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This kneeling down protest 14:07 - Sep 25 with 11872 viewsLoyal

Relevant?

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This kneeling down protest on 16:12 - Sep 27 with 439 viewsDarran

This kneeling down protest on 16:04 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

No idea. Just saw an article saying that it started about 10 years ago or whatever.

Perhaps it's that they used to play it but before the players come onto the field? I know that they pay the teams now to stand there for the anthem.


Nonsense.

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This kneeling down protest on 16:12 - Sep 27 with 439 viewsTummer_from_Texas

This kneeling down protest on 16:02 - Sep 27 by Darran

So Lisa's wrong then? 👀


The tradition goes back more than 150 years in baseball, but it was only done in special cases for many years.

It's been a standard occurrence at every sporting event at every level since WWII.
[Post edited 27 Sep 16:14]

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This kneeling down protest on 16:18 - Sep 27 with 421 viewsTummer_from_Texas

This kneeling down protest on 16:11 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

You play it a lot, that's for sure.

Lot of people fly a flag as well, I've always noticed when I am in the States. Bizarrely, the poorer the area, the more flags.

I just checked the article that I saw - it's that they used to play it before any players were on the field apparently. They get millions now to stand. Odd.


This was Super Bowl X more than 40 years ago - the players are out there.


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This kneeling down protest on 16:27 - Sep 27 with 402 viewsacejack3065

This kneeling down protest on 16:04 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

No idea. Just saw an article saying that it started about 10 years ago or whatever.

Perhaps it's that they used to play it but before the players come onto the field? I know that they pay the teams now to stand there for the anthem.


Perhaps you're thinking of the paid for military pomp before games?

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/15611052/nfl-returning-723000-taxpayers-paid-
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This kneeling down protest on 16:28 - Sep 27 with 402 viewslondonlisa2001

This kneeling down protest on 16:18 - Sep 27 by Tummer_from_Texas

This was Super Bowl X more than 40 years ago - the players are out there.



It's played at the FA Cup final as well with the teams there. That's not the point.

As I say, I am just saying I read an article that said they get paid. In fact, it appears that there was a Senate report on the practice in 2015 saying that there was a $12m contract with sports teams to generally be patriotic.

As it happens, I really don't give a stuff Tummer. My only interest in this thread is that I found the peaceful protest to be quite powerful and the bloke that has been held up as heroic by you and others, has said it was a mistake. Whether or not the anthem is played or otherwise doesn't interest me. I find enforced patriotism ridiculous whether it is the US obsession with anthems and flags or North Korea clapping their leader for a day and a half in case they get shot. From a purely musical perspective I do wish that you played your anthem properly when you do play it, rather than have some sort of third rate Whitney Houston wannabe ruining the crap out of it, but that's not my problem anyway.
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This kneeling down protest on 16:30 - Sep 27 with 397 viewslondonlisa2001

This kneeling down protest on 16:27 - Sep 27 by acejack3065

Perhaps you're thinking of the paid for military pomp before games?

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/15611052/nfl-returning-723000-taxpayers-paid-


Could be. I can't remember where I saw it, but the article referenced a senate report and also talked about payments being made to ensure that players were there for the anthem whereas they hadn't been previously (routinely I imagine, rather than for big finals etc). It was talking about why this issue was strangely obsessed about when it was relatively recent.
[Post edited 27 Sep 16:32]
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This kneeling down protest on 16:31 - Sep 27 with 396 viewsDarran

This kneeling down protest on 16:28 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

It's played at the FA Cup final as well with the teams there. That's not the point.

As I say, I am just saying I read an article that said they get paid. In fact, it appears that there was a Senate report on the practice in 2015 saying that there was a $12m contract with sports teams to generally be patriotic.

As it happens, I really don't give a stuff Tummer. My only interest in this thread is that I found the peaceful protest to be quite powerful and the bloke that has been held up as heroic by you and others, has said it was a mistake. Whether or not the anthem is played or otherwise doesn't interest me. I find enforced patriotism ridiculous whether it is the US obsession with anthems and flags or North Korea clapping their leader for a day and a half in case they get shot. From a purely musical perspective I do wish that you played your anthem properly when you do play it, rather than have some sort of third rate Whitney Houston wannabe ruining the crap out of it, but that's not my problem anyway.


You don't give a stuff? When did you decide that Lis?



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This kneeling down protest on 16:33 - Sep 27 with 393 viewslondonlisa2001

This kneeling down protest on 16:31 - Sep 27 by Darran

You don't give a stuff? When did you decide that Lis?




I don't give a stuff about their anthem Darran. I've pointed out the bits I do give a stuff about which are the bits I've posted about.

Is this a bit difficult for you to follow?
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This kneeling down protest on 16:35 - Sep 27 with 388 viewsTummer_from_Texas

This kneeling down protest on 16:28 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

It's played at the FA Cup final as well with the teams there. That's not the point.

As I say, I am just saying I read an article that said they get paid. In fact, it appears that there was a Senate report on the practice in 2015 saying that there was a $12m contract with sports teams to generally be patriotic.

As it happens, I really don't give a stuff Tummer. My only interest in this thread is that I found the peaceful protest to be quite powerful and the bloke that has been held up as heroic by you and others, has said it was a mistake. Whether or not the anthem is played or otherwise doesn't interest me. I find enforced patriotism ridiculous whether it is the US obsession with anthems and flags or North Korea clapping their leader for a day and a half in case they get shot. From a purely musical perspective I do wish that you played your anthem properly when you do play it, rather than have some sort of third rate Whitney Houston wannabe ruining the crap out of it, but that's not my problem anyway.


Nothing about our patriotism, for those who have it, is "enforced," Lisa.

And comparing the USA - where burning the flag is a LEGAL and protected right - to North Korea is pretty insulting, to put it mildly.

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This kneeling down protest on 16:37 - Sep 27 with 385 viewsDarran

This kneeling down protest on 16:33 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

I don't give a stuff about their anthem Darran. I've pointed out the bits I do give a stuff about which are the bits I've posted about.

Is this a bit difficult for you to follow?



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This kneeling down protest on 16:38 - Sep 27 with 382 viewslondonlisa2001

This is the article I was referring to.

https://sports.vice.com/en_us/article/yp89dj/stephen-a-smith-points-out-nfls-pai
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This kneeling down protest on 16:41 - Sep 27 with 376 viewsacejack3065

This kneeling down protest on 16:30 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

Could be. I can't remember where I saw it, but the article referenced a senate report and also talked about payments being made to ensure that players were there for the anthem whereas they hadn't been previously (routinely I imagine, rather than for big finals etc). It was talking about why this issue was strangely obsessed about when it was relatively recent.
[Post edited 27 Sep 16:32]


It is an odd one too IMO.

I went to a minor league baseball game as a guest a few years ago in up state New York. They treated us to free food and beer and a load of merch which was great. They gave us a load of T shirts and hats and stuff like that.

So we were all sitting there half p*ssed in these free hats and before the game everyone stands up and takes their hats off for the national anthem. We were a bit slow to react as we didn't anticipate what was about to happen but were basically death stared into doing likewise following suit. The other brit sitting next to me whispered "why are they singing the anthem? One team is from New York and the other is from Vermont"

Then about half way through the game everyone stopped and we had to do the same for "God Bless America". As grateful as I was for the great free evening, the whole charade around the anthem was highly bemusing and very strange.
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This kneeling down protest on 16:44 - Sep 27 with 369 viewslondonlisa2001

This kneeling down protest on 16:35 - Sep 27 by Tummer_from_Texas

Nothing about our patriotism, for those who have it, is "enforced," Lisa.

And comparing the USA - where burning the flag is a LEGAL and protected right - to North Korea is pretty insulting, to put it mildly.


Your president is trying to get people sacked for kneeling during the national anthem Tummer. Kids swear allegiance every day and it's not optional.

If that's not enforced patriotism then I really don't know what is.

And I was using two ends of a spectrum to make the point, not saying they were the same.
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This kneeling down protest on 16:45 - Sep 27 with 366 viewsDarran

This kneeling down protest on 16:41 - Sep 27 by acejack3065

It is an odd one too IMO.

I went to a minor league baseball game as a guest a few years ago in up state New York. They treated us to free food and beer and a load of merch which was great. They gave us a load of T shirts and hats and stuff like that.

So we were all sitting there half p*ssed in these free hats and before the game everyone stands up and takes their hats off for the national anthem. We were a bit slow to react as we didn't anticipate what was about to happen but were basically death stared into doing likewise following suit. The other brit sitting next to me whispered "why are they singing the anthem? One team is from New York and the other is from Vermont"

Then about half way through the game everyone stopped and we had to do the same for "God Bless America". As grateful as I was for the great free evening, the whole charade around the anthem was highly bemusing and very strange.


It's not odd it matters not one jot

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This kneeling down protest on 16:47 - Sep 27 with 358 viewsDarran

This kneeling down protest on 16:44 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

Your president is trying to get people sacked for kneeling during the national anthem Tummer. Kids swear allegiance every day and it's not optional.

If that's not enforced patriotism then I really don't know what is.

And I was using two ends of a spectrum to make the point, not saying they were the same.


He's not really trying though is he Lis? He said he thought they kneelers should be sacked he's not trying to pass a law in the House of Representatives to get them all fired.

You're still not giving a stuff then?

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This kneeling down protest on 16:48 - Sep 27 with 356 viewsacejack3065

This kneeling down protest on 16:45 - Sep 27 by Darran

It's not odd it matters not one jot


You don't think the flag and anthem fetishization is odd? Well I do, and everything that comes with the enforced patriotism that can often follow it.
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This kneeling down protest on 16:51 - Sep 27 with 347 viewsDarran

This kneeling down protest on 16:48 - Sep 27 by acejack3065

You don't think the flag and anthem fetishization is odd? Well I do, and everything that comes with the enforced patriotism that can often follow it.


No I don't they're very patriotic and they aren't doing anything wrong,I've never seen anyone mention it was odd under any other President it's just another silly stick to beat America with because of Trump.

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This kneeling down protest on 17:01 - Sep 27 with 337 viewslondonlisa2001

This kneeling down protest on 16:51 - Sep 27 by Darran

No I don't they're very patriotic and they aren't doing anything wrong,I've never seen anyone mention it was odd under any other President it's just another silly stick to beat America with because of Trump.


No one has said it's wrong. People have said it's odd.

Which it is.
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This kneeling down protest on 17:01 - Sep 27 with 335 viewsMo_Wives

This kneeling down protest on 16:51 - Sep 27 by Darran

No I don't they're very patriotic and they aren't doing anything wrong,I've never seen anyone mention it was odd under any other President it's just another silly stick to beat America with because of Trump.


The way I see Americans view on the flag is very much like our poppy. it's amongst other thing a symbol of their fallen soldiers.

mart6 stinks of bum.

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This kneeling down protest on 17:03 - Sep 27 with 330 viewsMo_Wives

This kneeling down protest on 17:01 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

No one has said it's wrong. People have said it's odd.

Which it is.


Do you think our remembrance day poppies are odd?

mart6 stinks of bum.

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This kneeling down protest on 17:03 - Sep 27 with 327 viewstrampie

I've been to several sporting events (different sports) in the states not involving representative national teams but with individuals from other countries taking part but they still played the American anthem only, first time it happened it came as a bit of a surprise and I said to the Welsh lady i was with 'do you think we should stand ?' she said no chance, ranting about tax dodgers and terrorists to the crown.
[Post edited 27 Sep 17:04]

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This kneeling down protest on 17:04 - Sep 27 with 323 viewsDarran

This kneeling down protest on 17:01 - Sep 27 by londonlisa2001

No one has said it's wrong. People have said it's odd.

Which it is.





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This kneeling down protest on 17:06 - Sep 27 with 315 viewsacejack3065

This kneeling down protest on 16:51 - Sep 27 by Darran

No I don't they're very patriotic and they aren't doing anything wrong,I've never seen anyone mention it was odd under any other President it's just another silly stick to beat America with because of Trump.


I never said they are doing anything wrong. Although I'm glad we don't have the government paying the premier league for military displays at swans games and standing for the anthem before every kickoff.

My experience happened when Obama was in office. It was weird then and it's weird now.
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This kneeling down protest on 17:06 - Sep 27 with 315 viewslondonlisa2001

This kneeling down protest on 16:47 - Sep 27 by Darran

He's not really trying though is he Lis? He said he thought they kneelers should be sacked he's not trying to pass a law in the House of Representatives to get them all fired.

You're still not giving a stuff then?


Again, my simple friend, you're missing the point. I don't care whether they do or don't play their anthem, when they play it, how many times, and who is supposed to listen to it, stand up, sit down or f*rt in its general direction. It's up to them. I find it weird, but I imagine they find some stuff that we do weird as well.

I do care about what their idiot president does in this and other situations. The two things are not a contradiction.
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This kneeling down protest on 17:07 - Sep 27 with 306 viewstrampie

When a Welsh team was last in the FA Cup final they insisted on the Welsh national anthem being played.

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