point.
Yet all of the above were perceived as the bastions of positive light last season when people were getting the knives out… after being 4th. So the correlation isn’t there is it.
The OP (who sounds an awful lot like you…) is being a troll and has zero point, as you are well aware.
6th and 4th - happy fans 21st - unhappy fans
Seems perfectly logical to me.
Sadly those with a narrative to protect are trying to make out the reaction of the above is simply due to the TV playing tricks and the power of the plastic seat means they don’t have to address the points raised.
[Post edited 13 Sep 2021 21:08]
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
Negative views and match attendance on 20:39 - Sep 13 by Dr_Parnassus
How?
You literally said you see football as purely entertainment and whether you enjoyed it or not.
Far too many fans analyse the games and if they want to then they should get a job analysing football matches.
Didn’t you?
Not interested in going round and round with you as much as you'd want me to. Anyone who disagrees with you, you insult in a polite way. Football is purely a release for me and many others who judge it purely on whether they've enjoyed or not. You can produce all the stats and analysis you want, that's fine, i guess that's the FIFA generat, but ultimately its about 1 thing, was it enjoyable. Remember when Mark Gowers stats said he was the most effective midfielder in Europe.
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