| Pubs 10:29 - Oct 16 with 11635 views | controversial_jack |
To be shut in Wales for a month from the 26th |  | | |  |
| Pubs on 14:59 - Oct 19 with 1021 views | Catullus |
| Pubs on 10:50 - Oct 19 by raynor94 |
Brilliant post, I'm amazed the taxman can see so much of what's going on from behind the sofa.
This next short lockdown is going to decimate the economy again, and not to mention people's mental state.
Sheer madness! |
I knind of agree with you. We need to find a better solution, we can't keep flip flopping between opened up and lockdowns.It's not curing anything but it is doing damage. Our politicians don't have the imagination or the will.
This 2 week break, the numbers will drop then we'll open up and the numbers will rise again. Now assuming I'm right, what do they do? Another lockdown? How much of the economy do they need to destroy before they realise we can't keep doing the same pointless things? | |
| |
| Pubs on 15:03 - Oct 19 with 1016 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 14:27 - Oct 19 by A_Fans_Dad |
It is interesting that both scotia & raynor appear to think it is OK to break rules & laws they disagree with.
Where does that attitude end though, drink driving, drugged driving, using the mobile while driving, not wearing seat belts, dropping litter, riding bikes on pavements, riding through red lights, excessive speeding.
All could be excused by that kind of attitude. [Post edited 19 Oct 2020 14:28]
|
The difference is that all of those rules involve putting people in danger and make complete sense.
If people in Liverpool can go for a bracing stroll along Crosby Beach why can't I do the same in Swansea?
The stay at home rule is completely nonsensical. What difference is me taking my daughter rock pooling over half term going to make to the situation? What difference would it make if the entire population of Swansea did the same? Experience would tell us very little if any.
A nuanced approach over a longer time would be far more effective surely. | | | |
| Pubs on 16:08 - Oct 19 with 973 views | Catullus |
| Pubs on 15:03 - Oct 19 by Scotia |
The difference is that all of those rules involve putting people in danger and make complete sense.
If people in Liverpool can go for a bracing stroll along Crosby Beach why can't I do the same in Swansea?
The stay at home rule is completely nonsensical. What difference is me taking my daughter rock pooling over half term going to make to the situation? What difference would it make if the entire population of Swansea did the same? Experience would tell us very little if any.
A nuanced approach over a longer time would be far more effective surely. |
The nuanced appraoch over a longer term is what I'd support. Try to keep as much business open as possible but come down hard on rule breakers.
Look at what he's done with secondary schools, years 7 and 8 are still going but 9,10 and 11 are not (for the 2 weeks) but what difference will that make in houses where there are 2 or more kids at the school, one is in 7 or 8 the other/s are in higher age groups. They'll mix at home anyway.
Then, those kids will be in school together but cannot meet up at the park. | |
| |
| Pubs on 16:11 - Oct 19 with 970 views | onehunglow |
Yep,a start with non mask wearers at shops.Simply refuse entry and /or refuse to serve.Treat the same as challenging alcohol sales
Its not hard and yet we have failed .
Johnson actually said staff couldnt or shouldnt do it..
Anyone serving a non wearing mask should face prosecution as they would serving an under age punter. | |
| |
| Pubs on 16:17 - Oct 19 with 961 views | controversial_jack |
| Pubs on 14:59 - Oct 19 by Catullus |
I knind of agree with you. We need to find a better solution, we can't keep flip flopping between opened up and lockdowns.It's not curing anything but it is doing damage. Our politicians don't have the imagination or the will.
This 2 week break, the numbers will drop then we'll open up and the numbers will rise again. Now assuming I'm right, what do they do? Another lockdown? How much of the economy do they need to destroy before they realise we can't keep doing the same pointless things? |
It's giving the NHS and it's staff a break and the ability to cope. | | | |
| Pubs on 16:20 - Oct 19 with 956 views | onehunglow |
Indeed contro.It is. If we totally went down the pier Corby rote ,the NHS would be bust within 3 months. | |
| |
| Pubs on 16:22 - Oct 19 with 956 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 14:59 - Oct 19 by Catullus |
I knind of agree with you. We need to find a better solution, we can't keep flip flopping between opened up and lockdowns.It's not curing anything but it is doing damage. Our politicians don't have the imagination or the will.
This 2 week break, the numbers will drop then we'll open up and the numbers will rise again. Now assuming I'm right, what do they do? Another lockdown? How much of the economy do they need to destroy before they realise we can't keep doing the same pointless things? |
We should be looking at what actually works and where it spreads. The countries that locked down have very few cases and deaths and those that havent have large figures. The increase started when people came back from overseas and pubs opened indoors. It has continued with students going to universities and living in Halls of Residence and Houses of Multiple Occupancy. This had been predicted and could have been prevented to this degree. Take the student village at Hendrefoilan. There are 686 rooms there in houses of 7 bedrooms. Each house has a shared kitchen with a shared bathroom and shower/toilet. If one comes with the virus from elsewhere it is likely to spread to others. To prevent that we needed to keep our figures at rock bottom level. On 2 days in August we had 5 and 8 cases in Wales. It was decided to open pubs indoors and Johnson had opened our borders. Since that time the increase began. It has got higher since as students returned mainly from areas with higher amounts. People go on about the wearing of masks. They havent prevented the increase. On 15 September when masks were made compulsory in Wales there wasnt any cases in Swansea Bay. A month after masks were made compulsory there was 127 New Cases in Swansea Bay. | | | |
Login to get fewer ads
| Pubs on 19:09 - Oct 19 with 882 views | A_Fans_Dad |
I had a conversation with a Czech an another forum.
Basically he said they got fed up with masks and have had a lovely summer without restraints.
He seemed to think it was worth it, but then of course he hasn't got COVID.
Their numbers are still pretty low compared to the rest of Europe, but aweful compared to their first wave. | | | |
| Pubs on 00:31 - Oct 20 with 842 views | controversial_jack |
| Pubs on 19:09 - Oct 19 by A_Fans_Dad |
I had a conversation with a Czech an another forum.
Basically he said they got fed up with masks and have had a lovely summer without restraints.
He seemed to think it was worth it, but then of course he hasn't got COVID.
Their numbers are still pretty low compared to the rest of Europe, but aweful compared to their first wave. |
Given that their population is only about 10 million they are getting loads. | | | |
| Pubs on 09:15 - Oct 20 with 793 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 16:22 - Oct 19 by exhmrc1 |
We should be looking at what actually works and where it spreads. The countries that locked down have very few cases and deaths and those that havent have large figures. The increase started when people came back from overseas and pubs opened indoors. It has continued with students going to universities and living in Halls of Residence and Houses of Multiple Occupancy. This had been predicted and could have been prevented to this degree. Take the student village at Hendrefoilan. There are 686 rooms there in houses of 7 bedrooms. Each house has a shared kitchen with a shared bathroom and shower/toilet. If one comes with the virus from elsewhere it is likely to spread to others. To prevent that we needed to keep our figures at rock bottom level. On 2 days in August we had 5 and 8 cases in Wales. It was decided to open pubs indoors and Johnson had opened our borders. Since that time the increase began. It has got higher since as students returned mainly from areas with higher amounts. People go on about the wearing of masks. They havent prevented the increase. On 15 September when masks were made compulsory in Wales there wasnt any cases in Swansea Bay. A month after masks were made compulsory there was 127 New Cases in Swansea Bay. |
For closing borders to have had an effect we would had to have done so in early March and quarantined 10's of thousands of Brits coming back from Spain, Italy and France before we knew there were outbreaks in those countries. I don't get your correlation between cases and masks - but there we are.
Pubs have contributed but don't forget in Wales they were allowed to open with no guidance and no enforcement.
You are completely correct about uni's and the way students live. It is very similar to multi generational houses in the Asian community of the NW and exactly the same happened there. So you think that Mark Drakeford would have announced something about this yesterday? Like quarantining student accommodation for a couple of weeks or moving back to total online learning. Did he do this? No.
I can't see cases in Uni's decreasing over this fortnight.
We couldn't stop students coming back to universities they are probably the biggest employer after the local authority in most University towns, but thought should have been given as to doing it safely. Plus of course Uni's are pretty important in beating this disease.
Instead the entire population of Wales has to stay home when he has previously said going to the beach doesn't lead to an increase in cases, shops will shut even though they seem to have virtually no impact similarly with gyms and leisure centres. A complete lockdown for two weeks makes no sense. | | | |
| Pubs on 10:15 - Oct 20 with 781 views | onehunglow |
No Guidance?
Well,if people have to be guided or advised to simply avoid close contact with strangers ,wash hands and wear a mask then it shows how dumb we are. | |
| |
| Pubs on 10:30 - Oct 20 with 773 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 09:15 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
For closing borders to have had an effect we would had to have done so in early March and quarantined 10's of thousands of Brits coming back from Spain, Italy and France before we knew there were outbreaks in those countries. I don't get your correlation between cases and masks - but there we are.
Pubs have contributed but don't forget in Wales they were allowed to open with no guidance and no enforcement.
You are completely correct about uni's and the way students live. It is very similar to multi generational houses in the Asian community of the NW and exactly the same happened there. So you think that Mark Drakeford would have announced something about this yesterday? Like quarantining student accommodation for a couple of weeks or moving back to total online learning. Did he do this? No.
I can't see cases in Uni's decreasing over this fortnight.
We couldn't stop students coming back to universities they are probably the biggest employer after the local authority in most University towns, but thought should have been given as to doing it safely. Plus of course Uni's are pretty important in beating this disease.
Instead the entire population of Wales has to stay home when he has previously said going to the beach doesn't lead to an increase in cases, shops will shut even though they seem to have virtually no impact similarly with gyms and leisure centres. A complete lockdown for two weeks makes no sense. |
The increase is definitely slowing down. Yesterday there was 626 new cases in Wales. 2 weeks previously there was 596 an increase of 30 over 2 weeks. A fortnight before there was 234. An increase of 366 over 2 weeks. The previous fortnight showed 133. An increase of 101 over lesser figures. The earliest period was before students went back so cannot be blamed on students and only some of the second period was down to students.
The bottom line is that when figures were rock bottom they needed to be kept at that level. Instead the opening of Air Bridges and Pubs increased the virus in circulation. Had this not happened then there wouldnt have been anything like the levels there are today but you opposed that then stating the figures can be controlled. It has been proven here and elsewhere that isnt the case. The cases that have kept borders close have only a fraction of the deaths those that kept them opened have had.
We really need to learn lessons of how to deal with this virus from elsewhere in the world otherwise we will be back in lockdowns regularly and our hospitals will end up full of coronavirus patients meaning other illnesses wont be able to be treated. Trying to protect businesses will lead to this. | | | |
| Pubs on 10:56 - Oct 20 with 770 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 10:15 - Oct 20 by onehunglow |
No Guidance?
Well,if people have to be guided or advised to simply avoid close contact with strangers ,wash hands and wear a mask then it shows how dumb we are. |
Yes no guidance.
The problem is in England Boris announced guidance regarding 1m+ social distancing in pubs. In my opinion it should have been 2m, he did this to satisfy the industry.
In Wales pubs had no guidance as to how to distance customers, neither did gyms. They were left to their own devices. Of course some were very safe others just cracked on as normal, it has taken until the last couple of weeks for any significant enforcement action. | | | |
| Pubs on 11:25 - Oct 20 with 753 views | controversial_jack |
| Pubs on 10:15 - Oct 20 by onehunglow |
No Guidance?
Well,if people have to be guided or advised to simply avoid close contact with strangers ,wash hands and wear a mask then it shows how dumb we are. |
I haven't been to a pub since February, but i'm told many just didn't bother with any rules | | | |
| Pubs on 11:34 - Oct 20 with 747 views | onehunglow |
Sorry,you lost me at Johnson. Here is a guy that passes law but says they wont be enforced relying instead on our "common sense".
After lockdown last time,I needed no guidance from anyone a I treated all with suspicion they might be a carrier. Not perfect granted but it seems a good way.
It s like wearing masks and washing hands. Many do not out of choice and not just gary lineker | |
| |
| Pubs on 11:39 - Oct 20 with 747 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 10:56 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
Yes no guidance.
The problem is in England Boris announced guidance regarding 1m+ social distancing in pubs. In my opinion it should have been 2m, he did this to satisfy the industry.
In Wales pubs had no guidance as to how to distance customers, neither did gyms. They were left to their own devices. Of course some were very safe others just cracked on as normal, it has taken until the last couple of weeks for any significant enforcement action. |
The 2m rule was in place for everyone in Wales. Me, you and everyone else knew that. It didnt need Drakeford to specifically spell it out to pubs or gyms. The problem is Johnson muddied the water by bringing in his 1m plus rule telling people to use masks. The reality is the 2m rule is far safer than 1m with masks. If landlords etc dont understand the 2m rule applied in Wales most of the public did.
The real problem is that landlords wouldnt know if I walked in with your wife or vice versa whether we are from the same households. People are still sitting together within 2m. One of my neighbours was going down the pub with this mate in the same car. There is nothing landlords can really do. The nature of pubs makes it impossible for them to be safe and it isnt really possible to differentiate between food and non food pubs. Does eating crisps mean they are food pubs. What about Bacon rolls or say warm pies
pasties or Sausage Rolls. What about chips or microwave food. Where does the line get drawn. | | | |
| Pubs on 11:49 - Oct 20 with 745 views | controversial_jack |
| Pubs on 11:39 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
The 2m rule was in place for everyone in Wales. Me, you and everyone else knew that. It didnt need Drakeford to specifically spell it out to pubs or gyms. The problem is Johnson muddied the water by bringing in his 1m plus rule telling people to use masks. The reality is the 2m rule is far safer than 1m with masks. If landlords etc dont understand the 2m rule applied in Wales most of the public did.
The real problem is that landlords wouldnt know if I walked in with your wife or vice versa whether we are from the same households. People are still sitting together within 2m. One of my neighbours was going down the pub with this mate in the same car. There is nothing landlords can really do. The nature of pubs makes it impossible for them to be safe and it isnt really possible to differentiate between food and non food pubs. Does eating crisps mean they are food pubs. What about Bacon rolls or say warm pies
pasties or Sausage Rolls. What about chips or microwave food. Where does the line get drawn. |
The rules were really quite simple and they haven't changed. Keep your distance, wear a mask and keep good hygiene. Three pieces of advice to follow that any child could understand.
I don't understand why people can't or don't want to follow these rules to protect themselves, others and the vulnerable.
Drakeford has given the public a warning, if the public don't comply then there will be harsher restrictions, and Christmas is getting near too | | | |
| Pubs on 12:14 - Oct 20 with 729 views | exhmrc1 |
On 1 May Wales had 160 cases, 1 June 59 cases, 1 July 32 cases, 1 August 21 cases, 12 August 8 cases. As can be seen cases going down with no face masks being worn.
Pubs opened 3 August Gyms 10 August people returning from abroad. 18 August 24 cases, 1 September 51 cases schools return. 19 September students start moving back 212 cases, 1 October 398 cases, 18 October 950 cases.
It is absolutely clear that the figures went down until pubs and borders reopened and has continued since through the added effect on schools and students. The numbers in schools were influenced by children and parents returning from abroad. | | | |
| Pubs on 13:24 - Oct 20 with 706 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 11:39 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
The 2m rule was in place for everyone in Wales. Me, you and everyone else knew that. It didnt need Drakeford to specifically spell it out to pubs or gyms. The problem is Johnson muddied the water by bringing in his 1m plus rule telling people to use masks. The reality is the 2m rule is far safer than 1m with masks. If landlords etc dont understand the 2m rule applied in Wales most of the public did.
The real problem is that landlords wouldnt know if I walked in with your wife or vice versa whether we are from the same households. People are still sitting together within 2m. One of my neighbours was going down the pub with this mate in the same car. There is nothing landlords can really do. The nature of pubs makes it impossible for them to be safe and it isnt really possible to differentiate between food and non food pubs. Does eating crisps mean they are food pubs. What about Bacon rolls or say warm pies
pasties or Sausage Rolls. What about chips or microwave food. Where does the line get drawn. |
Well they saw fit to publish guidance towards the end of August?
Business people will try to make money, especially if they have been closed for months. Also if there is no enforcement there is no deterrent.
The second paragraph sounds like the kind of thing that would make good and enforceable legislation. Pubs can be safe, anywhere can be safe.
There is nothing in that post that couldn't be done. It should have been done. You're making excuses for Drakeford. No wonder Wales has been ruled by the same party since devolution. | | | |
| Pubs on 13:29 - Oct 20 with 703 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 12:14 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
On 1 May Wales had 160 cases, 1 June 59 cases, 1 July 32 cases, 1 August 21 cases, 12 August 8 cases. As can be seen cases going down with no face masks being worn.
Pubs opened 3 August Gyms 10 August people returning from abroad. 18 August 24 cases, 1 September 51 cases schools return. 19 September students start moving back 212 cases, 1 October 398 cases, 18 October 950 cases.
It is absolutely clear that the figures went down until pubs and borders reopened and has continued since through the added effect on schools and students. The numbers in schools were influenced by children and parents returning from abroad. |
So are you suggesting we should have completely closed our borders since March, kept pubs and restaurants closed since March, kept schools closed since March and not let students return to university this autumn?
If this is the case would you forego, say 30%, of your pension to subsidise those not working? | | | |
| Pubs on 13:46 - Oct 20 with 697 views | pikeypaul |
The left wing propaganda camps masking as Universities should be closed down until a vaccine is found.
It’s now been shown and proved how incompetent the medical scientists that populate these camps are and how they steal a living, so hopefully a culling of these useless dicks is also on the cards.Huge financial cuts will need to be taken in future years and not a better place to start than with these charlatans pocketing a fortune of our money.
They should have concentrated on medical science for which we pay them and not pushing their Marxist propaganda to the young and impressionable.
OUT
AFLI
[Post edited 20 Oct 2020 13:47]
|  |
| |
| Pubs on 14:23 - Oct 20 with 683 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 13:29 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
So are you suggesting we should have completely closed our borders since March, kept pubs and restaurants closed since March, kept schools closed since March and not let students return to university this autumn?
If this is the case would you forego, say 30%, of your pension to subsidise those not working? |
No got it wrong the 2 key areas are pubs and borders. When schools opened in June the figures when down. When pubs opened out doors figures went down. When tourist attractions opened figures went down. When shops opened figures went down. Things that are safe to open you leave open. Things that cant have to close. You have wanted to keep open pubs, gyms and more especially our borders claiming the figures could be kept down. The fact is the virus has rocketed because of it. If we have this lock down it will hopefully reduce things for a while but if we do what you want in 2 months time we will be back in another lockdown. 2 and 1/2 months after the decisions were made that you wanted we are back in the same mess we were in March. There are 2 choices you close what needs to be kept closed and allow other things to continue or you do as Andy suggests and let it run its course with loads dying and people not able to get things like cancer and heart treatments because the NHS is overwhelmed. Your system hasnt worked, was never going to work and will cause the same problem again and again with constant lockdowns. | | | |
| Pubs on 14:27 - Oct 20 with 680 views | onehunglow |
If hospitals are full of covid then cancer treatments suffer.
Therefore ,cut the covid admissions | |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
